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View Full Version : What Was The Last Original Music?



Monklish
12-18-2009, 09:56 AM
So I was sitting here thinking about how all music--even really really good music--is just ripping off some other music one way or another. And I started wondering when the last album I'd genuinely consider to have an original sound would have been.

Well, what do you douchebags think?

Sleeping Lion
12-18-2009, 09:58 AM
Silver Apples?!

Can't think of any bands that sounded similar to them before the late 60's.

TomAz
12-18-2009, 10:01 AM
I think there has never been any truly original music. The most creative people are using tools/ideas developed by people who came before them.

caco0283
12-18-2009, 10:03 AM
http://www.cartoonstock.com/newscartoons/cartoonists/rha/lowres/rhan111l.jpg

BlackSwan
12-18-2009, 10:03 AM
This clearly all depends on what Randy's definition of "original" is.

Monklish
12-18-2009, 10:03 AM
Obviously everybody's going to sound at least somewhat like music that came before them, but let's be reasonable. We can't extrapolate everything out to the point where it all goes back to Chuck Berry and Little Richard. Just think back to the last music you heard where it really sounded like something new, and now in retrospect you still believe that's decently accurate.

I'd say Kid A is a solid choice, though that's probably not the most recent.

stinkbutt
12-18-2009, 10:03 AM
good artists imitate great artists steal

...

Monklish
12-18-2009, 10:04 AM
This clearly all depends on what Randy's definition of "original" is.

The idea is not to determine what my definition of original is, but what each of our definitions of original is.

I also think Arcade Fire is a justifiable answer.

amyzzz
12-18-2009, 10:05 AM
wrong forum, asshole.

Monklish
12-18-2009, 10:06 AM
I always start threads in this forum, bitchface.

stinkbutt
12-18-2009, 10:11 AM
I also think Arcade Fire is a justifiable answer.

Funeral definitely Neon Bible just sounded like a bunch of Sprinstein songs though

Monklish
12-18-2009, 10:12 AM
Yeah naturally Funeral. I don't really get the Neon Bible sounding like Springsteen thing though. Neon Bible sounded like Funeral.

AlecEiffel
12-18-2009, 10:17 AM
Antichrist Television Blues sounds a lot like Springsteen, but I wouldn't say the whole album does.

bmack86
12-18-2009, 10:23 AM
Arcade Fire sounds like Neutral Milk Hotel with the yelpiness toned down and more universal lyrics, and Kid A sounds like a synthesis of Krautrock, IDM and Radiohead's songwriting style.

That's an interesting query.

Mr. Dylanja
12-18-2009, 10:24 AM
Rap.

menikmati
12-18-2009, 10:24 AM
Who would have ever thought that the answer coming from this forum would be Radiohead or Arcade Fire?

marooko
12-18-2009, 10:24 AM
wrong forum, asshole.

:lips

That made me LOL.

higgybaby23
12-18-2009, 10:29 AM
Who would have ever thought that the answer coming from this forum would be Radiohead or Arcade Fire?

Shocking huh?

I nominate 4'33'' by John Cage. He was one pretentious bastard, but his ideas were mostly cutting edge and original.

As far as pop music goes, I'd have to agree with Tom. There is nothing new under the sun.

canexplain
12-18-2009, 10:31 AM
For me I think technology is the driving force in really innovative music. We have had percussion, strings, and vocals for 1000’s of years. When guitars went electric, music changed. Thank you Les Paul. When electronics merged with other forms of music, new music happened. Kid A is nothing but prog rock revisited. The prog groups that used the early Moog synthesizer are examples of new music.


The Taurus was known for an especially "fat" bass timbre and was used by the bands Genesis, Rush, Electric Light Orchestra, Yes, Pink Floyd, Parliament-Funkadelic.

My guess is when you can actually “feel” music, innovation will happen again and I am not just saying “turn up the volume”.

I think music will change when you will be able to see music too. We are somewhat there now but not even close.


Cr****

Gribbz
12-18-2009, 10:32 AM
Shocking huh?

I nominate 4'33'' by John Cage. He was one pretentious bastard, but his ideas were mostly cutting edge and original.

As far as pop music goes, I'd have to agree with Tom. There is nothing new under the sun.

I was thinking John Cage as well.

AlecEiffel
12-18-2009, 10:32 AM
I nominate 4'33'' by John Cage. He was one pretentious bastard, but his ideas were mostly cutting edge and original.


I'd kick 4'33 in the balls if it were a person.

higgybaby23
12-18-2009, 10:33 AM
^Sig worthy.

HunterGather
12-18-2009, 10:35 AM
http://bballsml.files.wordpress.com/2008/02/kidz_bop_cover.jpg

Monklish
12-18-2009, 10:37 AM
Arcade Fire sounds like Neutral Milk Hotel with the yelpiness toned down and more universal lyrics, and Kid A sounds like a synthesis of Krautrock, IDM and Radiohead's songwriting style.

That's an interesting query.

Neutral Milk Hotel sounds like garbage. And saying that Kid A sounds like three completely different genres melded together does not make it unoriginal. Rock n Roll was a meld of big band and the blues. Combining different genres can be originality.

Monklish
12-18-2009, 10:38 AM
Who would have ever thought that the answer coming from this forum would be Radiohead or Arcade Fire?

Then pony up an answer of your own instead of just sitting back and being a dick. It ain't my fault Radiohead is the best band of the last thirty years.

suprefan
12-18-2009, 10:38 AM
Who would have ever thought that the answer coming from this forum would be Radiohead or Arcade Fire?

Well its not Nirvana.

TomAz
12-18-2009, 10:40 AM
Combining different genres can be originality.

Then the answer to your question is Gogol Bordello.

Monklish
12-18-2009, 10:41 AM
Then the answer to your question is Gogol Bordello.

... ugh. I suppose that's somewhat accurate.

What was the last original GOOD music then?

TomAz
12-18-2009, 10:43 AM
Animal Collective sounds original to me, but maybe I just don't know their antecedents.

Monklish
12-18-2009, 10:44 AM
I'm going to say Animal Collective fits uniformly into a wide-ranging category called Uninteresting Rambling Bullshit.

frozen pilgrim
12-18-2009, 10:48 AM
... ugh. I suppose that's somewhat accurate.

What was the last original GOOD music then?

I know you won't necessarily like them, but

a) shpongle- a few years old, but at the time of the first record (can't believe it was around ten years ago), nobody had really brought that level of both psychedelia and world influence to electronic music. also, their labelmate, younger brother, has an extremely original sound. ambient, ethereal melodic electronic soundscapes with some really pretty, tasteful guitar work.

b) certain veins of dubstep- stuff on the darker, more experimental side like shackleton, moderat, kala, loefah to name a few.

I find the area most lacking in new, original stuff is guitar-driven work, and that could be due to a shift in cultural focus, expenditure of the possibilities for that instrument, or some combination of both

TomAz
12-18-2009, 10:49 AM
I'm going to say Animal Collective fits uniformly into a wide-ranging category called Uninteresting Rambling Bullshit.

Not uniformly, no. But they do tend to ramble, that's a fair point. And there's nothing original about rambling.

menikmati
12-18-2009, 10:50 AM
http://i48.tinypic.com/34zlv06.jpg

LooseAtTheZoo
12-18-2009, 10:54 AM
Obviously everybody's going to sound at least somewhat like music that came before them, but let's be reasonable. We can't extrapolate everything out to the point where it all goes back to Chuck Berry and Little Richard. Just think back to the last music you heard where it really sounded like something new, and now in retrospect you still believe that's decently accurate.

