College Basketball 2011-2012 Thread

[caeden]

colorado representing the pac12? are you fucking serious? hahahahaha

[boarderwoozel3]

Kind of hate basketball right now.

How does the NIT even work? This is dumb. My school's team should work on being less disappointing.

**And free throws. Definitely need to work on the free throws.

[welgo800]

make some NOISE for LoNg BeAcH StAtE!!!!!!

[Bud Luster]

I hope San Diego State can win at least one NCAA tourney game this year. I think the move to the Big West in 2013-2014 season is a bad idea, but it's a conference they will dominate. (And the football team moves to the Big East, WTF is that? The Fuck is wrong with the NCAA?)

[boarderwoozel3]

In the football Big East? What? Someone needs to reference a map and revisit this idea....

[mountmccabe]

I hope San Diego State can win at least one NCAA tourney game this year. I think the move to the Big West in 2013-2014 season is a bad idea, but it's a conference they will dominate. (And the football team moves to the Big East, WTF is that? The Fuck is wrong with the NCAA?)

It isn't 1950 anymore. The regionalism of conferences was about travel times by bus or horse-drawn carriage or whatever the hell they used to use. In football this is why Bowl games were a few weeks after the season during (most school's) winter break, because that was the only time the team could be expected to travel across the country. Teams from the Northeast and Midwest didn't play (or rarely played) teams from the South and the West during the season, only in the Bowls.

Now big schools mostly fly anyway, some using charters. It's still easier to play teams that are physically close - I would be surprised if Arizona flew up to Tempe to play ASU, and does USC even bother to arrange transportation to play UCLA? - but if you can't get in with other colleges that match up with you well, why not travel to get the exposure and competition that works for your team?

[hawkingvsreeve]

When the Big East invited Boise, Boise wanted a travel partner to join with them, and that ended up being SDSU. Boise will actually travel less miles than they would have if they had stayed in the MW. I wish SDSU was staying in the MW for basketball, as it is has proven to be a good conference.

[Gribbz]

Kind of hate basketball right now.

How does the NIT even work? This is dumb. My school's team should work on being less disappointing.

**And free throws. Definitely need to work on the free throws.

Hear, hear. 14 seconds left and UA didn't even get a shot off. Absolutely ridiculous.

Hopefully Nick Johnson will be able to hit a jump shot next year.

[fiyahhh!]

Anyone interested in a board member online bracket tourney? No money involved, just board members, just for fun.

http://tournament.fantasysports.yaho...ster/joingroup

group ID# is 66690
password is: chacid

[hawkingvsreeve]

SOUTH (Atlanta)
Louisville
Thursday, March 15
No.1 Kentucky vs. No. 16 Mississippi Valley State/Western Kentucky winner
No. 8 Iowa State vs. No. 9 Connecticut

Portland
Thursday, March 15
No. 5 Wichita State vs. No. 12 Virginia Commonwealth
No. 4 Indiana vs. No. 13 New Mexico State

Albuquerque
Thursday, March 15
No. 6 UNLV vs. No. 11 Colorado
No. 3 Baylor vs. No. 14 South Dakota State

Greensboro
Friday, March 16
No. 7 Notre Dame vs. No. 10 Xavier
No. 2 Duke vs. No. 15 Lehigh

WEST (Phoenix)
Columbus
Friday, March 16
No. 1 Michigan State vs. No. 16 Long Island University
No. 8 Memphis vs. No. 9 St. Louis

Portland
Thursday, March 15
No. 5 New Mexico vs. No. 12 Long Beach State
No. 4 Louisville vs. No. 13 Davidson

Louisville
Thursday, March 15
No. 6 Murray State vs. No. 11 Colorado State
No. 3 Marquette vs. No. 14 BYU/Iona winner

Omaha
Friday, March 16
No. 7 Florida vs. No. 10 Virginia
No. 2 Missouri vs. No. 15 Norfolk State

EAST (Boston)
Pittsburgh
Thursday, March 15
No. 1 Syracuse vs. No. 16 UNC-Asheville
No. 8 Kansas State vs. No. 9 Southern Miss

Albuquerque
Thursday, March 15
No. 5 Vanderbilt vs. No. 12 Harvard
No. 4 Wisconsin vs. No. 13 Montana

Nashville
Friday, March 16
No. 6 Cincinnati vs. No. 11 Texas
No. 3 Florida State vs. No. 14 St. Bonaventure

Pittsburgh
Thursday, March 15
No. 7 Gonzaga vs. No. 10 West Virginia
No. 2 Ohio State vs. No. 15 Loyola (MD)

MIDWEST (St. Louis)
Greensboro
Friday, March 16
No. 1 North Carolina vs. No. 16 Lamar/Vermont winner
No. 8 Creighton vs. No. 9 Alabama

Nashville
Friday, March 16
No. 5 Temple vs. No. 12 California/USF winner
No. 4 Michigan vs. No. 13 Ohio

Columbus
Friday, March 16
No. 6 San Diego State vs. No. 11 NC State
No. 3 Georgetown vs. No. 14 Belmont

Omaha
Friday, March 16
No. 7 Saint Mary's vs. No. 10 Purdue
No. 2 Kansas vs. No. 15 Detroit

[HotHamWater]

New Mexico playing on the same day(s) as the games that Albuquerque is hosting. Fuck your scheduling, selection committee.

