The Political Zach The Roach thread`

[faxman75]

So, leets discuss. The rant, the politics, the activism, the causes Zach rallies behind.

What say you coachella fans?

I say the guy can rally a bunch of meat heads to smoke pot. Outside of that he really has no ideas except to say presidents should be hung and murdered and blah blah blah.

I'm missing the message because all I hear is Anarchy talk and no solutons that are real or feasable.

He is quickly becoming a caracature of himself.

[xtremehulk]

you really have missed his message

[faxman75]

Please enlighten me. If the system is not working as he has said and he thinks all presidents since WW2 should have been hung, then what is the solution? Sounds to me like he wants to eliminate government because they are the opressor, murders, war mongerers.

If I am mistaken please enlighten me. I'm fairly certain this is the bottom line.

[xtremehulk]

"A friend of ours said,
that if state laws were applied to US presidents as were applied to Nazis after World War II,
that every single one of them, every last bitch white one of them, would be hung to death and shot.
and this current administration is no exception, it should be hung and tried and shot.
as any war criminal should be.

the challenges we face go way beyond administrations, way beyond elections, way beyond every four years of poor endeavors,
way beyond that. because this whole rotten system has become so vicious and cruel that in order to sustain itself, it needs to destroy entire countries and profit from their reconstruction in order to survive. and that's not a system that changes every four years, its a system that we need to break down generation after generation."

[PlayaDelWes]

Zach had a message?

For real though.

Where are the solutions? It's easy to protest something, it takes some thought to come up with a solution. I think I heard Paris Hilton say more intelligent things to Lindsay Lohan this weekend.

[Down Rodeo]

Zack gives these quick rants during concerts because they resonate well with crowds. If he gave full speeches outlining ideas on how to change our society, you and most other people would be bored to death. If you had more of a brain, you would dig deeper into the sources that RATM use for their lyrics and political ideas. Only then might you understand that Zack believes, as do many other people, that there may be viable solutions to our societal ills.

For example, the quote that he gave Sunday night was from Noam Chomsky. Try to read a little bit of his stuff and then see if you still feel the same way.

[HEADSTRUCK]

dont bother with these people on here down rodeo, they really arent worth ur time. they do not care about how this country is run by war crimanals.....

[PlayaDelWes]

Zack gives these quick rants during concerts because they resonate well with crowds. If he gave full speeches outlining ideas on how to change our society, you and most other people would be bored to death.

So you are saying that he sells out to his meathead fans by saing what they want to hear vs. coming up with something smart.

[Down Rodeo]

dont bother with these people on here down rodeo, they really arent worth ur time. they do not care about how this country is run by war crimanals.....

True, they're too damn complacent to care. They'd rather criticize Zack de la Rocha, who has dedicated his life to affecting social change, than actually do something positive for society.

[PlayaDelWes]

...Zack de la Rocha...who has dedicated his life to affecting social change...

LOL
What has he done? What has he sacraficed? He's making $$$ off of this and nothing more. Money is a pretty big motivation.

[Down Rodeo]

So you are saying that he sells out to his meathead fans by saing what they want to hear vs. coming up with something smart.

Who says it's selling out? Any great public speaker always chooses their words carefully to get the maximum reaction out of their audience. And just because you don't have the intelligence to understand what Zack is talking about doesn't mean he's not saying something "smart."

[Mo'rage]

For every action there is supposed to be an equal and opposite reaction. The governments actions, especially in this administration, have heavily outweighed the peoples'. It always good to have someone like rage tip the scales back toward the people, no matter how much or how little. I don't take everything they say completely to heart and can't speak for those who do. Bush should probably be impeached, but not killed. I think that in countering the enemy you are most effective by going to the extreme other end of the spectrum, which is waht they do. It gives them a bigger voice heard by more, and raises thought and awareness in a much needed "battle against the machine"

[Down Rodeo]

LOL
What has he done? What has he sacraficed? He's making $$$ off of this and nothing more. Money is a pretty big motivation.

Have you taken time out of your comfortable lifestyle to help indigenous activists in Chiapas, Mexico for months at a time? I don't think you would have the guts to do something like that. Zack gave up his career with Rage to spend more time as an activist than as a musician. And you have the audacity to accuse him of selling out? Man, you better focus your criticism on people who actually deserve it. Just because you disagree with Zack politically doesn't mean you can be a smug asshole about his motivations.