I'd say Kid A is a solid choice, though that's probably not the most recent.

Isn't Idioteque specifically based around chord progressions from another, older song? How can that be classified under original by your definition?

I nominate Brian Eno and his ambient work, just because that's the first thing that comes to mind. Give me a while and I'll think of what else I have that could fit into that category.

But I do agree with Tom, that almost every artisitc form has creative antecedents.

luckyface
12-18-2009, 10:54 AM
a) shpongle- a few years old, but at the time of the first record (can't believe it was around ten years ago), nobody had really brought that level of both psychedelia and world influence to electronic music.

I am not going to argue this since I have never gave Shpongle a spin, but Thievery Corporation have been around for quite some time (since 1995) and they have incorporated world elements into their brand of electronic music.

Monklish
12-18-2009, 10:57 AM
Isn't Idioteque specifically based around chord progressions from another, older song? How can that be classified under original by your definition?

I nominate Brian Eno and his ambient work, just because that's the first thing that comes to mind. Give me a while and I'll think of what else I have that could fit into that category.

But I do agree with Tom, that almost every artisitc form has creative antecedents.

I don't see how it's Tom you're agreeing with--that premise was included in the very first post in this thread.

I'd never heard that specifically about Idioteque. Find the songs and we can compare them, but I don't really know if a similarity of one song can qualify as discrediting the whole album. There's only so many chords in the world--does that mean that everybody's just ripping off whoever invented the chords?

wmgaretjax
12-18-2009, 10:58 AM
Idioteque uses a sample from a Paul Lansky composition... And clearly, anything that uses samples isn't original.

frozen pilgrim
12-18-2009, 11:01 AM
I am not going to argue this since I have never gave Shpongle a spin, but Thievery Corporation have been around for quite some time (since 1995) and they have incorporated world elements into their brand of electronic music.

yeah, absolutely, but it's a different type of electronic stuff. thievery corporation is much more straight forward, more of a jazz influence than psychedelia.

thievery corporation is also pretty original, although there stuff can get kind of nu-loungey sometimes

Alchemy
12-18-2009, 11:05 AM
Some of Dirty Projectors is original enough for me. I'd agree with Arcade Fire and Animal Collective, as well. I don't hear Neutral Milk Hotel in Funeral, but I certainly can hear it in Neon Bible.

BlackSwan
12-18-2009, 11:11 AM
I know you won't necessarily like them, but

a) shpongle- a few years old, but at the time of the first record (can't believe it was around ten years ago), nobody had really brought that level of both psychedelia and world influence to electronic music.

There are many Future Sound of London releases that predate the first Shpongle album.

stinkbutt
12-18-2009, 11:16 AM
Who would have ever thought that the answer coming from this forum would be Radiohead or Arcade Fire?

Godspeed was pretty damn original

TomAz
12-18-2009, 11:18 AM
Godspeed was pretty damn original

talk about rambling though.

stinkbutt
12-18-2009, 11:22 AM
true

frozen pilgrim
12-18-2009, 11:28 AM
There are many Future Sound of London releases that predate the first Shpongle album.

yeah, but I don't think they sound anything alike. I love FSOL. but... yeah. I don't think they sound ANYTHING alike

stinkbutt
12-18-2009, 11:30 AM
Sunn 0))))

Still-ill
12-18-2009, 11:34 AM
Sunn o))) was started as an Earth tribute band. So I dunno 'bout that one.

Still-ill
12-18-2009, 11:35 AM
Plus this.
http://www.discogs.com/image/R-408987-1109503684.jpg

BlackSwan
12-18-2009, 11:36 AM
yeah, but I don't think they sound anything alike. I love FSOL. but... yeah. I don't think they sound ANYTHING alike

I hear it...

jRLLARf_bdY

GCoCTkC0oL0

ZNKS2ohqEAc

NwdkexdiHh8

Monklish
12-18-2009, 11:37 AM
Did we miss the part where I said it was supposed to be good?

Let's think of it like this: the first original rock band of the modern age was Pixies. So what's happened between then and now that's distinctly good and original?

Also, Bjork.

Still-ill
12-18-2009, 11:38 AM
Oh Bjork is a good one.

Monklish
12-18-2009, 11:40 AM
I hear it...

GCoCTkC0oL0

ZNKS2ohqEAc


These two sound almost exactly alike, jesus.

TomAz
12-18-2009, 11:41 AM
Bjork is a good one.

Pixies are fine but "influenced" pretty strongly by bands like Husker Du.

TomAz
12-18-2009, 11:44 AM
ZNKS2ohqEAc

NwdkexdiHh8

fa0sDk8yqGY

wmgaretjax
12-18-2009, 11:47 AM
Medulla is a pretty tough album to contextualize.

algunz
12-18-2009, 11:55 AM
Shit, I was gonna say Bjork - but I got beat because I got caught up reading the whole thread. She was the first thing that came to mind when I saw the thread title. She's a true original in every possible way.

GoEastYoungMan
12-18-2009, 11:55 AM
Baroque motherfuckers.

pancakespancakes
12-18-2009, 11:56 AM
Wolfmother

AlecEiffel
12-18-2009, 11:59 AM
Wolfmother

Also Jet.

pancakespancakes
12-18-2009, 12:01 PM
Yeah, they came earlier, I always forget...

Cdubby
12-18-2009, 12:01 PM
Stone Temple Pilots

chairmenmeow47
12-18-2009, 12:01 PM
i really can't think of anything that sounds like four tet. though i'm sure someone could prove me wrong.

and dubstep?!? really?!?! wobble is not new. hell, DUB is not new. it was sucking 40 years ago without wobble.

TomAz
12-18-2009, 12:03 PM
Also Jet.

ahahahahahaha

algunz
12-18-2009, 12:05 PM
Although I'm not a big fan, what about Sigur Ros?

Still-ill
12-18-2009, 12:07 PM
The secret of creativity is knowing how to hide your sources.
-Albert Einstein

canexplain
12-18-2009, 12:10 PM
Although I'm not a big fan, what about Sigur Ros?

See below:

How is Bjork any different then what she was with the sugercubes only more out front. With that in mind, Bjork was/is nothing more then the a variation and somewhat different style then the sugarcubes?

cr****

Drinkey McDrinkerstein
12-18-2009, 12:12 PM
Most of Bjork's solo albums, which themselves offer varying styles and shapes, have very little to do sonically with The Sugarcubes besides her own voice

canexplain
12-18-2009, 12:14 PM
Most of Bjork's solo albums, which themselves offer varying styles and shapes, have very little to do sonically with The Sugarcubes besides her own voice

I agree somewhat but I could put on a specific sugercube song and a specific bjork song and I bet you would be hard pressed to say which is which. Also on Sigur Ros. Listen to some Jon Anderson solo stuff and compaire them. cr****

algunz
12-18-2009, 12:15 PM
The last four posts flummox me.

