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tessalasset
04-05-2009, 10:21 PM
please no one comment on that link in here. i'm not reading it.

ivankay
04-05-2009, 10:24 PM
i so almost clicked that link, but i'm currently in my present and don't know my future yet; but whatever happens, happened.

apostle2
04-05-2009, 10:26 PM
second on the no comments request, I want this thread to remain spoiler-free

chairmenmeow47
04-06-2009, 11:05 AM
NO SPOILERS!

but thanks for thinking of us :)

and the dark ufo article was awesome.

fikus222
04-06-2009, 11:31 AM
Ben's gunshot wound discrepancy is bothering me and I don't buy the dark ufo explanation that the island caused it.

signmeup
04-06-2009, 02:50 PM
Sorry for teh spoiler, im a bit dissapointed in reading it myself but it did answer a few questions :\

ivankay
04-06-2009, 02:55 PM
Sorry for teh spoiler, im a bit dissapointed in reading it myself but it did answer a few questions :\

No need to apologize. You did it right. You warned us and put up the link as opposed to copying and pasting it here. Once the episode is past, blab away.

signmeup
04-06-2009, 02:56 PM
also i dont know if anyone mentioned this:

http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Ellie

fikus222
04-06-2009, 05:51 PM
also i dont know if anyone mentioned this:

http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Ellie

So that's the Ellie they were referring to...I like her, she's hot and a bad ass to boot.

chairmenmeow47
04-07-2009, 08:22 AM
Ben's gunshot wound discrepancy is bothering me and I don't buy the dark ufo explanation that the island caused it.

i'm having trouble with this as well. i re-watched last night. sayid clearly shoots ben through the left side of his chest, but everything from last week's episode has the wound on the right side. it's hard to tell exactly where because of blood and bandages, but it didn't seem to move in that episode. very strange, not sure i buy the theory as well, but it's an interesting one at least.

and was there any question as to which ellie they were talking about?!

fikus222
04-07-2009, 10:10 AM
and was there any question as to which ellie they were talking about?!

I had forgotten about her. It'll be nice to see the little firebrand again.

tessalasset
04-07-2009, 10:17 AM
so they don't think this is the same elli as the old woman who brought them back?

chairmenmeow47
04-07-2009, 10:21 AM
i think the site just doesn't have official confirmation that the ellie from 1954 is the same eloise hawking (daniel's mother) of 2007 or whatever. they have a theory page here (http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Ellie/Theories) though.

fikus222
04-07-2009, 10:26 AM
so they don't think this is the same elli as the old woman who brought them back?

That's the theory.

kitt kat
04-07-2009, 11:38 AM
i think the site just doesn't have official confirmation that the ellie from 1954 is the same eloise hawking (daniel's mother) of 2007 or whatever. they have a theory page here (http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Ellie/Theories) though.

didn't faraday recognize her when they were captured?

hm.

chairmenmeow47
04-07-2009, 11:55 AM
he said she looked familiar.

you'd think you'd have some idea of what your mother looked like when she was young, but then again if she was living on some crazy island in her younger days, i doubt there were many photo ops, lol.

fikus222
04-07-2009, 10:29 PM
(old) Eloise Hawking just gave Jim Carey a blow-job in Yes Man.

chairmenmeow47
04-08-2009, 08:52 AM
ewww!

and today is going to be the longest day ever!!!!

Young blood
04-08-2009, 01:51 PM
So excited. From last weeks preview......!!!!!

Cancersticks1
04-08-2009, 06:13 PM
That was fucking awesome.

BobCaygeon
04-08-2009, 06:44 PM
That was fucking awesome.

Hint to myself for next week: Don't read the list of guest actors at the beginning.

Young blood
04-08-2009, 07:14 PM
top 3 lost eps. so far.

