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  1. #19861
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    Default Re: The Default Thread

    Yeah, that's not an agreement I've ever made with anyone. People get pissed off about a picture yet have no interest in reading the article. It's an interesting view into how a kid became radicalized.
    Quote Originally Posted by canexplain View Post
    Remember Hitler? I don't but here we are again .. cr****

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    I know most of the local press here wouldn't even publish the names of Holmes after the Aurora Shootings. Let's see: 10 years from now. "Man arrested for killing 10 people. Sorry as usual there won't be any details because we don't want to offend our customers. Just take our word he was a monster so no one cares." Grrrrr ... I still am dizzy so I better shut up .. ... cr****

    I only "read" RS for the pic's anyway just for a bit of urban dichotomy....
    Last edited by canexplain; 07-18-2013 at 11:38 AM.
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  3. #19863
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    Well, the most prominent item I remember is this clip being shared around after Newtown. If memory serves correct I saw it on the forums I frequent, not Facebook. Forget if anyone posted it here.

    Quote Originally Posted by TomAz View Post
    Hey here's an idea. You know those people who are desperately poor, down on their luck, uneducated, abused, and generally ill-equipped for life? Let's make fun of them.

  4. #19864
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    Quote Originally Posted by bmack86 View Post
    how a kid became radicalized.
    Which is really the conversation we need to be having if we are going to prevent further crimes of the sort.
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  5. #19865
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    "BUT HE'S SEXY AND MY PANTS STIR AND THAT'S NOT OKAY BECAUSE TERRORIST! STOP TEMPTING ME!!!"

    The article actually had quotes from experts stating that deep destabilizing events, such as going to a non-desirable college, his parents divorce, their subsequent move back to Dagestan and the resultant loss of not only the family structure but also the friend structure that existed in high school, is a trademark of radicalized youth in the US. Raise your hand if you're surprised that someone placed in a deeply disorienting set of circumstances and with nowhere strong to turn might turn to less-than-savory assistance, especially when his only family is that influence.

    It's a decent article. People should read it.
    Quote Originally Posted by canexplain View Post
    Remember Hitler? I don't but here we are again .. cr****

  6. #19866
    Peaceful Oasis TomAz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xuclarockerx View Post
    After a mass shooting there's plenty of agreement that the perpetrators/suspects should not be featured prominently in the media.
    This may be the single dumbest thing you've ever posted. And you've posted plenty of dumb shit. Please reflect on the words "should not be" as used in your sentence, and compare and contrast to the values of independence, liberty, and freedom that presumably underlie the core of American culture.

  7. #19867
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    Default Re: The Default Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by bmack86 View Post
    "BUT HE'S SEXY AND MY PANTS STIR AND THAT'S NOT OKAY BECAUSE TERRORIST! STOP TEMPTING ME!!!"

    The article actually had quotes from experts stating that deep destabilizing events, such as going to a non-desirable college, his parents divorce, their subsequent move back to Dagestan and the resultant loss of not only the family structure but also the friend structure that existed in high school, is a trademark of radicalized youth in the US. Raise your hand if you're surprised that someone placed in a deeply disorienting set of circumstances and with nowhere strong to turn might turn to less-than-savory assistance, especially when his only family is that influence.

    It's a decent article. People should read it.
    I plan on reading the article. I'm disappointed that the public at large is not able to, even a tiny bit, recognize the purposeful irony behind using a picture like that. It's obviously a bit of a commentary on the idea that mass murderers and other criminals do become celebrities and are in fact glamorized to some extent in our society, as well as the fact that this was a totally normal person who led a normal life and had normal friends and functioned normally in our society before he did what he did.
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  8. #19868
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    Default Re: The Default Thread

    Drinkey, please explain how the picture is in any way ironic.
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  9. #19869
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    Default Re: The Default Thread

    It shows that profiling is total bullshit. cr****
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  10. #19870
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    Quote Originally Posted by TomAz View Post
    Hey here's an idea. You know those people who are desperately poor, down on their luck, uneducated, abused, and generally ill-equipped for life? Let's make fun of them.

  11. #19871
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    Anyone watching the SciFi channel "Destiny" knows that some will become alien racist in the far future. I think the alien human lesbian scenes are pretty racy so I wouldn't care I guess.... What I don't agree about that program is if we don't end the world b4, we will all be the same color eons from now. cr****
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  12. #19872
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    Default Re: The Default Thread

    ... HUH?
    Quote Originally Posted by schoolofruckus View Post
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  13. #19873
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    Quote Originally Posted by thelastgreatman View Post
    ... HUH?
    If you don't know the show, that would make no sense...cr****
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  14. #19874
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    Default Re: The Default Thread

    I want to know more about what you don't agree about regarding people's colors.
    Quote Originally Posted by schoolofruckus View Post
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  15. #19875
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    Quote Originally Posted by thelastgreatman View Post
    I want to know more about what you don't agree about regarding people's colors.
    In the story line there are still "pure" races. On Earth anyway, we are becoming more homogenous and that will only keep happening. Simple science I think. cr****
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  16. #19876
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    Default Re: The Default Thread

    Janet Reitman is totally stoked right now.