Still-ill
12-18-2009, 12:19 PM
Ok maybe on Debut, but on her work "In question" the similarities aren't that close:
EhT_HihW30s
LUNDkiRkrtk

rage patton
12-18-2009, 12:24 PM
Battles
The Mars Volta
Death From Above 1979


Then the answer to your question is Gogol Bordello.

and them too.

stinkbutt
12-18-2009, 12:27 PM
Mars Volta maybe Battles and DFA no

bmack86
12-18-2009, 12:33 PM
Mars Volta not at all. They're rehashing 60s and 70s experimental psych. Not in an impressive or new way, just rehashing.

Bjork's a good call.

BlackSwan
12-18-2009, 12:33 PM
Ugh, DFA1979.

Sleeping Lion
12-18-2009, 12:44 PM
So far nobody has argued against Silver Apples, good.

-SA
-Radiohead ( Kid A )
-Bjork ( maybe )

Gary Numans, was it Tubeway Army? ( waits for dick jokes )

I can say without a doubt Animal Collective is pretty fucking randomoriginal.
That being said of all the indie decent-great bands I've heard I DO NOT get these guys. Seriously I've tried so hard to get it but just fail.

Bradford Cox is doing great things for music in general. Atlas Sound/Deerhunter has some of the best ambient sounds I've ever heard.

luckyface
12-18-2009, 12:44 PM
Although I'm not a big fan, what about Sigur Ros?

That is an excellent call.

Monklish
12-18-2009, 12:48 PM
That's cause no one knows who the fuck Silver Apples is.

Bjork is not even remotely a maybe. Stay out of this, Old Man.

The dubstep comment is so fucking dumb I didn't even bother addressing it--makes sense that it came from Pilgrim. Dubstep is nothing but slow, lazy, pussy ass dnb. It's just dnb bass thrown over a 2/4 drumbeat. Fuck you.

Jon Blazed
12-18-2009, 12:49 PM
311 is the obvious answer

Still-ill
12-18-2009, 12:49 PM
Battles for sure.

wmgaretjax
12-18-2009, 12:50 PM
Scott Walker's last two albums. Duh.

Battles? Really? I mean, I love 'em, but they are just really well done math rock.

Still-ill
12-18-2009, 12:51 PM
Hah. Oh yeah.

jackstraw94086
12-18-2009, 12:52 PM
the premise of this thread is completely fucking absurd.

canexplain
12-18-2009, 12:52 PM
That's cause no one knows who the fuck Silver Apples is.

Bjork is not even remotely a maybe. Stay out of this, Old Man.



lolz, well let's hear what the locals say:
the 280,000 residents of iceland's geyser-pitted capital enjoy five professional theatre troupes, a national opera and a contemporary dance company. but where iceland really excels is in alternative rock music. leading the way is bjork, a pixie-diva whose quirky voice has made her the most famous icelander alive-though at a cost: she has become too commercial for reykjavik's hipsters. "i respect her," says one dreadlocked musician, "but i would never listen to her. way too plastic."

also the Bee Spiders then ? :) cr****

Monklish
12-18-2009, 12:53 PM
the premise of this thread is completely fucking absurd.

Explain how, dickface.


lolz, well let's hear what the locals say:
the 280,000 residents of iceland's geyser-pitted capital enjoy five professional theatre troupes, a national opera and a contemporary dance company. but where iceland really excels is in alternative rock music. leading the way is bjork, a pixie-diva whose quirky voice has made her the most famous icelander alive-though at a cost: she has become too commercial for reykjavik's hipsters. "i respect her," says one dreadlocked musician, "but i would never listen to her. way too plastic."

also the Bee Spiders then ? :) cr****

Since when does anyone care what someone with dreadlocks thinks. Little lone anyone from Iceland.

jackstraw94086
12-18-2009, 12:54 PM
That's cause no one knows who the fuck Silver Apples is.

Bjork is not even remotely a maybe. Stay out of this, Old Man.

The dubstep comment is so fucking dumb I didn't even bother addressing it--makes sense that it came from Pilgrim. Dubstep is nothing but slow, lazy, pussy ass dnb. It's just dnb bass thrown over a 2/4 drumbeat. Fuck you.

dubstep and dnb are not even remotely related by influence or rhythmic structure.

If they were were branches of the animal kingdom one would be mammals and the other would be reptiles.

Young blood
12-18-2009, 12:57 PM
http://userserve-ak.last.fm/serve/_/167190/Chris+Cornell.jpg

rage patton
12-18-2009, 12:58 PM
Mars Volta maybe Battles and DFA no

Who has done DFAs sound before? I am not accusing, I am asking. I would be really curious.


Mars Volta not at all. They're rehashing 60s and 70s experimental psych. Not in an impressive or new way, just rehashing.

Really? Obviously their influences lay in 60's/70's psychadelic music, but I thought we weren't drawing it back that far. My same question as to DFA1979 applies here, who sounded like The Mars Volta, before The Mars Volta.

And At The Drive-In is not a valid answer.


Battles? Really? I mean, I love 'em, but they are just really well done math rock.

I don't know much about math rock, but from I have listened to, it seemed like more to me that Battles kind of took math rock to a new level. What I mean is that they almost reinvented it to the point where it is no longer math rock, but math rock is the only genre name that can really be applied to their sound.

That is just what I have always thought though. Again, perhaps some recomendations to convince me otherwise?

jackstraw94086
12-18-2009, 01:00 PM
Explain how, dickface.



Since when does anyone care what someone with dreadlocks thinks. Little lone anyone from Iceland.

As pompous and pretentious as anyone on this board could possibly be, they're still only exposed to a small fraction a concept as vast as "music".

To sit back and say there's nothing new is about as ridiculous as the famous legend about the dickhead who suggested closing the patent office a hundred years ago because everything had already been invented.

It doesn't require a fundamentally new kind of instrument to create new music. Just about everything is derivitive of something else or a hybrid of other things if you're pretentious enough to look hard enough.

Sleeping Lion
12-18-2009, 01:01 PM
That's cause no one knows who the fuck Silver Apples is.



So you prove your a failure at trying to distinguish orginal music with a "who the fuck." :thu

Monklish
12-18-2009, 01:04 PM
As pompous and pretentious as anyone on this board could possibly be, they're still only exposed to a small fraction a concept as vast as "music".

To sit back and say there's nothing new is about as ridiculous as the famous legend about the dickhead who suggested closing the patent office a hundred years ago because everything had already been invented.

It doesn't require a fundamentally new kind of instrument to create new music. Just about everything is derivitive of something else or a hybrid of other things if you're pretentious enough to look hard enough.

Who said there's nothing new? We're trying to establish the few things that are new. If you're really trying to argue that more than a small sliver of any artistic output generated is genuinely original you're out of your fucking mind.

And sorry that we're trying to have a discussion operating within the naturally limited scope of experience any one person could have. Would you prefer that we just throw the whole topic into the realm of unknowable like a bunch of ineffectual fatbodies like yourself? Or maybe we could just acknowledge that we're bound to not have a 100 percent complete sample of the study and use our limited knowledge to still have a meaningful exchange.

Dork.

pancakespancakes
12-18-2009, 01:05 PM
b1pXulTzo1w

Monklish
12-18-2009, 01:05 PM
So you prove your a failure at trying to distinguish orginal music with a "who the fuck." :thu

I'm merely pointing out the reason no one countered you is that you brought up a band no one but you knows.

Monklish
12-18-2009, 01:05 PM
Much as I love The Black Keys, they're not remotely original. They're just really, really, REALLY fucking good.

pancakespancakes
12-18-2009, 01:07 PM
This thread is terrible... but I really agree with rage about Battles. Math rock they are not.