I love when they focus on the science and religion aspects and less on the drama.

sddoctor
04-08-2009, 09:22 PM
great episode. smokey! temple! Locke! Ben!

shakermaker113
04-08-2009, 09:32 PM
what were those last things ben uttered? the last thing he said to his daughter, and then what he said to ben. I didn't catch either.

signmeup
04-08-2009, 11:07 PM
awesome!

bballarl
04-08-2009, 11:54 PM
+50 to this episode.

Oh hey, I'm John Locke, and I win the game.

tessalasset
04-09-2009, 12:10 AM
i almost cried when ben was about to shoot penny and she was screaming at her son to go inside. like i was SO fucking relieved desmond showed up. i don't think i could have handled that.

and i almost cried when alex showed up.

ben's so good at faking emotion tho - it looked like he was genuinely choked up when she showed up and when the monster was making him relive it. but once she got all psycho he just easily snapped out of it. i wonder how that wouldnt have just fucked him up more.

fikus222
04-09-2009, 12:46 AM
Very good episode...I was actually surprised we got as much as we did...Whidmore, Desmond/Penny, Rousseau, dead Alex, Egyptian Gods communing with Smoke Monsters and so on. I find it hilarious that Alex called Ben out on him planning to kill Locke again. Now Ben's gotta be Locke's b!tch for awhile :D

bartelby
04-09-2009, 04:53 AM
the best thing is that Locke knows it and will hopefully have Ben do all types of humiliating things

ivankay
04-09-2009, 05:53 AM
Bad ass episode. From the way Charles carried himself and his hair do choice in 77, he's got to be the captain of the Black Rock.

bartelby
04-09-2009, 05:57 AM
but weren't they all American military?

ivankay
04-09-2009, 05:58 AM
i thought they were the Others posing as US Military after they took over the location where Jughead was.

Remember Charles paid a lot of money at the auction for the journal of the Black Rock's Captain. Sentimental value perhaps?

bartelby
04-09-2009, 06:03 AM
ah, i think you are correct sir....one really has to keep on top of their homework to be a Lost fan!

Young blood
04-09-2009, 06:20 AM
He bought the journal so he could find the coordinates back to the island.


So what does lie in the shadow of the statue?

Sexecutioner
04-09-2009, 06:26 AM
i thought they were the Others posing as US Military after they took over the location where Jughead was.

Remember Charles paid a lot of money at the auction for the journal of the Black Rock's Captain. Sentimental value perhaps?

I dont think he was captain. I think he bought that journal because he was on a mission to get back to the island and he was hoping he would find clues in the journal to help him find his way back.

edit: J beat me to it.

Sexecutioner
04-09-2009, 06:31 AM
So what does lie in the shadow of the statue?

and yea, WTF was that all about?? What happened to those other survivors to make them turn crazy all of a sudden?


And best part of the whole episode:

Ben: "you looking for this?" BAM!

That made my night. That Hector asshole was really starting to piss me off. He needed a good shotgun blast to the chest. Ben is the best character ever.

ivankay
04-09-2009, 06:37 AM
He bought the journal so he could find the coordinates back to the island.


So what does lie in the shadow of the statue?

Even with that motivation, he still could be the Captain (or a crew member).

Not sure what lies in the shadow, but that got me thinking if they weren't warped by the monster in some way like Rosueu's crew, they'd been to the Island before and somehow knew getting on that plane was a way to get back. If they were past inhabitants, using that code suggests a connection to the Egyptian care takers who probably built the temple, statue and wall. So when the sun hit the old Anubis statue, would the wheel location fall witin it's shadow?

wmgaretjax
04-09-2009, 08:23 AM
i almost cried when ben was about to shoot penny and she was screaming at her son to go inside. like i was SO fucking relieved desmond showed up. i don't think i could have handled that.

and i almost cried when alex showed up.

you need pills.

Somewhat Damaged
04-09-2009, 10:44 AM
Even with that motivation, he still could be the Captain (or a crew member).

Crew member's more likely. When Whidmore was first shown to be an Other earlier this season, back in the "Jughead" episode, I believe, he was really young. Like, mid-20s at his oldest. No way would he have been captain.

