Fuck the Republican Party.

[TomAz]

Couldn't that logic be applied to numerous professions though? Seems like there must be millions of examples of people starting their own businesses without any formal education and learning on the job. To me, "trade" always implied some kind of manual labor or construction.

This whole conversation started with grannock saying college was worthless, and I said a BA was a minimum requirements for virtually all quality (non-menial) jobs these days, because of the shift in the economy, etc etc etc, and i specifically excluded 'the trades' from this characterization. Then Randy chimed in about what he does, and I said ok, to me that's part of my "the trades" exception, but people seemed to think that was a denegration when it wasn't. Anyway, starting your own company is really not the same thing as trying to get a job, so we've gone way off track here.

So I will stick to my guns but soften my wording to placate the panties-in-a-bunch set: A college education significantly enhances one's ability to get a decent job with a decent career trajectory, and in many fields it is a minimum requirement, though there certainly are exceptions like the trades and entrepreneurship and whatever you want to call the guys who work on your network server.

[jackstraw94086]

Just as long as when someone tells you they "work in IT" you don't assume they must have attained their training for an institution that advertises on late night basic cable. There are a lot of business skills involved in it these days.

Since technology permeates just about every aspect of professional and social life these days the term is obsolete, but we're at a point where most lay folks don't realize that yet.

It's like you're calling all types of EDM "techno" (I realize that analogy is happily worthless to you though).

[TomAz]

Even I know the difference between techno and dubstep. duh.

[jackstraw94086]

Even I know the difference between techno and dubstep. duh.

I'm going to quiz you on the difference between trap and moombahton.


but my point (should have been) that the term EDM is analogous to IT. "EDM" was once descriptive since there wasn't a whole lot of music that could be made with machines alone. Now that most popular music is made with varying amounts of computer generated music and that music is increasingly varied, the term has lost meaning.

[arsgunner]

Even I know the difference between techno and dubstep. duh.

both are shitty just like republicans

[SlowMotionApocalypse]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trail_of_Tears

"We as Choctaws rather chose to suffer and be free, than live under the degrading influence of laws, which our voice could not be heard in their formation." - George W. Harkins

[VigoTheCarpathian]

Why?

[RotationSlimWang]

This whole conversation started with grannock saying college was worthless, and I said a BA was a minimum requirements for virtually all quality (non-menial) jobs these days, because of the shift in the economy, etc etc etc, and i specifically excluded 'the trades' from this characterization. Then Randy chimed in about what he does, and I said ok, to me that's part of my "the trades" exception, but people seemed to think that was a denegration when it wasn't. Anyway, starting your own company is really not the same thing as trying to get a job, so we've gone way off track here.

So I will stick to my guns but soften my wording to placate the panties-in-a-bunch set: A college education significantly enhances one's ability to get a decent job with a decent career trajectory, and in many fields it is a minimum requirement, though there certainly are exceptions like the trades and entrepreneurship and whatever you want to call the guys who work on your network server.

It feels to me like the distinction that you're making is that a "profession" is something you literally CAN'T do without a degree (doctor, lawyer, certain other positions) and anything else is a trade. I mean, Bill Gates is a tradesman? Mark Zuckerburg?

You can isolate it to just what I do and call it a trade I guess, and it's not that I'm taking offense (okay, maybe a little) but I don't see how, say, computer programming is a "trade." Like, fucking seriously. Inventing software is a trade?

[SlowMotionApocalypse]

Welcome to the projects

http://www.courts.ca.gov/opinions/nonpub/B232030.PDF

[TomAz]

Borowitz:

WASHINGTON (The Borowitz Report)—Official Washington was in celebration mode on New Year’s Day after kind of averting a completely unnecessary crisis that was entirely of its own creation.

“This deal proves that if we all procrastinate long and hard enough, we can semi-solve any self-inflicted problem at the very last minute in a way that satisfies no one,” said Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Kentucky).


But even as Sen. McConnell basked in self-congratulation, he warned Congress against the complacency that could come with having sort of fixed its own completely avoidable mess.

“This is a new year, and much work remains to be done,” he said. “It’s up to us to concoct entirely new optional disasters that we will have to undo at some later date in a more or less half-assed way.”

In a related story, an arsonist received an award for putting out his own fire.


Read more: http://www.newyorker.com/online/blog...#ixzz2Gpc2JwqJ

[Miroir Noir]

[TomAz]

Man I sure am glad they extended the Oscars voting!

[Zafocaine]

It feels to me like the distinction that you're making is that a "profession" is something you literally CAN'T do without a degree (doctor, lawyer, certain other positions) and anything else is a trade. I mean, Bill Gates is a tradesman? Mark Zuckerburg?