[PlayaDelWes]

I think that in countering the enemy you are most effective by going to the extreme other end of the spectrum, which is waht they do. It gives them a bigger voice heard by more, and raises thought and awareness in a much needed "battle against the machine"

When you disagree with someone elses solution to a problem, what's wrong with "I understand your point of view, but here is a better idea to solve the problem at hand". Ignoring the problem and battling internally only makes the problem a bigger one.

[I'm Rosetta Stoned]

Rage like I believe that the people should control government and the government should benefit the middle class and all the people who struggle to survive in this nation. Coorporations should not be able to set the political agenda and have more power then you and me and all of us. They also believe that the US and our leaders should be held accoutable just like the rest of the leaders in the world. As for the over throww of this government, it isnt ment to be a taken litteral, it is ment to mean that the people need to start making this government accountable, people need to start questioning and taking a proactive intrest in this government such as voting and demanding answers and demanding solutions. No pun intended but we have To take the power back....

[PlayaDelWes]

Rage like I believe that the people should control government and the government should benefit the middle class and all the people who struggle to survive in this nation. Coorporations should not be able to set the political agenda and have more power then you and me and all of us. They also believe that the US and our leaders should be held accoutable just like the rest of the leaders in the world. As for the over throww of this government, it isnt ment to be a taken litteral, it is ment to mean that the people need to start making this government accountable, people need to start questioning and taking a proactive intrest in this government such as voting and demanding answers and demanding solutions. No pun intended but we have To take the power back....

Well said, unfortunatly, most rage fans aren't able to comprehnd that.

[scrodpiece]

do you really believe that about state laws applied to US presidents??

i'm trying to figure out what jimmy carter did that would warrant execution. I know that terms of war are viewed subjectively, but really can you compare Clinton in Bosnia or Reagan's central america skirmishes to Pol Pot? Milosevic? Pinochet? Tojo? Mao? Ceauşescu? Mussolini? Hell, Saddam Hussein? Only a couple of them were actually even executed. Let's get some context here. I think that statement is far off base.

[Down Rodeo]

Well said, unfortunatly, most rage fans aren't able to comprehnd that.

Why do you think Rage always listed so many websites and books inside their CD liner notes? It was out of the hope that at least a small percentage of their fans would actually take the time to read that material, educate themselves, and change the state of the world. Obviously, most people probably won't comprehend it or take the time to learn more, but if just a few people are changed by Rage's music, then Rage has succeeded.

[PlayaDelWes]

if just a few people are changed by Rage's music, then Rage has succeeded.

What about the fans of theirs that misinterpret their message and instead promote violence? Does that still mean they succeed? Or is a wash? Or is their message counterintuitive?

[HEADSTRUCK]

LOL
What has he done? What has he sacraficed? He's making $$$ off of this and nothing more. Money is a pretty big motivation.

he has done more good with the money he makes then oprah.....
stop hating

[Down Rodeo]

What about the fans of theirs that misinterpret their message and instead promote violence? Does that still mean they succeed? Or is a wash? Or is their message counterintuitive?

So Rage is to be blamed now for the actions of their fans? Do you just expect Rage to quit playing music then, just because some people might choose to express themselves through violence? You need to stop being so damn cynical.

[JrJrJ]

do you really believe that about state laws applied to US presidents??

i'm trying to figure out what jimmy carter did that would warrant execution. I know that terms of war are viewed subjectively, but really can you compare Clinton in Bosnia or Reagan's central america skirmishes to Pol Pot? Milosevic? Pinochet? Tojo? Mao? Ceauşescu? Mussolini? Hell, Saddam Hussein? Only a couple of them were actually even executed. Let's get some context here. I think that statement is far off base.

But you assume that the wars in which the President participates are the only places crimes are committed.

Example: You state Clinton in Bosnia. However, the country and media's overwhelming reaction to the President's blowjob caused a complete and total inaction in Rwanda. Hundreds of thousands died while their pleas for help were trumped on the nightly news by our leader saying "I did not have sexual relations with that woman..." Its not just about the presidential administration, its about the media and the interest of the people.

Worse, today the current administration carries out a completely unjust, unfocused and poorly planned war in Iraq while a similar genocide continues in the Sudan.

I don't believe Zach meant to say we should actually kill any President - he simply asks us to think for a moment and realize that history is written by the victor. The losers are declared war criminals while the more powerful (though we can't call them winners) are heralded as heroes.

Furthermore, I don't think they care that anybody in the audience thinks like they do, but more that they think.

Think for yourself... question authority. And all that type of stuff...