And I'm so glad Ben didn't die. He's probably my favorite character ever.

fikus222
04-09-2009, 11:27 AM
So what does lie in the shadow of the statue?

Those survivors sound like the hunters from the Lord of the Flies.

GoEastYoungMan
04-09-2009, 11:29 AM
So what does lie in the shadow of the statue?


A big ass nuke.

wmgaretjax
04-09-2009, 11:40 AM
A big ass nuke.

that was my guess.

Young blood
04-09-2009, 11:41 AM
Ahhhh good call.

kitt kat
04-09-2009, 08:06 PM
finally! ahhh yes. so many things explained....

that episode was so badass.

kitt kat
04-09-2009, 08:08 PM
what were those last things ben uttered? the last thing he said to his daughter, and then what he said to ben. I didn't catch either.

"It let me live"

ivankay
04-09-2009, 08:10 PM
A big ass nuke.

Cool, but the statue wasn't standing when they buried the nuke.

tessalasset
04-09-2009, 08:12 PM
the foot was there.

ivankay
04-09-2009, 08:13 PM
the foot was there.

Hardly enough to cast a shadow past the rocks.

i love this show sooooo much.

atom heart
04-10-2009, 05:11 AM
I'm wondering about the status of all of the "dead" people on this island. There seem to be people that are manifestations of the Smoke Monster (Eko's brother, Alex), people that manifest to tell the Losties things whose origins I can't guess beyond that the island is doing it (Time-loop cabin-building Horace, maybe Dave), island-proxies (Christian, Jacob, maybe Claire), and then there's Locke, who seems pretty substantial, but "dead is dead".


Not sure I like the idea of Ben being Locke's beck and call. Locke is a bit of a pompous bastard. I did like that we got to see that Ben WILL actually stop at something, and it's nice that it's children.

BobCaygeon
04-10-2009, 06:39 AM
I'm wondering about the status of all of the "dead" people on this island. There seem to be people that are manifestations of the Smoke Monster (Eko's brother, Alex), people that manifest to tell the Losties things whose origins I can't guess beyond that the island is doing it (Time-loop cabin-building Horace, maybe Dave), island-proxies (Christian, Jacob, maybe Claire), and then there's Locke, who seems pretty substantial, but "dead is dead".


And then there's Walt, who occasionally showed up in a similar fashion but who never was dead.

chairmenmeow47
04-10-2009, 09:00 AM
I'm wondering about the status of all of the "dead" people on this island. There seem to be people that are manifestations of the Smoke Monster (Eko's brother, Alex), people that manifest to tell the Losties things whose origins I can't guess beyond that the island is doing it (Time-loop cabin-building Horace, maybe Dave), island-proxies (Christian, Jacob, maybe Claire), and then there's Locke, who seems pretty substantial, but "dead is dead".

awesome observation. early on in the show we also saw things like horses and such too.

and whidmore being the black rock captain is retarded. he stayed young from the 1800's until the 50's and then started to age?! wtf?!

"young ben" with that black hair made him look like hitler, lol.

captncrzy
04-10-2009, 09:12 AM
"young ben" with that black hair made him look like hitler, lol.

I pointed that out to Rick when we were watching it. I was wondering if there was any significance to it.

tessalasset
04-10-2009, 09:18 AM
And then there's Walt, who occasionally showed up in a similar fashion but who never was dead.

I would put Walt in the group with Dave and the horse.

tessalasset
04-10-2009, 09:19 AM
I pointed that out to Rick when we were watching it. I was wondering if there was any significance to it.

...and this is why I love Lost. It could quite possibly just be the makeup dept had a hard time making Michael Emerson look young and accidentally made him resemble hitler but IT COULD ALSO BE A CLUE!!!@!!

fikus222
04-10-2009, 09:43 AM
...and this is why I love Lost. It could quite possibly just be the makeup dept had a hard time making Michael Emerson look young and accidentally made him resemble hitler but IT COULD ALSO BE A CLUE!!!@!!