You can isolate it to just what I do and call it a trade I guess, and it's not that I'm taking offense (okay, maybe a little) but I don't see how, say, computer programming is a "trade." Like, fucking seriously. Inventing software is a trade?

It's not like you can go to a trade school and become a computer programmer... oh wait... you can? Well I'll be....

[Miroir Noir]

One of the worst lasting legacies of 9/11 -- perhaps exceeded only by our decade-long series of quagmires in various middle eastern nations -- is the proliferation of the cable news crawl.

[chairmenmeow47]

One of the worst lasting legacies of 9/11 -- perhaps exceeded only by our decade-long series of quagmires in various middle eastern nations -- is the proliferation of the cable news crawl.

amen, on some stations i feel like i'm about to go into a seizure.

and i'm bummed we couldn't keep the payroll tax cut.

[Miroir Noir]

Agreed. Disappointing and revealing that the one thing that there was widespread bipartisan agreement over was the idea that we should terminate the one truly stimulative, progressive tax break.

[PlayaDelWes]

Isn’t the payroll tax directed towards Social Security and Medicare? And more of a savings contribution towards the future than a true tax used for general use?

[chairmenmeow47]

i don't know. i guess i've just always assumed social security will be gone by the time i would be eligible.

[heart cooks brain]

i never expect a dime from social seurity. i'm more than fine paying payroll tax so my grandma can eat food.

[Miroir Noir]

Yes, the Social Security/Medicare funding aspect of the payroll tax cut would have been alarming but for the fact that Congress maintained funding levels for the programs through other revenue streams.

[Miroir Noir]

Oh and by the way, if we do absolutely nothing, Social Security is 100% solvent for like the next thirty years. Anyone who is preaching an impeding Social Security crisis is selling you something, most likely a scheme to hand over Social Security to Wall Street.

[PlayaDelWes]

Yes, the Social Security/Medicare funding aspect of the payroll tax cut would have been alarming but for the fact that Congress maintained funding levels for the programs through other revenue streams.

I did not know that. For the last two years, how did they fund the 'holiday'? And now that it's over, what is that funding source going towards?

*edit: Nevermind, it was financed by debt. I guess if you're the type that considers debt an 'other revenue stream', that's cool.

[heart cooks brain]

sure.

it's at least 38 years away from me at this point. if some gets shipped my way the happy times. if not, and i'm destitute because of it, then i fucked up.

[Miroir Noir]

Here's the other thing about Social Security: when I say 100% solvent, that doesn't mean that thirty years from now, the program goes bankrupt. It means that unless policy changes are enacted, it will begin to start paying less benefits than are currently promised. So instead of 100% of your promised benefit, you may get 80%. A problem, no doubt. But a very long term one that is far from catastrophic and eminently solvable. Especially without doing something dumb, like changing a defined social insurance benefit into a public 401k system.

The right wingers and deficit scolds are right that we do need to do something about Medicare, but they're off in their diagnosis of the problem. That impending crisis is being driven more by skyrocketing medical costs, less with any design flaw in the system.

[TomAz]

Anyone who is preaching an impeding Social Security crisis is selling you something, most likely a scheme to hand over Social Security to Wall Street.

This has been happening, on-again off-again, for pretty much my entire adult lifetime.

[Miroir Noir]

I did not know that. For the last two years, how did they fund the 'holiday'? And now that it's over, what is that funding source going towards?

Payments from the general fund to Social Security and Medicare. The new "savings" are essentially being counted as deficit relief in the fiscal cliff deal.

[Miroir Noir]

*edit: Nevermind, it was financed by debt. I guess if you're the type that considers debt an 'other revenue stream', that's cool.

So are the continued tax cuts for income between $250K and $400K and the continued evisceration of most of the estate tax not also technically financed by debt? And are they nearly as stimulative or progressive as the payroll tax cut?

That's the issue for me.

[PlayaDelWes]

So are the continued tax cuts for income between $250K and $400K and the continued evisceration of most of the estate tax not also technically financed by debt? And are they nearly as stimulative or progressive as the payroll tax cut?

That's the issue for me.

Not just for the range you called out, but any continued break or deduction is naturally going to limit tax revenues. And for expenditures that can’t be funded by that income, of course you need to draw from debt to cover the deficit.I just find it alarming that the mindset of some is to consider debt as income. That’s all.

[jackstraw94086]

It is in fact an income stream. It's just not revenues. It's all a shell game anyway. You can assign that debt to cover something else if you wish.

[Miroir Noir]

Fuck the Democratic Party, too: http://washingtonexaminer.com/tim-ca...7#.UOW24uQ8B8G