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Thread: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shuttle

  1. #31
    Member Godspeed's Avatar
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    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    Tl;dr: The reason it is not unethical is because you decided to purchase tickets (+ shuttle) at your own will. You don't have to go if you don't want to. HTH.

  2. #32
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    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    Quote Originally Posted by euphonicfiend View Post
    How do you know "more" people had to buy a "forced bundled" shuttle pass? Its sold out.. Have you talked to the thousands attending? I'm sure the people who were "forced" don't give a fuck (they are happy to just be going to the festival) and will sell it or keep it. again not a big deal. And yes McDonalds guy does care, coachella payment plans - letting poor folk enjoy the festival with layaway. ANNNDD my McDonalds guy knows when to make a buck and will buy his bundle and re sell his shuttle pass for more and make $10-$25 back, cause he is an asshole who works at McDonalds.
    Yeah there's a great market for selling shuttle passes at a profit when they are on sale for face value through Front Gate right now, and probably will remain on sale for quite some time (if not all the way up to the concert date).
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  3. #33
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    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    Quote Originally Posted by mountmccabe View Post
    re: Archie,

    So what you'd like is for the average consumer to be paying more so that you, the late-purchaser, can pay less.

    And you think that the average festival goer will want to use the shuttles when they realize that they're paying for a ride anyway. Except that the whole problem here is that YOU don't want to use the shuttles even though you've paid for a pass.


    Two other points:

    1. Neither of us know what Coachella's shuttle-related requirements are. Speculating that they are required to sell 1 shuttle pass for every 10 admissions and then further speculating that they'd be compliant if they sold NO shuttle passes is moronic.

    2. Right now they know how many potential shuttle riders there will be and can thus plan how many shuttles they will need. Sure, at peak times (say, the end of the festival) the answer will be as many as possible but know how long those peak conditions will last (that is how many riders you will have) will be important to planning. With your proposed system they would have no way of knowing how many riders they may have and no reason to expect it to be even close to constant from day to day.
    How am I late purchaser?

    Are you saying that everyone who tried to get a Week 1 ticket at both the presale and regular sale got one?

    If not, your point is invalid.

    Force-bundling expensive shuttle passes to some people and not others causes the situation where groups of people going together (even groups of 2) will be a mixture of some with and some without shuttle passes. Nobody is going to split up based upon who does and doesn't have a shuttle pass, so what ends up happening is many of those force-bundled shuttle passes go unused or sold for a loss.

    They also can't really plan very well for shuttle usage with the current system, because they don't know how many shuttle passes will actually be used. That's the problem when you force someone to purchase an unwanted service in order to get the main thing they really want -- you have no idea how many of those people will want to utilize that unwanted service, and how many will just eat it as an additional cost to their main goal.
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  4. #34
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    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    Question for the naysayers in this thread:

    Do you think Goldenvoice's forced-bundling solution was optimal?

    Or do you think they could do it a better way? If so, what would you suggest?
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    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    What else does your crystal ball say?
    “Intellectual growth should commence at birth and cease only at death.” - Albert Einstein
    “Music is a safe kind of high" - Jimi Hendrix
    “Music is the wine that fills the cup of silence.” - Robert Fripp
    “Nothing separates the generations more than music. By the time a child is eight or nine, he has developed a passion for his own music that is even stronger than his passions for procrastination and weird clothes.” - Bill Cosby

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    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    Quote Originally Posted by euphonicfiend View Post
    What else does your crystal ball say?
    It says that someone is going to spit in your Big Mac next time you go to McDonald's.
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  7. #37
    Coachella Junkie sonofhal's Avatar
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    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    Quote Originally Posted by JustSteve View Post
    well, for all intensive porpoises it is, will sell out within seconds tomorrow.
    Quote Originally Posted by korbinn View Post
    It's jsut dawned on me that I'm overly confident and a extremely ocd perfectionist.
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  8. #38
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    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    Quote Originally Posted by Archie Bunker View Post
    Yeah there's a great market for selling shuttle passes at a profit when they are on sale for face value through Front Gate right now, and probably will remain on sale for quite some time (if not all the way up to the concert date).
    All you are stating is speculation. Its Feb. those shuttle passes could easily sell by next month. All the people who lag and have no idea where they are staying will then need a shuttle pass (some people don't plan till April) and the people who were "forced" will then be able to sell their shuttle passes. - This is all my speculation. but really, you care way too damn much.
    Last edited by euphonicfiend; 01-31-2013 at 09:08 AM.
    “Intellectual growth should commence at birth and cease only at death.” - Albert Einstein
    “Music is a safe kind of high" - Jimi Hendrix
    “Music is the wine that fills the cup of silence.” - Robert Fripp
    “Nothing separates the generations more than music. By the time a child is eight or nine, he has developed a passion for his own music that is even stronger than his passions for procrastination and weird clothes.” - Bill Cosby