So that's where Ben's irrational hatred for Russians stems from...j/k...maybe there is some sort of link between all of the Egyptian references and the visitations by the dead, insert Stargate reference here:

ivankay
04-10-2009, 09:47 AM
and whidmore being the black rock captain is retarded. he stayed young from the 1800's until the 50's and then started to age?! wtf?!


i was thinking about that too. If you're on the Island and down with the Others, maybe you don't age (like Richard). But when you spend time off the Island, you age. Maybe this eternal youth begins when someone matures into adulthood (why Ethan and Ben don't stay kids). The Others don't have the regular means to get off the Island until they take over the Dharma Inititive. Until then, trips off the Island may have been rare (when Richard goes to visit young Locke). When the means came about to do it more regularly (the sub), Charles began taking advantage of that and probably spent significant time away building a life that includes the family of which Penny is a part of (and the reason he gets banished). That's what i was thinking.

tessalasset
04-10-2009, 09:48 AM
i also want to know how ben and ethan went from boyhood friends to ethan at ben's beck and call. altho maybe i'm just reading too much into that.

chairmenmeow47
04-10-2009, 09:54 AM
i don't think everyone gets to be "eternal" if they are "down with the others". i think you have to do the whole loss of innocence thing in the temple.

i want to know if the smoke monster let ben live because ben did the right thing, or because ben needed to be punished and also was one of the few left who would submit to the island's will.

fikus222
04-10-2009, 10:05 AM
The Island kicked Ben's tires and determined there's still some use left in the old boy.

ivankay
04-10-2009, 10:07 AM
i don't think everyone gets to be "eternal" if they are "down with the others". i think you have to do the whole loss of innocence thing in the temple.


i was thinking that's how you became down with the Others.

atom heart
04-10-2009, 10:53 AM
Ben was allowed to live because he DID kill Alex like he was supposed to, though maybe not as intentionally as the island would have liked. Ben clearly kept saying that he killed Alex. I think he was in doubt as to how the island would interpret the lack of intentionality on his part in her death. The island thought, well there's still plenty of evil in the man, even if he does have a soft spot for kids.

Young blood
04-10-2009, 11:00 AM
Ben was allowed to live because he DID kill Alex like he was supposed to, though maybe not as intentionally as the island would have liked. Ben clearly kept saying that he killed Alex. I think he was in doubt as to how the island would interpret the lack of intentionality on his part in her death. The island thought, well there's still plenty of evil in the man, even if he does have a soft spot for kids.

ooooh leverage. I still think Ben knows more than the island. Dude has seen the future.

signmeup
04-10-2009, 11:48 AM
I'm wondering about the status of all of the "dead" people on this island. There seem to be people that are manifestations of the Smoke Monster (Eko's brother, Alex), people that manifest to tell the Losties things whose origins I can't guess beyond that the island is doing it (Time-loop cabin-building Horace, maybe Dave), island-proxies (Christian, Jacob, maybe Claire), and then there's Locke, who seems pretty substantial, but "dead is dead".


Not sure I like the idea of Ben being Locke's beck and call. Locke is a bit of a pompous bastard. I did like that we got to see that Ben WILL actually stop at something, and it's nice that it's children.


what if Locke is just the manifestation of the smoke monster? They werent seen together after all, and the part when Locke walks out of the jungle with Ben expecting the monster seemed like a clue., Probably not, but the thought struck me while watching it.

shakermaker113
04-10-2009, 05:56 PM
what if Locke is just the manifestation of the smoke monster? They werent seen together after all, and the part when Locke walks out of the jungle with Ben expecting the monster seemed like a clue., Probably not, but the thought struck me while watching it.

then the smoke monster can manifest itself off the island?

tessalasset
04-14-2009, 07:38 AM
YESSSSSS i've been waiting for this. gonna read it later.