BlackSwan
12-18-2009, 01:09 PM
9nMOGhtxYMc

Gribbz
12-18-2009, 01:10 PM
Much as I love The Black Keys, they're not remotely original. They're just really, really, REALLY fucking good.

Exactly this.

stinkbutt
12-18-2009, 01:13 PM
This thread is terrible... but I really agree with rage about Battles. Math rock they are not.

wow yall can't be serious. Sure Battles may have stepped it up but they are just really good math rock. As for DFA 1979 they were just another good punkish band nothin that new, great but nothing that new and original.

What does everyone think about Of Montreal?

Monklish
12-18-2009, 01:18 PM
NIN, probably starting more definitely with TDS than Pretty Hate Machine.

chairmenmeow47
12-18-2009, 01:19 PM
NIN, probably starting more definitely with TDS than Pretty Hate Machine.

i think you'll need more to back up your statement than that. i'd say they certainly are original from a performance perspective, but not musically.

BlackSwan
12-18-2009, 01:20 PM
What does everyone think about Of Montreal?

I think they suck.

Monklish
12-18-2009, 01:21 PM
I don't have to do shit to back up what I say. It's open for other people to prove it wrong. PHM sounds more similar to Trent's influences out of the 80s. Find me something that sounds like Downward Spiral before it and I'll rescind it. You can't prove something's original, only that it's not.

chairmenmeow47
12-18-2009, 01:24 PM
ok, so you're saying that nin was completely original compared to all the other industrial that was around at the time? i'm not the best person to name specific examples, but i know the one gripe i hear over and over again from industrial fans is that nin was ripping off music like ministry and skinny puppy. i like nin because it does sound different from these types of industrial to me and has something to it, but i don't know that i'd call it something "original". i'd heard synthy industrial before.

algunz
12-18-2009, 01:25 PM
MBV
Ween
:2c

Mr. Dylanja
12-18-2009, 01:25 PM
Skinny Puppy and Ministry molded NIN. I can't find examples at work but it's blatantly obvious.


The answer you're looking for is JUSTICE.

Young blood
12-18-2009, 01:25 PM
I don't have to do shit to back up what I say. It's open for other people to prove it wrong. PHM sounds more similar to Trent's influences out of the 80s. Find me something that sounds like Downward Spiral before it and I'll rescind it. You can't prove something's original, only that it's not.

ministry.

Mr. Dylanja
12-18-2009, 01:26 PM
Ivyleague beat me to it.

chairmenmeow47
12-18-2009, 01:26 PM
Ivyleague beat me to it.

BOW TO YOUR SENSEI!

Mr. Dylanja
12-18-2009, 01:26 PM
But at least i beat J$.

Mr. Dylanja
12-18-2009, 01:27 PM
BOW TO YOUR SENSEI!

*bubbles percolating*

Young blood
12-18-2009, 01:27 PM
Coil.

Young blood
12-18-2009, 01:27 PM
fuck you guise.

AlecEiffel
12-18-2009, 01:28 PM
I was really into electronic music at the time. "David Bowie's 'Low' was probably the single greatest influence on 'The Downward Spiral' for me. I got into Bowie in the 'Scary Monsters' era, then I picked up 'Low' and instantly fell for it. I related to it on a song-writing level, a mood level, and on a song-structure level...I like working within the framework of accessibility, and songs of course, but I also like things that are more experimental and instrumental, maybe.

I hear it in there.

Monklish
12-18-2009, 01:30 PM
ok, so you're saying that nin was completely original compared to all the other industrial that was around at the time? i'm not the best person to name specific examples, but i know the one gripe i hear over and over again from industrial fans is that nin was ripping off music like ministry and skinny puppy. i like nin because it does sound different from these types of industrial to me and has something to it, but i don't know that i'd call it something "original". i'd heard synthy industrial before.

Nothing is completely original. This was establish early on in the thread.

Ministry always felt a lot more like metal to me, and Skinny Puppy is more experimental bullshit.

I don't buy that either one of those bands spanned the categories of electronic, metal, and also piano-driven ballad shit as much as NIN. That would be my case. Spanning two genres is easy enough. Adding a third aspect tends to set it apart.

amyzzz
12-18-2009, 01:30 PM
There's "A Warm Place," complete NIN rip-off of that Bowie song.

Drinkey McDrinkerstein
12-18-2009, 01:33 PM
There's an awful lot of influence from Ministry's The Mind Is A Terrible Thing To Taste and Psalm 69 in The Downward Spiral

Did Trent do new things and take the genre to a new level? Probably. But you can't really deny its direct influences

Monklish
12-18-2009, 01:34 PM
There is not a single piece of music in the world that does not have identifiable direct influences. That being said, NIN may not be that good of a choice.

EDIT: However, I think the fact that we simultaneously have people calling out that Trent simultaneously ripped off David Bowie and Skinny Puppy says a lot about how much it doesn't fit comfortably into any one derivative, which is essentially what originality is.

DOUBLE EDIT: Also, Skinny Puppy fucking sucks.

rage patton
12-18-2009, 01:34 PM
As for DFA 1979 they were just another good punkish band nothin that new, great but nothing that new and original.

I don't know... their influences in their music show, but I don't think I have ever heard another band quite like them. With just bass and drums no less.

Drinkey McDrinkerstein
12-18-2009, 01:34 PM
Ministry always felt a lot more like metal to me, and Skinny Puppy is more experimental bullshit.


Minstry's early works were basically dark synth pop, and along with early Gary Numan were probably very responsible for Pretty Hate Machine in a way

algunz
12-18-2009, 01:35 PM
Wow, did Randy just admit that he was wrong? :p

Monklish
12-18-2009, 01:36 PM
I admit that I'm wrong when there's a decent argument to be made. I also then go back and edit my admissions to try and make it look like I didn't admit anything.

AlecEiffel
12-18-2009, 01:37 PM
However, I think the fact that we simultaneously have people calling out that Trent simultaneously ripped off David Bowie and Skinny Puppy says a lot about how much it doesn't fit comfortably into any one derivative, which is essentially what originality is.


Amen. Everyone has influences, it's impossible not to. It's how you combine them that matters.

Monklish
12-18-2009, 01:40 PM
On that note, dubnobasswithmyheadman

Mr. Dylanja
12-18-2009, 01:44 PM
I'd say Aenima was more original than TDS, no?

Monklish
12-18-2009, 01:47 PM
I'd say Aenima was more original than TDS, no?

An interesting question. I'd thought about throwing Aenima up there but figured I'd wait for you.

As far as more original, I'm not really sure. I think it definitely stands apart even from the prog-metal that came before it, although it also didn't really span as many different sounds as TDS did. But then again it's probably a bit easy to set Aenima apart from King Crimson than it is TDS from its precursors.

Mr. Dylanja
12-18-2009, 01:51 PM
Essentially aren't you asking for the latest genres of music that've emerged and who is responsible for said genres?

malcolmjamalawesome
12-18-2009, 01:59 PM
There has been nothing more original than Lady Gaga and her seamless meshing of top notch performance art with challenging pop music.

Monklish
12-18-2009, 02:00 PM
Essentially aren't you asking for the latest genres of music that've emerged and who is responsible for said genres?