  17. #19877

    Default Re: The Default Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by bmack86 View Post
    Yeah, that's not an agreement I've ever made with anyone. People get pissed off about a picture yet have no interest in reading the article. It's an interesting view into how a kid became radicalized.
    I don't know if it's that interesting to focus on Jahar though, because the question raised by this and other articles is if Tamerlan didn't become radicalized, would Jahar have become radicalized?

    Perhaps Rolling Stone wanted Jahar on the cover speicifcally because it offers the chance to use the photo and build a story that contrasts Jahar's looks and popularity with his current status as a "monster"...but it seems like any story of Jahar needs to start with Tamerlan.

    And the starting point for that seems to be the path that Tamerlan (and Zubeidat) took towards Islam: "Tamerlan had discovered religion, a passion that had begun in 2009. In interviews, Zubeidat has suggested it was her idea, a way to encourage Tamerlan, who spent his off-hours partying with his friends at local clubs, to become more serious."

    Which may or may not have been influenced by Tamerlan personal problems: "Anna, who wondered if Tamerlan might be developing a mental illness, suggested Zubeidat take him to a "doctor" ("If I said 'psychiatrist,' she'd just flip," she says), but Zubeidat seems to have believed that Islam would help calm Tamerlan's demons."

    And that path towards Islam may have contributed to their family problems: "Anzor, who'd been at first baffled, and later "depressed," by his wife's and son's religiosity, moved back to Russia in 2011, and that summer was granted a divorce."

  18. #19878
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    Default Re: The Default Thread

    Fuck Detroit files for bankruptcy. cr****

    http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-...or-bankruptcy/
    Last edited by canexplain; 07-18-2013 at 03:20 PM.
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  19. #19879
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    Quote Originally Posted by canexplain View Post
    In the story line there are still "pure" races. On Earth anyway, we are becoming more homogenous and that will only keep happening. Simple science I think. cr****
    You realize that mixing races actually creates MORE variation, not less, right?
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  20. #19880
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    Quote Originally Posted by thelastgreatman View Post
    You realize that mixing races actually creates MORE variation, not less, right?
    Maybe I should say less distinct. Joke on network tv last night. "I deal with all the people of a rainbow. That leaves out black and white" I think I told that right ... cr****
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  21. #19881
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    Quote Originally Posted by Listening View Post
    I don't know if it's that interesting to focus on Jahar though, because the question raised by this and other articles is if Tamerlan didn't become radicalized, would Jahar have become radicalized?

    Perhaps Rolling Stone wanted Jahar on the cover speicifcally because it offers the chance to use the photo and build a story that contrasts Jahar's looks and popularity with his current status as a "monster"...but it seems like any story of Jahar needs to start with Tamerlan.

    Really? Come on, man. They focused on his radicalization because he was very close to what we consider a "typical American teenager." School, sports, girls, social media, cars, smoking dope. Obviously his brother's adoption of radical Islamic beliefs was the catalyst, but Jahar seems to have been much more immersed and tuned into American culture than his brother ever was or could be. Watching & understanding how that transition occurred is of far more value than is examining a line of what-ifs about his brother or his parents. We know how he became radicalized (his brother), this is an examination of how it actually transpired.

    And they used that specific photo for the reasons Drinkey mentioned above.
    Quote Originally Posted by thelastgreatman View Post
    No Taj Mahal or Ry Cooder? Fuck this thread.

  22. #19882
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    When my husband's parents got divorced, he just impregnated and married me. He didn't blow up a bunch of runners.
    Quote Originally Posted by RandyInHeaven View Post
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  23. #19883
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    Quote Originally Posted by amyzzz View Post
    When my husband's parents got divorced, he just impregnated and married me. He didn't blow up a bunch of runners.
    Yet
    Wow, 12 step meetings at Coachella, who knew? SOBERCHELLA.COM

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  24. #19884
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    And he was a Mormon. He had more of a reason.
    Quote Originally Posted by RandyInHeaven View Post
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  25. #19885
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    He should have blown up other Mormons.
    Quote Originally Posted by thelastgreatman View Post
    No Taj Mahal or Ry Cooder? Fuck this thread.

  26. #19886
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    Quote Originally Posted by amyzzz View Post
    When my husband's parents got divorced, he just impregnated and married me. He didn't blow up a bunch of runners.
    ... I think if given the choice, I'd have an easier time living with myself known as a bomber.
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  27. #19887
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    Nice!
    Quote Originally Posted by RandyInHeaven View Post
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  28. #19888
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    Hey people.. im gonna spam a few threads asking if you'll take our (goldenvoice) short concert related survey. Thanks so much!
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  29. #19889
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    Done. #1 was a problem due to living in a fly over state.
    Also, reported as spam.
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  30. #19890

    Default Re: The Default Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by greghead View Post
    Really? Come on, man. They focused on his radicalization because he was very close to what we consider a "typical American teenager." School, sports, girls, social media, cars, smoking dope. Obviously his brother's adoption of radical Islamic beliefs was the catalyst, but Jahar seems to have been much more immersed and tuned into American culture than his brother ever was or could be. Watching & understanding how that transition occurred is of far more value than is examining a line of what-ifs about his brother or his parents. We know how he became radicalized (his brother), this is an examination of how it actually transpired.