[Down Rodeo]

And both New Mexico and New Mexico State ended up with first round games in Portland. I really wish I could skip work that day and drive down there...

[Mr. Porter]

Just filled out a bracket for the Yahoo perfect bracket $5 million prize. Final four is Kentucky, Marquette, Florida St., and North Carolina. I've got Kentucky defeating Carolina 77-72. Some notable upsets/picks: UNLV defeating Baylor and Duke en route to losing to Kentucky in elite 8, Long Beach St. defeating New Mexico, Wisconsin defeating Syracuse (not really a surprise pick though), Cal Bears to the sweet 16 but lose to Carolina, St. Mary's defeating Kansas en route to losing to Georgetown in sweet 16

[fiopadp7791]

Is anyone setting up a boardie bracket pickem?

[BlueDevil50]

I'm doing one for $20 bucks on yahoo. I just need your email and the money to be sent over PayPal.

[fiyahhh!]

Anyone interested in a board member online bracket tourney? No money involved, just board members, just for fun.

http://tournament.fantasysports.yaho...ster/joingroup

group ID# is 66690
password is: chacid

This one is free and just for board members... maybe I can entice a few more people to sign up by offering the winner a frozen lemonade during weekend #1.

[Pixiessp]

I am signed up for both. Filling them out right now.

[GuyInTucson]

Hear, hear. 14 seconds left and UA didn't even get a shot off. Absolutely ridiculous.

Hopefully Nick Johnson will be able to hit a jump shot next year.

What you should really hope for is a recruiting class that doesn't include large piles of overrated dog shit. If Josiah Turner doesn't get his head on straight, then that will make it five out of Miller's first nine recruits who are gone and only one because he was, you know, good enough to go pro.

Also you have to hope that there are no more lazy 7-foot euros or players who get shot right before the season starts.

Seriously, look at Miller's first three classes -
2009 -

DWill - NBA
Momo - "transferred" (More like he was forced out the door)
Parrom - Two family deaths in one offseason; getting shot the same offseason and then a season ending injury
Kyryl - One of the worst basketball players I have ever seen on any level
Solomon Hill - Very solid, should be a huge contributor next year

2010

Bejarano - was never the same after his dad died and was not ready for elite college basketball. Also should have never been taken over local product Terrell Stoglin.

Mayes - Waste of a scholarship. One dimensional player who doesn't even do what he was brought in to do very well. Also should not have been taken over Stoglin.

Perry - Solid contributor but would have been a bench / supporting player on any decent Arizona team from the past

2011 -

Josiah Turner - Kind of screwed in the head. Bad student. Great streetball point guard, but has been a huge bust thus far. Nice kid, but he doesn’t have a lot going on upstairs.

Nick Johnson - Has potential but was not a good player in conference play

Sidiki Johnson - Was worthless and a headcase and Miller dumped him. He had these same issues in high school and Miller ignored them and paid for it when Johnson arrived on campus.

Angelo Chol - I think he will be a very good player in time. Can't fault Miller for landing Chol.

But let’s be honest here, for an "elite" program and a coach who is widely regarded as one of the best young coaches in the nation, losing possibly five of your first nine recruits, with only one due to his pro stock, is not a good sign. It could be dumb luck that he has landed these types of players, but my bet is that his assistants (and Miller himself) are giving too many problem kids the benefit of the doubt. I really think he needs to re-evaluate which prospects he chooses to go after.

[CuervoPH]

Anyone interested in a board member online bracket tourney? No money involved, just board members, just for fun.

http://tournament.fantasysports.yaho...ster/joingroup

group ID# is 66690
password is: chacid

Submitting mine now as well.

[theklein25]

Yeah I'm in there. Kansas is my pick.

[tyles]

Yeah I'm in there. Kansas is my pick.

For once, something I can agree 100% with you on.

(Please note: Kansas is ALWAYS my pick.)

(Please also note: President Obama picked us to go all the way last year. If he picks us again, it may be a bad sign, akin to say, getting a best new artist Grammy.)

[Still-ill]

Eh... I'd be too skeptical of Kansas/St. Mary's, to get excited about the Jaywhawks.