"Dead is Dead" Recap and Analysis, by Erika
Posted by DarkUFO at 4/13/2009 04:22:00 PM (Comments: 80) Comment Pop-up
Labels: Dead is Dead, Erika Olson, Recaps

Here is the Episode 5.12 - Dead is Dead recap from Erika Olson (aka "e") from LongLiveLocke.com.

Those of you who have been following Vozzek69's posts here on DarkUFO over the years will most likely be interested in the next few paragraphs, even if you don't typically read my recaps. There is a situation presently unfolding that affects this site, its writers and its community.

KARMA POLICE
ARREST THIS MAN

Those of you connected to me on Facebook and/or following me on Twitter are already aware of this situation, but for the rest of you, allow me to provide a brief summary of how I've been spending 90% of my time since Thursday afternoon. I haven't been working on this episode recap, that's for sure. No, instead of writing, I've been filing copyright infringement claims and talking to intellectual property attorneys after it was brought to my attention (thank you, thank you, THANK YOU reader "Andre from Germany") that a video blogger who goes by "Seanie B" (yes, I feel silly writing that) has been passing off parts of my posts, and other Lost recappers' posts, as his own. As in, word for word. As in, over 20% of the content in one of this guy's videos came directly from one of my recaps. And it is much, much worse for Vozzek69, who also writes for this site. Vozzek69's content has been lifted by Seanie B since episode one of this season, and there's a good chance that some of his Season Four posts have been plagiarized as well (it takes a long time to document these things, so we're still going through the videos).

As of right now, this situation has not yet been worked out to our satisfaction. You can see proof of Seanie B's blatant plagiarism at our good friend Jon Lachonis' Doc Artz & Friends site. It is not possible for me to thank Jon enough for all that he has done to help bring this issue to light and support me and Vozzek69 in our quest to resolve this situation. Jon went spectacularly above and beyond in putting together a side-by-side comparison of my blog and Seanie B's video, and I guarantee your jaw will drop when you watch it. (For those of you who use Digg, please Digg this article.) Anyone who commentates on Lost is bound to mention ideas or theories that others have already thought of or written about, but that's not what we're referring to here. We're talking about shameless, word-for-word content theft from copyrighted sites, which is illegal. Trust me, I've checked into it.

Since it's now 4 PM on Easter Sunday and I'm just starting this recap (whereas on a typical week by this point I would have already put in about twelve solid hours of writing), my take on "Dead is Dead" is going to be shorter and less in-depth than usual. I actually considered reader CCW's suggestion that I "only write about how hot Desmond is" from here on out so that Seanie B is less likely to steal my work. But honestly, not only am I mentally and physically exhausted from dealing with this unfortunate situation for the better part of 72 hours, but I also simply don't feel like writing. To make things even worse, Walgreens and CVS are sold out of Cadbury creme eggs, so I can't even drown my sorrows in chocolate.

So, thank you for understanding why this post isn't all that inspired and currently doesn't have any screencaps (I may add some later, but they take more time than I have to upload right now). If you've been reading my recaps for any length of time, then you know how much work I put into them. You know I do this because I love the show -- I don't make any money whatsoever off of this site. You know that I think the online community of Lost fans is a group I'm very proud to be a part of, and the outpouring of support I've received over the past three days is a testament to what intelligent, thoughtful and ethical people are out there watching this series. That's why it had to be a priority for me this weekend to help stop someone who was illegally passing off my content and my friends' content (and artwork) as his own. After all, as Mr. Benjamin Linus has been known to say, "We're the good guys!"


OK... on to "Dead is Dead." From the messages I've been receiving, it seems that a lot of people didn't like this episode. However, I'm in the camp that did. How could I not enjoy Ben and Locke bickering for the better part of an hour?