    And they used that specific photo for the reasons Drinkey mentioned above.
    But what's so interesting about his radicalization if it doesn't happen independently of his brother's, and in fact, was likely a product of it?

    The article doesn't even talk that much about Jahar's radicalization.

    It talks about an older brothers status in their culture, about Jahar missing his father and his mother leaving the country, and some personal problems like failing grades and debt...and how many of his school friends (other than I think, a Muslim one) didn't go to his house or know much about his family (other than stories of Tamerlan).

    The "jihadification" part of the article is mainly about his brother...and in that part, it seems pretty lacking...it doesn't talk that much about Tamerlan's 2012 trip, which others have pointed to as a significant part of his radicalization:

    "Tamerlan's journey the past two years is far easier to trace. Though no more Chechen than his brother, Tamerlan was also – as his resident green card reminded him – not really an American. Islam, or Tamerlan's interpretation of it, had become his identity. He devoured books on Chechnya's separatist struggle, a war that had taken on a notably fundamentalist tone since the late 1990s, thanks to a surge of Muslim fighters from outside of the Caucusus who flocked to Chechnya to wage "holy war" against the Russians. It is not uncommon for young Chechen men to romanticize jihad, and for those who are interested in that kind of thing, there are abundant Chechen jihadist videos online that reinforce this view. They tend to feature Caucasian fighters who, far from the lecturing sheikhs often found in Al Qaeda recruitment videos, look like grizzled Navy SEALs, humping through the woods in camouflage and bandannas. Tamerlan would later post several of these videos on his YouTube page, as well as "The Emergence of Prophecy: The Black Flags from Khorasan," a central part of Al Qaeda and other jihadist mythology, which depicts fierce, supposedly end-times battles against the infidels across a region that includes parts of Afghanistan, Pakistan and Iran.

    But Brian Glyn Williams, a professor of Islamic studies at UMass Dartmouth and an expert on terrorism and the politics of Chechnya, believes that Tamerlan's journey – which he calls "jihadification" – was less a young man's quest to join Al Qaeda than to discover his own identity. "To me, this is classic diasporic reconstruction of identity: 'I'm a Chechen, and we're fighting for jihad, and what am I doing? Nothing.' It's not unlike the way some Irish-Americans used to link Ireland and the IRA – they'd never been to Northern Ireland in their lives, but you'd go to certain parts of Southie in Boston, and all you see are donation cans for the IRA."

    For Jahar, identity likely played into the mix as well, says Williams, who, though he never met Jahar at UMass Dartmouth, coincidentally corresponded with him during his senior year of high school. One of Williams' friends taught English at Rindge, and "he told me he had this Chechen kid in his class who wanted to do his research paper on Chechnya, a country he'd never lived in." Williams agreed to help Jahar. "The thing that struck me was how little he actually knew," he says. "He didn't know anything about Chechnya, and he wanted to know everything."

    Whether Jahar gained much from his studies – or even did much of it – is unknown. Tamerlan, having devoured all the books he could find, was preparing to take the next step. In January 2012, he traveled to Dagestan, where he spent six months. Dagestan has been embroiled in a years-long civil war between Muslim guerrillas and the (also Muslim) police, as well as Russian forces. Bombs go off in the streets regularly, and young men, lured by the romance of the fight, often disappear to "go to the forest," a euphemism for joining the insurgency. Tamerlan, too, seemed to have wanted to join the rebellion, but he was dissuaded from this pursuit by, among others, a distant cousin named Magomed Kartashov, who also happened to be a Dagestani Islamist. Kartashov's Western cousin, who came to Dagestan dressed in fancy American clothes and bragging of being a champion boxer, had no place in their country's civil war, he told Tamerlan. It was an internal struggle – in an interview with TIME magazine, associates of Kartashov's referred to it as "banditry" – and had only resulted in Muslims killing other Muslims. Kartashov urged Tamerlan to embrace nonviolence and forget about Dagestan's troubles. By early summer, Tamerlan was talking about holy war "in a global context," one Dagestani Islamist recalls.

    In July 2012, Tamerlan returned to Cambridge. He grew a five-inch beard and began to get in vocal debates about the virtues of Islam. He vociferously criticized U.S. policy in the Middle East. Twice over the next six or eight months, he upset services at a local mosque with a denunciation of Thanksgiving, and also, in January 2013, of Martin Luther King Jr."
    Last edited by Listening; 07-18-2013 at 04:49 PM.

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