  9. #39
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    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    Quote Originally Posted by Archie Bunker View Post
    It says that someone is going to spit in your Big Mac next time you go to McDonald's.

    oooo buuuurrrrn. Good one.
    “Intellectual growth should commence at birth and cease only at death.” - Albert Einstein
    “Music is a safe kind of high" - Jimi Hendrix
    “Music is the wine that fills the cup of silence.” - Robert Fripp
    “Nothing separates the generations more than music. By the time a child is eight or nine, he has developed a passion for his own music that is even stronger than his passions for procrastination and weird clothes.” - Bill Cosby

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    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    Oh, Archie... you're adorable when you're acting the bigot...
    Its like the Infinite Monkey Theorem, if you put X amount of monkeys in a room with a typewriter and ask them to give you Shakespeare 99% of them will fling their shit at you while the other 1% will masturbate in the corner.

  11. #41
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    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    Quote Originally Posted by Archie Bunker View Post
    Question for the naysayers in this thread:

    Do you think Goldenvoice's forced-bundling solution was optimal?

    Or do you think they could do it a better way? If so, what would you suggest?
    i suggest you go fuck yourself.
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  12. #42
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    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    someone explain to me why it's 'imperative' that anyone explain anything to Archie Bunker
    Quote Originally Posted by canexplain View Post
    If moles had subways, molestation wouldn't be one of the creepiest words there is ....
    Quote Originally Posted by canexplain View Post
    Eat don't chat ...When I figure out what windlowless is, I'll respond .
    i hear voices in my head and they keep caaaaallin' me

  13. #43
    Member Godspeed's Avatar
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    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    Are you guys still arguing about OP's retarded rant?

  14. #44
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    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    Quote Originally Posted by Radtechnique View Post
    Are you guys still arguing about OP's retarded rant?
    Shamefully, yes.
    “Intellectual growth should commence at birth and cease only at death.” - Albert Einstein
    “Music is a safe kind of high" - Jimi Hendrix
    “Music is the wine that fills the cup of silence.” - Robert Fripp
    “Nothing separates the generations more than music. By the time a child is eight or nine, he has developed a passion for his own music that is even stronger than his passions for procrastination and weird clothes.” - Bill Cosby

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    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    Quote Originally Posted by euphonicfiend View Post
    Shamefully, yes.
    Carry on.

  16. #46
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    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    Weekend 1. I bought a shuttle pass. I will not be using it. Got screwed on a camping situation, and there's no way I'm going to pay for a motel/ hotel when I live an hour away. GV got my $50, and someone just got fucked on a shuttle they could have easily taken advantage of, by choice. I refuse to contribute to the overpriced demand made by selling tickets to scalper haven websites like stubhub. I'm glad GV could shove an ordeal in my face on top of the non-mobile app fiasco that buying tickets was. This year better have a good crowd.

  17. #47

    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    Don't like it, don't buy it!
    Life ain't fair bitch.

  18. #48
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    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    Quote Originally Posted by blackhatspydog View Post
    Don't like it, don't buy it!
    Life ain't fair bitch.
    BOOM. ROASTED.
    Quote Originally Posted by canexplain View Post
    If moles had subways, molestation wouldn't be one of the creepiest words there is ....
    Quote Originally Posted by canexplain View Post
    Eat don't chat ...When I figure out what windlowless is, I'll respond .
    i hear voices in my head and they keep caaaaallin' me

  19. #49
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    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    Quote Originally Posted by Zafocaine View Post
    Weekend 1. I bought a shuttle pass. I will not be using it. Got screwed on a camping situation, and there's no way I'm going to pay for a motel/ hotel when I live an hour away. GV got my $50, and someone just got fucked on a shuttle they could have easily taken advantage of, by choice. I refuse to contribute to the overpriced demand made by selling tickets to scalper haven websites like stubhub. I'm glad GV could shove an ordeal in my face on top of the non-mobile app fiasco that buying tickets was. This year better have a good crowd.
    Did you have "boo-boo lip," or were you flat out on the floor writhing and kicking your feet as you typed this rant?
    Its like the Infinite Monkey Theorem, if you put X amount of monkeys in a room with a typewriter and ask them to give you Shakespeare 99% of them will fling their shit at you while the other 1% will masturbate in the corner.

  20. #50
    Endearingly Dislikable RotationSlimWang's Avatar
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    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    Anybody else remember how fucking painful the traffic around the festival was back when they still allowed day passes and the campgrounds were smaller and there weren't shuttles?
    Quote Originally Posted by amyzzz View Post
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  21. #51

    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    I will buy your shuttle pass if its light blue for $50.

    that is a win/win!

  22. #52
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    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    Quote Originally Posted by mountmccabe View Post
    OK this, if true, seems rather squicky. But "tens of thousands" seems way off
    And I don't know the details of what Indio required, the finances or usage statistics of the shuttle system and neither do you.
    Last year they had to provide an aggregate shuttle capacity for 25,000 people over the course of the festival.