[faxman75]

Rage like I believe that the people should control government and the government should benefit the middle class and all the people who struggle to survive in this nation. Coorporations should not be able to set the political agenda and have more power then you and me and all of us. They also believe that the US and our leaders should be held accoutable just like the rest of the leaders in the world. As for the over throww of this government, it isnt ment to be a taken litteral, it is ment to mean that the people need to start making this government accountable, people need to start questioning and taking a proactive intrest in this government such as voting and demanding answers and demanding solutions. No pun intended but we have To take the power back....

See, the end result is still the same though. He wants people to vote? I don't see that at all. He never has asked people to vote. He's against this democracy and the only way to take the power back would be to overthrow the government. It doesn't happen by voting. I think you are completely wrong. Demanding answers and solutions? What the fuck is Zack's big plan? So far it's to sing the same ole' songs. I understand he's an activist and he's against war but the needs to practice what he preaches then and condemn those that act like idtiots in his fan base but isntead they revel in the idiots and Morello runs around screaming that he loves to make music but he wants it to have some negative reaction.

[woogie846]

Please enlighten me. If the system is not working as he has said and he thinks all presidents since WW2 should have been hung, then what is the solution? Sounds to me like he wants to eliminate government because they are the opressor, murders, war mongerers.

If I am mistaken please enlighten me. I'm fairly certain this is the bottom line.

Stop saying 'please englighten me!!'

[ThomThom]

he has done more good with the money he makes then oprah.....
stop hating

Oprah opened a multi million dollar educational institute, a hospital, an aids fund, and a scholarship fund in Africa...what the fuck has Zach De La Rocha done besides swiftly taking a fat paycheck from Golden Voice?

[JrJrJ]

See, the end result is still the same though. He wants people to vote? I don't see that at all. He never has asked people to vote. He's against this democracy and the only way to take the power back would be to overthrow the government. It doesn't happen by voting. I think you are completely wrong. Demanding answers and solutions? What the fuck is Zack's big plan? So far it's to sing the same ole' songs. I understand he's an activist and he's against war but the needs to practice what he preaches then and condemn those that act like idtiots in his fan base but isntead they revel in the idiots and Morello runs around screaming that he loves to make music but he wants it to have some negative reaction.

Zach never claimed to be a political leader or revolutionary - all he's trying to fight is ignorance and apathy.

Bob Dylan, Simon and Garfunkle and countless other socially conscious/politically active musicians never offer a solution, they simply speak to open people's eyes and unite the like-minded to take steps towards a solution together.

His goal is not to be the next Che or Lenin (since both of those revolutions have been so successful) but more to bring the anger and outrage that helped bring-to-light the pitfalls of Vietnam in the '60s into today's culture where it is sorely lacking.

Personally, I don't know it would ever succeed - information moves too fast and people simply don't have the passion to give up their material world to truly fight the powers that be in socially consious ways. But there is no reason to project such a grandiose image onto what Zach and Tom try to do. They're protestors and activists, not revolutionaries, not legislators.

[PlayaDelWes]

he has done more good with the money he makes then oprah.....
stop hating

I did not see Zach giving away new cars to the entire audiance on Sunday night.

Oprah 1, Zach 0

[martin77]

I was impressed with what Zach said. He is right that our current system is unstainable and requires things such as the destruction and recreation of countries to sustain itself. Capitalism is grow-or-die because of the way that we are always becoming more efficient. This requires us to always create new markets and war is one way of doing this. It's not like Zach said revolution now, he just said the system needs to change over generations, which is completely true or we are all fucked. Capitalism is not the final point of social evolution, something better is one the way, we just need to make it happen over time.

[Keo345]

I was quite pleased that the political rhetoric was kept to a minimum during Rage's set. I think they realized that the best way for the majority of the crowd to be receptive to their performance was to shut the fuck up and jam the fuck out, which they did. I only heard one rant, about executing the president, like the third-to-last song. But overall I was happy to see them avoid soapboxing and let their music and lyrics do the talking.

What I don't get, is why Tom Morello cited the "fascist Bush regime" in his interview in URB. Isn't Morello a communist? Which is basically as far left as a fascist? So isn't fascism and communism the kind of government he prefers?

Regardless, I think a good percentage of Rage fans are ignorant to the politics. Whether or not over time they will learn about the politics behind their music is yet to be seen. I think there's a huge meathead conglomerate that just loves getting their blood boiling to aggressive music, and the politics will always remain irrelevant to those people.

[martin77]

Facism is not the same as 'true' communism fascism is on the far right, rather than the left. Communism should give the people complete control over themselves where as fascism usually has a strong centralized government under one leader that opresses the people. Because they are both very
extreme there are some similarities though.