Generally speaking if you're doing something original you're going to more or less invent a new genre.

amyzzz
12-18-2009, 02:01 PM
Nobody bites into their lyrics as deliciously as Lady Gaga does though.

jackstraw94086
12-18-2009, 02:03 PM
Generally speaking if you're doing something original you're going to more or less invent a new genre.

You're just going to keep playing impish semantics games again with the meaning of "original" at this point.

Monklish
12-18-2009, 02:05 PM
You're just going to keep playing impish semantics games again with the meaning of "original" at this point.

Not really. I summed it up pretty well several times throughout the thread, but dorks like yourself persist in coming back with arguments that have already been discussed and settled.

BlackSwan
12-18-2009, 02:06 PM
Lady Gaga is shite.

jackstraw94086
12-18-2009, 02:06 PM
Who said there's nothing new? We're trying to establish the few things that are new. If you're really trying to argue that more than a small sliver of any artistic output generated is genuinely original you're out of your fucking mind.

And sorry that we're trying to have a discussion operating within the naturally limited scope of experience any one person could have. Would you prefer that we just throw the whole topic into the realm of unknowable like a bunch of ineffectual fatbodies like yourself? Or maybe we could just acknowledge that we're bound to not have a 100 percent complete sample of the study and use our limited knowledge to still have a meaningful exchange.

Dork.

to accuse me of trying to expand the scope of this discussion to include all possible forms of music is ridiculous. I was simply trying to point out how arrogant it is to form a thread talking about how hard it is to identify "new music". You didn't specify even a general genre. you know you didn't.

Monklish
12-18-2009, 02:07 PM
to accuse me of trying to expand the scope of this discussion to include all possible forms of music is ridiculous. I was simply trying to point out how arrogant it is to form a thread talking about how hard it is to identify "new music". You didn't specify even a general genre. you know you didn't.

Specifying a genre would be limiting the scope of the discussion, you dipshit.

canexplain
12-18-2009, 02:21 PM
That is why I said early on in this thread as far as totally new sounding music. Electronics brought a whole new sound and genres’ to music. Did any group sound like a group with the first electric guitars or Moog synthesizers. No. I guess I could also throw in rock a billy like the Stray Cats but that might be close to Elvis music. And dare I say it? Why not. The Beatles …. Cr****

Monklish
12-18-2009, 02:22 PM
... The Stray Cats sound EXACTLY like music that already existed, Ron. They're not original, they're a fucking rerun. Are you so dense that you can't wrap your mind around this?

jackstraw94086
12-18-2009, 02:23 PM
Specifying a genre would be limiting the scope of the discussion, you dipshit.

ya that's exactly why I'm calling you arrogant. You didn't limit the scope, which would seem to imply you don't see anything new in any form of music.

You were ridiculous to accuse me of trying to expand this disussion to "any type of music possible", but the only reason I brought mentioned limited scope was to point out that you made no attempt to limit it (which you just admitted).

jackstraw94086
12-18-2009, 02:23 PM
ya I thought the entire point of stray cats was that they're retro.

mountmccabe
12-18-2009, 02:24 PM
No one is arguing with the idea of the Silver Apples because they were 40 years ago. The idea was to talk about recent original music.

malcolmjamalawesome
12-18-2009, 02:24 PM
major lulz at stray cats as original

amyzzz
12-18-2009, 02:24 PM
srsly. wtf, ron?

Monklish
12-18-2009, 02:25 PM
ya that's exactly why I'm calling you arrogant. You didn't limit the scope, which would seem to imply you don't see anything new in any form of music.

You were ridiculous to accuse me of trying to expand this disussion to "any type of music possible", but the only reason I brought mentioned limited scope was to point out that you made no attempt to limit it (which you just admitted).

No, you accused me of being foolish for trying to tackle a subject as large as music when there's so much music none of us have heard. That's completely different and useless. The reason we don't limit its scope is that there's so little that actually qualifies as original. What don't you understand about this? Everyone seems to get it well enough except for you and motherfuckin Ron.

malcolmjamalawesome
12-18-2009, 02:26 PM
Ron, I also find all of the new new wave bands to be very original.

mountmccabe
12-18-2009, 02:28 PM
Also, Joanna Newsom.

jackstraw94086
12-18-2009, 02:29 PM
No, you accused me of being foolish for trying to tackle a subject as large as music when there's so much music none of us have heard. That's completely different and useless. The reason we don't limit its scope is that there's so little that actually qualifies as original. What don't you understand about this? Everyone seems to get it well enough except for you and motherfuckin Ron.

If you just make the concession that you're talking about the pop and indie/hipster kind of music which generally defines this board then you MAY be remotely justified (although even confining it to that segment of "music" still leaves everyone dreadfully ignorant of even most of what comprises it)

As it is you're just talking out your ass about how hard it is to identify "new music" in general as if you had some sort of absolute scale to judge it on.

mountmccabe
12-18-2009, 02:31 PM
Also I'd agree with putting Battles on the list. There are clear math and post-rock influences but they took more in and went new places.

malcolmjamalawesome
12-18-2009, 02:36 PM
The answer is no hip hop artist since the first hip hop artist.

mountmccabe
12-18-2009, 02:39 PM
Also I'd suggest the Fiery Furnaces.

Also where's that thread about bands from the decade to which we will listen until we are 90? The Fiery Furnaces are one of the best answers there.

malcolmjamalawesome
12-18-2009, 02:40 PM
I feel the Fiery Furnaces ARE original. Are you being sarcastic? I can't tell any more.

mountmccabe
12-18-2009, 02:42 PM
I am being serious, Battles, Joanna Newsom and the Fiery Furnaces are all original voices of the recent times.

miscorrections
12-18-2009, 02:42 PM
For some reason I always forget about listening to them. They're great, and I like them a lot, but I don't think I've had a listen in two or three years.

jackstraw94086
12-18-2009, 02:42 PM
The answer is no hip hop artist since the first hip hop artist.

That's randy kind of talk.

Hip hop is a pretty broad term these days (as it is applied to music), it spans the gamut from oldschool, to a sub-genre for almost any damn city in the country and many other parts of the world. there's abstract hip hop and stuff that skirts boundries of electronica.

There's been shitloads of new hip hop.

malcolmjamalawesome
12-18-2009, 02:43 PM
Genghis Tron

Monklish
12-18-2009, 02:46 PM
If you just make the concession that you're talking about the pop and indie/hipster kind of music which generally defines this board then you MAY be remotely justified (although even confining it to that segment of "music" still leaves everyone dreadfully ignorant of even most of what comprises it)

As it is you're just talking out your ass about how hard it is to identify "new music" in general as if you had some sort of absolute scale to judge it on.

Do you have any concept of how retarded you're being? Here, allow me to demonstrate:

Okay gang, we're going to do a little exercise in Jack Theory here. I want to know what original alternative rock bands there are out there. Make sure they're definitely qualified as alternative rock, but also original and cutting a new path in music. They should be alternative rock, but not sound like other alternative rock.

Drinkey McDrinkerstein
12-18-2009, 02:47 PM
Candlebox

chairmenmeow47
12-18-2009, 02:48 PM
outkast? i don't know that i'd heard anything like bombs over baghdad before.

LooseAtTheZoo
12-18-2009, 02:51 PM
Also I'd suggest the Fiery Furnaces.