  23. #53

    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    I had to buy a shuttle pass with my week 1 pass last year. It was an extra $50, but I looked at it as a Weekend 1 finder fee and a reminder to do the presale from then on. Plus I got to the 2pac hologram #first.
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    Peaceful Oasis TomAz's Avatar
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    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    Quote Originally Posted by Dbaked View Post
    weekend 2 GA passes are still available. When you don't have a job an extra $50 is a lot on top of an already pricey Ticket. Weekend 1 GA ticket $400 / with shuttle pass i won't use, or weekend 2 GA $350. Weekend 2 it is..

    I think its stupid, and shuttle passes should be optional
    why don't you just get a job you lazy fuck.

  25. #55
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    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    Quote Originally Posted by Archie Bunker View Post
    Question for the naysayers in this thread:

    Do you think Goldenvoice's forced-bundling solution was optimal?

    Or do you think they could do it a better way? If so, what would you suggest?
    Suboptimal is not the same as unethical.

    If it were me I would charge for parking (passes, purchased when you buy your ticket) and give shuttle passes away for free. and when parking is sold out, it's sold out, and you're stuck with the (free) shuttle. This would align the economics with their stated goal of wanting people to use the shuttle.

  26. #56
    Peaceful Oasis TomAz's Avatar
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    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    I mean I understand why they do it the way they do now.. the shuttle program costs them money (renting the additional land, hiring the company to provide buses and drivers, additional liability risk) relative to just putting cars on land they have anyway. But that's a short-sighted, internally-focused approach. The externally-focused, customer-centric approach is to reverse the revenue streams as I described above. Yes there is a financial risk to GV due to the mismatch of revenue and expenses (what if everybody takes the shuttle?) but it obviates the need to 'force' anybody to buy a pass they don't want.

  27. #57
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    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    They've enjoyed saying that parking has always been free for that nice contrast with L.A. area venues and attractions (will the $2 water be gone next?). And while having to have parking passes could be dealt with (but since this thread is about entitled assholes complaining about how they are to too lazy to deal with things) it has been really nice not having to worry about it in the past.

    I'm planning to walk in, I don't need a parking pass! Oh, wait, it's longer than I expected, I will drive.
    Oh, we'll all carpool, we don't need multiple parking passes! Oh, wait, you want to swim before going in and miss the first several hours, I will drive myself.

    Since the shuttles only go to specific spots in almost all cases you either plan to use it or you don't use it. There may be the scattered folks that live on shuttle lines but drive anyway and a few in their party comes in earlier or later than the vehicle or leaves earlier or later than the vehicle but I would suspect this is relatively rare. That is to say, yes, you want to encourage shuttle use but it does not lend itself to flexibility.


    Shuttle system planners also want to know how busy the shuttles are going to be - so wait times aren't awful - and overestimating (due to a few Archies not using their shuttle pass) is better than underestimating (which wouldn't happen with valued shuttle passes).
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    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    Quote Originally Posted by TomAz View Post
    Suboptimal is not the same as unethical.

    If it were me I would charge for parking (passes, purchased when you buy your ticket) and give shuttle passes away for free. and when parking is sold out, it's sold out, and you're stuck with the (free) shuttle. This would align the economics with their stated goal of wanting people to use the shuttle.
    Well, I mean one fairly significant problem with this is it kinda completely screws anyone who might get a pass at the last minute. Hotels along the shuttle lines fill up relatively early, I've stayed in a couple places out in Palm Springs that I'm pretty sure were nowhere near any of the shuttles. I suppose the argument is that I could have just driven to the nearest shuttle stop 30 minutes away instead of driving all the way into the venue, but then you get into a parking logistics nightmare of people filling up the places where the shuttles stop just to be able to get to Coachella period because there's no way for us to be able to park there.
    Quote Originally Posted by amyzzz View Post
    Hannah, I don't know that pigs have big weiners, and my early 20's facination with dogs because of weiner size, I think. If that helps.

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    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    OP hates the rain forest


    Quote Originally Posted by RotationSlimWang View Post
    Anybody else remember how fucking painful the traffic around the festival was back when they still allowed day passes and the campgrounds were smaller and there weren't shuttles?
    2004 after radiohead it took around 2 hours to get out, and that was only because we discovered a little shortcut. i heard stories of the back lot not emptying out until sometime after 4 IN THE FUCKING MORNING. so yea, shuttles ftw. next time buy presale OP
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    I'm locking this fucker.

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    Default Re: Someone explain to me why it's ethical to force-bundle certain tickets w/the shut

    I'm very happy I didn't have to buy a shuttle pass during pre-sale this year. Last year was such a waste of money, I didn't buy other items just to protest and kept to my budget. Still bought shirts, just not as many.
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