[tyles]

Eh... I'd be too skeptical of Kansas/St. Mary's, to get excited about the Jaywhawks.

I'm from Lawrence originally, so I'm alway hopeful.

[Still-ill]

What you should really hope for is a recruiting class that doesn't include large piles of overrated dog shit. If Josiah Turner doesn't get his head on straight, then that will make it five out of Miller's first nine recruits who are gone and only one because he was, you know, good enough to go pro.

Also you have to hope that there are no more lazy 7-foot euros or players who get shot right before the season starts.

Seriously, look at Miller's first three classes -
2009 -

DWill - NBA
Momo - "transferred" (More like he was forced out the door)
Parrom - Two family deaths in one offseason; getting shot the same offseason and then a season ending injury
Kyryl - One of the worst basketball players I have ever seen on any level
Solomon Hill - Very solid, should be a huge contributor next year

2010

Bejarano - was never the same after his dad died and was not ready for elite college basketball. Also should have never been taken over local product Terrell Stoglin.

Mayes - Waste of a scholarship. One dimensional player who doesn't even do what he was brought in to do very well. Also should not have been taken over Stoglin.

Perry - Solid contributor but would have been a bench / supporting player on any decent Arizona team from the past

2011 -

Josiah Turner - Kind of screwed in the head. Bad student. Great streetball point guard, but has been a huge bust thus far. Nice kid, but he doesn’t have a lot going on upstairs.

Nick Johnson - Has potential but was not a good player in conference play

Sidiki Johnson - Was worthless and a headcase and Miller dumped him. He had these same issues in high school and Miller ignored them and paid for it when Johnson arrived on campus.

Angelo Chol - I think he will be a very good player in time. Can't fault Miller for landing Chol.

But let’s be honest here, for an "elite" program and a coach who is widely regarded as one of the best young coaches in the nation, losing possibly five of your first nine recruits, with only one due to his pro stock, is not a good sign. It could be dumb luck that he has landed these types of players, but my bet is that his assistants (and Miller himself) are giving too many problem kids the benefit of the doubt. I really think he needs to re-evaluate which prospects he chooses to go after.

I think you above all should know the character of the kids coming next year. They're all extremely focused young men, unlike the "problem" kids mentioned above. Miller had to take a chance on these kids because he didn't have a choice. His second recruiting class he couldn't land the targets he really wanted, so he had to settle for Mayes and Perry. His third recruiting class he had lots of success, but two of the kids had some issues. Sidiki committed very early in the process, and was a kid that was going to go to Xavier. The comittment took place long before a lot of his HS trouble arose, but Miller probably didn't want it to look like he was going to dump him, so he simply recruited over him and eventually kicked him off the team when his worries actually came true. Josiah, like you said, has always been described as a nice kid... a dumb kid, but a nice kid. He had issues conforming to college ball structure, and when things started looking good... he made a slew of off the court mistakes that put him in a bad decision.

So, I agree, Miller made some mistakes and has probably overestimated his ability to get over character issues, but it's clear he has changed his ways a bit. He backed off Chris Thomas very early in the process, backed off Caeden Anderson, backed off Eloy Vargas, and some others that I'm not going to be bothered to remember. Also if you look at the guys he's recruiting: Tyler Ennis, Stephen Domingo, Aaron Gordon (I realize his brother transferred, but I've heard that was more Howland's ish), etc. I don't think this trend will continue going forward (plus, a LOT of these guys were pushed out, and not leaving on their own accord).

[GuyInTucson]

I think you above all should know the character of the kids coming next year. They're all extremely focused young men, unlike the "problem" kids mentioned above. Miller had to take a chance on these kids because he didn't have a choice.

I've been around all four of these kids and not a single one of them is more of a "focused young man" than any of the players from the last few classes. They're all good kids, don't get me wrong, but nothing is sure to translate from one level to the next. They all have handlers that coddle them and kiss their ass. It's hard to predict how they will react when they don't have these people babying them at the next level. Miller doesn't put up with people's bullshit, but the problem is that he has had trouble recognizing who will give him bullshit beforehand.

His second recruiting class he couldn't land the targets he really wanted, so he had to settle for Mayes and Perry.

He had a player who is currently the ACC's leading scorer playing high school basketball in Tucson and playing rec center ball in the offseason with several players who were on the UA roster at that time. Miller thought he wasn't "Arizona good" but decided - for whatever reason - Mayes and Bejarano were.

His third recruiting class he had lots of success, but two of the kids had some issues. Sidiki committed very early in the process, and was a kid that was going to go to Xavier.

Sidiki was never for sure to Xavier. He ended up collecting offers from several other prominent schools in that region and didn’t decide to fully commit to Miller until he jumped ship to UA.