Also where's that thread about bands from the decade to which we will listen until we are 90? The Fiery Furnaces are one of the best answers there.


I feel the Fiery Furnaces ARE original. Are you being sarcastic? I can't tell any more.


I am being serious, Battles, Joanna Newsom and the Fiery Furnaces are all original voices of the recent times.

I haven't listened to a large amount of Fiery Furnaces on record, but live they were pretty boring and uninterested.

LooseAtTheZoo
12-18-2009, 02:52 PM
Also, TV On The Radio.

Monklish
12-18-2009, 02:55 PM
Outkast works. Shit, I still haven't heard anything that sounds quite like Outkast. At least not anything good.

canexplain
12-18-2009, 02:59 PM
OK I concede on the rockabilly. It was fresh sounding when it came back as a revival type of music, but it was 30 years old then. Just to argue though. Rap is nothing but a cappella with a different beat. Hip hop is nothing but Rap with music. House/dubstep/drum and bass etc is nothing but beats, rhythums, and sounds, typically with electronics. Minus the instruments it could be 500 years old. DJ’s are nothing more but a person using a turntable or laptop in an unusual way. … Yada yada …. Cr****

chairmenmeow47
12-18-2009, 03:01 PM
OK I concede on the rockabilly. It was fresh sounding when it came back as a revival type of music, but it was 30 years old then. Just to argue though. Rap is nothing but a cappella with a different beat. Hip hop is nothing but Rap with music. House/dubstep/drum and bass etc is nothing but beats, rhythums, and sounds, typically with electronics. Minus the instruments it could be 500 years old. DJ’s are nothing more but a person using a turntable or laptop in an unusual way. … Yada yada …. Cr****

jam bands are nothing more than dudes with weed and guitars...

Monklish
12-18-2009, 03:03 PM
... no Ron, those things are not remotely similar whatsoever. You completely miss the fucking point. Drum and bass is not Kraftwerk, Kraftwerk is not tribal drum banging. But The Stray Cats ARE a deliberate attempt to recreate virtually exactly a style of music that existed in the 1950s. It's like saying The Brian Setzer Orchestra are original, and then when we say, "But Ron, they're an admitted Big Band act, Big Band being most popular in the 1930s." And then you say, "yeah, well, rap is just a cappella."

NO.

malcolmjamalawesome
12-18-2009, 03:06 PM
Ron, your post demonstrates your fundamental misunderstanding of the term a cappella.

jackstraw94086
12-18-2009, 03:08 PM
Do you have any concept of how retarded you're being? Here, allow me to demonstrate:

Okay gang, we're going to do a little exercise in Jack Theory here. I want to know what original alternative rock bands there are out there. Make sure they're definitely qualified as alternative rock, but also original and cutting a new path in music. They should be alternative rock, but not sound like other alternative rock.

You haven't caught me in a logical conundrum, you've actually just very neatly demonstrated how ridiculous this thread is.

You're the one who's talking in circles. You start a thread which by it's nature must include ALL music (because as you've just pointed out it can't really be "new" if it can be pegged to an existing genre)

Then when I pointed out how arrogant your underlying assertion is because you can't claim to be even a tiny fraction abreast of what's really new out there in music, you agreed that it's SILLY to try and discuss any an all music.

So I said fine, just admit that you're really just talking about what's relatively new in YOUR universe of music, and right on queue you begin another semantics mess.


So which is it? Would you like to just admit that you're really trying to get at what's new to YOU within pop and indie?

Monklish
12-18-2009, 03:13 PM
You haven't caught me in a logical conundrum, you've actually just very neatly demonstrated how ridiculous this thread is.

You're the one who's talking in circles. You start a thread which by it's nature must include ALL music (because as you've just pointed out it can't really be "new" if it can be pegged to an existing genre)

Then when I pointed out how arrogant your underlying assertion is because you can't claim to be even a tiny fraction abreast of what's really new out there in music, you agreed that it's SILLY to try and discuss any an all music.

So I said fine, just admit that you're really just talking about what's relatively new in YOUR universe of music, and right on queue you begin another semantics mess.


So which is it? Would you like to just admit that you're really trying to get at what's new to YOU within pop and indie?

No, you douchebag, I didn't say that it's silly to try and discuss any and all music, I said it's silly to try and throw the entire discussion out on the grounds that there's inevitably some music we haven't heard. Read again, motherfucker.

Of course I'm talking about my universe of music. And everyone else is welcome to talk about their universe of music. Here we come back around to a recurring theme in dealing with morons:

WELCOME TO THE SUBJECTIVE NATURE OF REALITY.

That's right, we're talking about what we know. We can't talk about things we don't know because we don't know those things, you fucking putz. 75 percent of the acts I've brought up are neither pop nor indie, your argument is invalid. If you have a suggestion, fucking bring it up. If you don't, walk your ass back across 8 Mile.

Mr. Dylanja
12-18-2009, 03:18 PM
Speaking of 8 mile, I think you two should take your extensive vocabularies and have a rap battle to see who's better once and for all.

JustSteve
12-18-2009, 03:18 PM
ooh, i miss the old school rap battles on here.

jackstraw94086
12-18-2009, 03:27 PM
No, you douchebag, I didn't say that it's silly to try and discuss any and all music, I said it's silly to try and throw the entire discussion out on the grounds that there's inevitably some music we haven't heard. Read again, motherfucker.

Of course I'm talking about my universe of music. And everyone else is welcome to talk about their universe of music. Here we come back around to a recurring theme in dealing with morons:

WELCOME TO THE SUBJECTIVE NATURE OF REALITY.

That's right, we're talking about what we know. We can't talk about things we don't know because we don't know those things, you fucking putz. 75 percent of the acts I've brought up are neither pop nor indie, your argument is invalid. If you have a suggestion, fucking bring it up. If you don't, walk your ass back across 8 Mile.



I never said it should be opened up to any and all forms of possible music or else it's invalid. I said the fucking inverse, Doucherod. You created a thread called "What Was The Last Original Music?" and made no attempt to at least narrow it down. Your ambiguity implied that you were accusing all music of being fucking stale. I said the premise of the thread was fucking ridiculous as it was originally laid out, and I asked you to make more sense of it by admitting that you're really talking about what's new (in relative terms) in your universe of music.

Now that you've done that I'm satisfied.


Get some better smack. Youre getting too fuzzy.

Mr. Dylanja
12-18-2009, 03:29 PM
Despite not being in rhyme form, there were a few punchlines in there.

jackstraw94086
12-18-2009, 03:40 PM
eEBoVhx_hDk....

Monklish
12-18-2009, 04:13 PM
I never said it should be opened up to any and all forms of possible music or else it's invalid. I said the fucking inverse, Doucherod. You created a thread called "What Was The Last Original Music?" and made no attempt to at least narrow it down. Your ambiguity implied that you were accusing all music of being fucking stale. I said the premise of the thread was fucking ridiculous as it was originally laid out, and I asked you to make more sense of it by admitting that you're really talking about what's new (in relative terms) in your universe of music.

Now that you've done that I'm satisfied.


Get some better smack. Youre getting too fuzzy.

How many times are we going to go over this? YOU DON'T NARROW IT DOWN BECAUSE IT'S HARD ENOUGH AS IT IS. You're glad I finally acknowledged that it was my universe of music I was talking about? Tell me, Jack, how the fuck could I have been talking about any universe of music other than my own, you punk ass motherfucker?

Monklish
12-18-2009, 04:38 PM
Reprazent is a pretty good choice though. Actual live drum and bass has to be pretty fucking original.

canexplain
12-18-2009, 04:55 PM
Randy one thing you don't realize is that if we don't agree with you, that doesn't always mean we don't get it. From the 1000's of your posts, I can see you have made some mistakes in your life, therefore, no I don't always agree with you, your thoughts and your actions, but that doesn't mean I don't get it. cr****

miscorrections
12-18-2009, 05:01 PM
That would mean a lot more coming from someone who actually did get it.

canexplain
12-18-2009, 05:11 PM
That would mean a lot more coming from someone who actually did get it.

I get it more when I am asleep then when you are burning up your little brain just trying to understand the question to put forth any sort of logical answer. cr**

miscorrections
12-18-2009, 05:13 PM
Haaaaaaaa.

Monklish
12-18-2009, 05:15 PM
I can't tell if I want that to go in the Greatest Hits thread or the Diss Archive. I want to go back and quote the whole exchange between me and Ron about Stray Cats though.

canexplain
12-18-2009, 05:25 PM
I can't tell if I want that to go in the Greatest Hits thread or the Diss Archive. I want to go back and quote the whole exchange between me and Ron about Stray Cats though.

Randy, read my later post. I was wrong on that statement. Even I make mistakes dude. cr****

Monklish
12-18-2009, 05:30 PM
http://www.coachella.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1461547&postcount=94

Ron lands in the Greatest Hits.

canexplain
12-18-2009, 05:47 PM
"Mistakes are a fact of life.
It is the response to error that counts."
Nikki Giovanni

To make mistakes is human; to stumble is commonplace; to be able to laugh at yourself is maturity.
-William Arthur Ward

Making mistakes simply means you are learning faster. -Weston Agor

Mistakes are part of the dues one pays for a full life.
~ Sophia Loren

A man should never be ashamed to own he has been in the wrong, which is but saying... that he is wiser today than he was yesterday.
~ Alexander Pope, in Swift, Miscellanies

Here does that make you guys feel better .... cr****

Monklish
12-18-2009, 05:50 PM
No, but if you continued to give me more examples of how you get it, I'd feel very good.

TomAz
12-18-2009, 06:11 PM
Did Ron really cite the Stray Cats as an original band? Is that what he's now admitting to being wrong about? Or is he claiming mea culpa to some other egregious fuckup? I can't follow him sometimes.*

anyway. Originality is shades of gray.




* - often.

Monklish
12-18-2009, 06:19 PM
Yeah that's what he's apologizing for. What's was really a lot funnier was his next diatribe after that. Check the Greatest Hits thread for a summary of events.

TomAz
12-18-2009, 06:19 PM
OK I concede on the rockabilly. It was fresh sounding when it came back as a revival type of music, but it was 30 years old then. Just to argue though. Rap is nothing but a cappella with a different beat. Hip hop is nothing but Rap with music. House/dubstep/drum and bass etc is nothing but beats, rhythums, and sounds, typically with electronics. Minus the instruments it could be 500 years old. DJ’s are nothing more but a person using a turntable or laptop in an unusual way. … Yada yada …. Cr****

oh I skimmed this one. holy cow. Ron this makes your black women comment look relatively enlightened.

wmgaretjax
12-18-2009, 06:27 PM
oh I skimmed this one. holy cow. Ron this makes your black women comment look relatively enlightened.

Dear god...

Somewhat Damaged
12-20-2009, 06:18 PM
If creating a genre is a criterion, I'm surprised nobody's mentioned either Massive Attack or Portishead. Aren't they credited with pioneering trip-hop?

pancakespancakes
12-20-2009, 06:56 PM
wow yall can't be serious. Sure Battles may have stepped it up but they are just really good math rock.

I just don't think there's much mathiness about them. Maybe we disagree about the definition of the genre - but if we're talking Don Cab, Hella, Chavez, Shellac... I just don't think Battles really fall in at all with them. Sure they have math rock roots, and the Don Cab sound is definitely all over their guitars and melodies, but they're a band that achieves most of it's style with the use of loops and effects and samples... not to mention so much of their music is in basic 4/4.

I think of the Battles components as Black Dice + Tortoise + Don Caballero. Definitely a strange, unique mix.

Monklish
12-20-2009, 07:00 PM
If creating a genre is a criterion, I'm surprised nobody's mentioned either Massive Attack or Portishead. Aren't they credited with pioneering trip-hop?

I'd thought about it but didn't want to get into an argument with anyone about what started trip hop as I'm not particularly well versed in it. I say fuck it, give it to Portishead. They did it better either way.

nbvcide
12-20-2009, 07:49 PM
Kraftwerk

Somewhat Damaged
12-20-2009, 07:50 PM
Agreed. Now let's see who's gonna rain on the parade.

EDIT: RE: Portishead.

TomAz
12-20-2009, 08:06 PM
I was going to say Kraftwerk as well, but the question is what was the last original music, not 'name some original music'. I mean if there hasn't been any original music in 35 years we're all fucked.

Monklish
12-20-2009, 08:25 PM
So did anyone have any ideas more recent than Funeral?

DFrank
12-20-2009, 08:52 PM
No, i think we're done adding to your thread.

mountmccabe
12-20-2009, 08:54 PM
I mentioned Joanna Newsom and the Fiery Furnaces, who both started around the same time as Funeral. And I'd still argue that Battles gets to go up there and Mirrored came out in 2007.

Ha.SK
12-20-2009, 08:55 PM
So I was sitting here thinking about how all music--even really really good music--is just ripping off some other music one way or another. And I started wondering when the last album I'd genuinely consider to have an original sound would have been.

Well, what do you douchebags think?

kid A

mountmccabe
12-20-2009, 08:57 PM
I'd thought about it but didn't want to get into an argument with anyone about what started trip hop as I'm not particularly well versed in it. I say fuck it, give it to Portishead. They did it better either way.

Blue Lines came out in 1991, three years before Portishead did anything.

I'mn't gonna argue that Portishead's albums weren't better than Massive's but the former def owe the latter a debt and in the context of this thread, that is what matters.

canexplain
12-20-2009, 08:58 PM
I mentioned Joanna Newsom and the Fiery Furnaces, who both started around the same time as Funeral. And I'd still argue that Battles gets to go up there and Mirrored came out in 2007.

I think the FF's were so damn screachy sp though every time I saw them. cr****

Ha.SK
12-20-2009, 08:59 PM
wow. i automatically said the first album that pop into my brain without even reading the rest of this thread.


I'd say Kid A is a solid choice, though that's probably not the most recent.

i swear im not trying to kiss ass.

nbvcide
12-20-2009, 09:13 PM
I was going to say Kraftwerk as well, but the question is what was the last original music, not 'name some original music'. I mean if there hasn't been any original music in 35 years we're all fucked.

imo the birth of electronic music was the last new genre..

everything since has been a subgenre of an existing one, or a fusion of two existing genres..

Monklish
12-20-2009, 09:15 PM
imo the birth of electronic music was the last new genre..

everything since has been a subgenre of an existing one, or a fusion of two existing genres..

Kraftwerk has so little in common with electronic music today. Nice to know that hip-hop isn't a real genre. You're a fucking idiot.