The comittment took place long before a lot of his HS trouble arose, but Miller probably didn't want it to look like he was going to dump him, so he simply recruited over him and eventually kicked him off the team when his worries actually came true.

The writing was on the wall for Sidiki long ago and Miller ignored it, for whatever reason. Him holding onto him until he arrived on campus had nothing to do with any type of PR business and everything to do with the fact that they were depleted in the post. He literally refused to do anything Miller told him once he arrived on campus and began pulling the same kind of crap he pulled in high school. He was a waste of a scholarship.

So, I agree, Miller made some mistakes and has probably overestimated his ability to get over character issues, but it's clear he has changed his ways a bit.

But it’s not clear at this point. Not until this class coming in proves themselves. All I heard were fans telling me was how good Josiah Turner was going to be and I was blasted by a couple of boosters for saying he will have to earn his spot. Nothing in college is a guarantee and Josiah turner proved that this year. Same goes with this incoming class. You don’t know how they are going to react to the pressure of college basketball and you don’t know how they are going to respond to the complete change of lifestyle.

He backed off Chris Thomas very early in the process, backed off Caeden Anderson, backed off Eloy Vargas, and some others that I'm not going to be bothered to remember.

Kadeem Jack, Lance Stephenson, Shabazz Muhammad… etc, etc.

This isn’t anything new. He backs off players all the time. As do / did a lot of other coaches around the same time. Everyone collectively backed off Chris Thomas at the same time because coaches knew about his legal troubles and attitude problems before they were ever found out by the public.

Also if you look at the guys he's recruiting: Tyler Ennis, Stephen Domingo, Aaron Gordon (I realize his brother transferred, but I've heard that was more Howland's ish), etc. I don't think this trend will continue going forward (plus, a LOT of these guys were pushed out, and not leaving on their own accord).

The fact that guys have been pushed out consistently is concerning. Whether it’s due to skill (or lack there of), attitude or because a certain PG who is now in the NCAA Tournament likes to get tipsy in the locker room, these are consistent concerns that continue to creep up and after three years it’s beginning to concern a lot of Arizona fans and rightfully so.

They shouldn’t even consider looking in another direction for a coach obviously, but if he somehow misses yet ANOTHER tournament next year he will be on very thin ice, especially with how much money the athletic department will be bringing in over the next decade (that could potentially be used to hire a big time coach)… not to mention his near departure to Maryland last season because Greg Byrne didn’t kiss his ass enough.

I like Sean Miller, but the fact that four (assuming Turner leaves and word around town is that people expect him to ultimately transfer) of his first nine commitments have left due to reasons other than entering the NBA Draft is a bit alarming.

[rag and bone]

I feel like the Jordin Mayes bashing is a bit unwarranted. I'm not here to list off his accomplishments but he was clearly thrown into a role he was not meant to serve this season due to circumstance. Let's be honest about the season though: they were overrated to start out, young, had some obvious flaws, had some serious personnel issues (some avoidable, others not) and despite showing flashes they ultimately couldn't cut it. I'm excited for next year.

[GuyInTucson]

I am not bashing Mayes. He is what he is, which is a role player who really shouldn't be playing in the Pac-12. The fans go crazy over him when he does well because he was an underrated recruit, but in reality he should have never, in a million years, been taken over Stoglin, who happened to be the best high school basketball player the Tucson area had seen since Sean Elliott.

And they weren't any more overrated than any other team that's given high expectations because of a top tier recruiting class. All the talk I heard, even from people I trust, was how Josiah Turner was going to come in and take over. How Solomon Hill was going to play at the next level (which he eventually got to, but not right away). How Nick Johnson was going to explode. Etc.,

Of course you take that with a grain of salt, but I don't think they were overrated in any way to start the season. Circumstances like the Parrom ordeal, the Sidiki Johnson saga and the Josiah Turner incidents set the team back dramatically, and Miller obviously couldn't predict those things would happen going into the season, but it seems like a lot more players have ran into some sort of trouble over the past 18 months under Miller than the average program tends to experience. That's just a little concerning to me.

I am sure next year's crop of players will improve the team and Arizona makes the tournament and possibly makes a run. But if the Wildcats don't, things are going to get dicey for Miller. There are already a ton of people pulling the "Miller has missed more tournaments in three years than Lute did in 25" card. If he misses a third in four years, people are going to start calling for his head, unwarranted or not. They don't want a Ben Howland situation at Arizona where you experience success early on and then fade into obscurity as the years pass.

[rag and bone]

How Nick Johnson was going to explode.

Say what you want about his offensive woes but his shot blocking down the stretch was undeniably exciting to watch and equally impressive.

[apostle2]

Well fuck.

[HotHamWater]

Slightly more confident about my Vanderbilt over Syracuse pick.