TallGuyCM
12-20-2009, 09:35 PM
kid A

Yep.

Chaplipman
12-20-2009, 09:50 PM
I mentioned Joanna Newsom and the Fiery Furnaces.

Fucking terrible. Not in this thread.

nbvcide
12-20-2009, 09:59 PM
Kraftwerk has so little in common with electronic music today. Nice to know that hip-hop isn't a real genre. You're a fucking idiot.

point out to me the origins of hip-hop that didn't involve sampling another genre, then maybe..

Monklish
12-20-2009, 10:04 PM
point out to me the origins of hip-hop that didn't involve sampling another genre, then maybe..

... if I could, I would hit you so unbelievably hard right now. That has so absolutely little to do with the question that I just wish I could break your goddamn ugly good face.

Also, Grandmaster Flash--The Message, you fucking brainless chimp motherfucker.

bmack86
12-20-2009, 10:09 PM
I think the best argument for Joanna would be Ys, anyway, which hits 06. I think that TV on the Radio might have spawned something with Return to Cookie Mountain, although we might not have heard the outporing of followers yet. That album sounds little like much before it in a specific way.

betao
12-20-2009, 10:11 PM
Sigur Ros is an excellent mention for this thread.

Also, from the 90s, Bark Psychosis (however I may get proven wrong here).

As for Randy's "dubnobasswithmyhead" comment - while it is an incredibly awesome album, Orbital had already dropped their first two albums, which sounded pretty similar musically. I think "dubno" is a better than their first release (green album, '91), and about equal to their 2nd release (brown album, '93 ), but I just don't think it can be argued as very original for it. Prodigy dropped MFTJG (also had a unique sound) in 94 and Orbital also had another album come out the same year as well.

If we're talking NIN, then I'd say its only fair to include PHM and maybe TDS. However, you could potentially argue Year Zero (which represented a major shift in sound for them). That album as a whole, with the way it was marketed and everything, should be taken note of.

What about Joy Division? although maybe we're getting too far into history if we're supposed to be discussing "recent" artists.

bmack86
12-20-2009, 10:15 PM
Bark Psychosis and Disco Inferno were both technically working within the whole idea of Post Rock, but they were so bizarre as to be something different. And, they were both so different from eachother that I think either or both would be good calls. I just figured they were too far back to have been brought up, since there's been stuff since them. GREAT BANDS!

Liars with Drum's Not Dead. Also, The Soft Bulletin was a pretty awesome reinvention of psychedelic rock. At least, how I viewed it.

paulthomasanderson
12-20-2009, 10:17 PM
As for Randy's "dubnobasswithmyhead" comment - while it is an incredibly awesome album, Orbital had already dropped their first two albums, which sounded pretty similar musically. Mind you I think "dubno" is a better than both of them, but I just don't think it can be argued as very original for it. Prodigy dropped MFTJG (also had a unique sound) in 94 and Orbital also had another album come out the same year as well.


I think what boosts it is not just the fact that it's consistently brilliant start to finish, but because it was really different but acceptable when rap and mainstream/alternative were on top of the world. Boyle's film did help them out a lot though.

And your mention of Sigur is spot on, especially in regards to Von, which is an underrated work of art. Nothing comes to close to that album...it's much akin to a trip to hell and then flown up into the skies of heaven. Then again, most of their albums followed that.

bmack86
12-20-2009, 11:51 PM
I'd like to mention Boredoms, but I'mn't sure their innovations are even really apparent as of yet. I'd give them about 5-10 more years before they're done spawning all things new and beautiful

wmgaretjax
12-21-2009, 12:27 AM
Leyland Kirby's album from this year was the last thing that did it for me... Since that... Probably Animal Collective's Here Comes The Indian.

LooseAtTheZoo
12-21-2009, 05:03 AM
I think the best argument for Joanna would be Ys, anyway, which hits 06. I think that TV on the Radio might have spawned something with Return to Cookie Mountain, although we might not have heard the outporing of followers yet. That album sounds little like much before it in a specific way.

I feel like Young Liars can be considered a more "original" sound than Return to Cookie Mountain. That was 2003?

djandrews25
12-21-2009, 12:32 PM
point out to me the origins of hip-hop that didn't involve sampling another genre, then maybe..

Tribes in africa chanting and playing drums???

ShyGuy75
12-21-2009, 12:46 PM
hot chip

hawkingvsreeve
12-21-2009, 01:41 PM
See below:

How is Bjork any different then what she was with the sugercubes only more out front. With that in mind, Bjork was/is nothing more then the a variation and somewhat different style then the sugarcubes?

cr****


I agree somewhat but I could put on a specific sugercube song and a specific bjork song and I bet you would be hard pressed to say which is which. Also on Sigur Ros. Listen to some Jon Anderson solo stuff and compaire them. cr****

I just opened this thread for the first time and only made it this far.

If you can find me Sugarcubes songs that sound like the following, I will give you five thousand dollars.

Here, I will give you a track from each record.

The Anchor Song
Possibly Maybe
Pluto
In the Musicals
Pagan Poetry
Oceania
Hope


Good luck.

PlayaDelWes
12-21-2009, 01:54 PM
Stealing this from another thread.

http://techno.org/electronic-music-guide/

The answer might just be disco.

mountmccabe
12-21-2009, 03:04 PM
I think the FF's were so damn screachy sp though every time I saw them. cr****


Fucking terrible. Not in this thread.

Y'all not liking the Fiery Furnaces has nothing to do with how original their sound was.



I think the best argument for Joanna would be Ys, anyway, which hits 06. I think that TV on the Radio might have spawned something with Return to Cookie Mountain, although we might not have heard the outporing of followers yet. That album sounds little like much before it in a specific way.

I think Ys is the better album but I'd still say that The Milk Eyed Mender was still way out there. She toured with Devendra and Vetiver (and probably other "freak folk" artists) but I don't think she sounded that much like them. Or, really, anyone else that I know of.

Also I think I need to listen to Return to Cookie Mountain again. I keep coming across compliments for it and I've long since dismissed it as not sufficiently different from the previous album except for the single and even that is just an extremely well written pop/rock song and not some new form or anything.

canexplain
12-21-2009, 03:11 PM
I just opened this thread for the first time and only made it this far.

If you can find me Sugarcubes songs that sound like the following, I will give you five thousand dollars.

Here, I will give you a track from each record.

The Anchor Song
Possibly Maybe
Pluto
In the Musicals
Pagan Poetry
Oceania
Hope


Good luck.

No the bet was I can pick the two songs and then you tell me how they are totally different. I can pick someone like Clapton and play two songs that sound so different it is crazy. Mccabe, yea I know what you are saying, I was just saying the FF aren't my cup of tea and I have tried at least three times. Debating music is like debating religion. cr****

Young blood
12-21-2009, 03:11 PM
No the bet was I can pick the two songs and then you tell me how they are totally different. I can pick someone like Clapton and play two songs that sound so different it is crazy. Mccabe, yea I know what you are saying, I was just saying the FF aren't my cup of tea and I have tried at least three times. Debating music is like debating religion. cr****

apples to dog shit?

stinkbutt
12-22-2009, 10:27 AM
this band is making some of the most original music I've heard in awhile, somewhat been done before but combining a couple genres to make a great sound

Ahkmed (http://www.myspace.com/ahkmedband)

13N5NFYgnSw

cp-jNlhLLtY