A HORSE IS A HORSE
OF COURSE
OF COURSE

I'm sure I wasn't the only one who cocked her head to the side and said, "Huh?" as Long-Haired Widmore galloped through the Hostiles' camp on a noble steed. I really wasn't expecting that Chuck On a Horse would kick off this episode, and immediately wondered if perhaps I'd accidentally switched over to some channel that was airing one of the many Robin Hood movies. But no, it was Lost, and the action was still in 1977, right after "Whatever Happened, Happened" left off.

Widmore caught wind that Richard had saved "one of them," and cold-busted over to confront the Ageless One about it. Richard was in no mood to let such an unkempt man give him the business, though. "Jacob wanted it done. The Island chooses who the Island chooses. You know that," he replied coolly.

Can we take Richard at his word? Was he really instructed by Jacob to save Little Ben? Adult Ben told Locke that he was the only Other who had ever communicated with Jacob. This could of course simply be Ben's 4,223rd lie, but if he was telling the truth for once, then that means Richard acted on his own when he brought Ben to The Temple. It's not like we saw or heard a creepy "Saaaaave hiiiimmmm" whisper. Yet, on the other hand, Richard clearly knew who Jacob was back in 1954 when Locke name-dropped him, so chances are that Ben was lying and Richard has been in touch with Jacob from the very beginning (whenever that was).

Since almost everything about Jacob remains a mystery, we're probably not going to get clarity on his interaction and relationship with any of the other characters any time soon.


THE GIRL IS MINE
MINE, MINE
YEP, SHE'S MINE

First I was surprised to see Widmore on a horse, then I was surprised to see that he actually treated Little Ben pretty kindly when the two future-enemies first met. He ensured Little Ben that even though they'd have to return him to Dharmaland, Ben would always be one of the Hostiles.

The next flashback we see is in either 1988 or 1989, and Rousseau is alone in her tent with newborn Baby Alex. I was certainly expecting the whole kidnapping scene to go down a lot differently than it did, weren't you? I had envisioned dozens of Hostiles descending upon Rousseau's tent -- perhaps even with Harry Potter-like Invisibility Cloaks on or something -- and then some sort of magical force would freeze Rousseau while she watched in horror as her daughter vanished in front of her eyes. Instead, it was an approximately 23-year-old Ben who did the deed calmly and quickly, all within less than a few minutes. And Pre-Teen Ethan was with him, of all people.

That didn't make the scene any less heartbreaking to watch, though.

Ben and Ethan return with Baby Alex to the Hostiles' camp. Widmore is not happy about this at all, and said that Ben should "kill it"... "it" being poor little Alex. After I heard those two words, all notions I ever had that Widmore might be the good guy evaporated. I now am confident that he is a... what's the word? It starts with a "b"... and ends with "astard"...?

Ben drops the J-bomb and tests Widmore by saying, "Is killing this baby what Jacob wants? Then here she is. You do it." But we all know Widmore let Alex live... albeit only for sixteen more years.

A few things to note/question from these scenes:

1) Although it wasn't explicitly stated, I can only assume (from what we know transpired in other episodes) that both Ben and Ethan were still living in the Barracks at that point in time, and that their interaction with and visiting of the Hostiles was on the down-low, and only during the wee hours.

2) Since Pre-Teen Ethan is accepted among the Hostiles, that either confirms the suspicions that his mom Amy is an Other, or something else happened with Ethan between 1977-1988 that we don't know about yet.

3) Ben took Alex to live with him in the Barracks. If he was still posing as a Dharma member, though, how in the heck did he explain suddenly having a baby?

4) Finally, as Ben told Rousseau to "run the other way" whenever she heard whispers, does that definitively tie the Others to the whispers? Are we ever going to get any more information about the whispers... like why they're only heard at certain times, how they're able to repeat phrases from a character's off-Island life, or who exactly is making them? I'm not so sure we will... this may be one of those mysteries left unexplained at the end of the series.


IF I NEVER SEE YOUR FACE AGAIN
I DON'T MIND

Next, we see Ben and what looks to be a five or six-year-old Alex bonding on the swing set in the Barracks. Richard interrupts them to inform Ben that Widmore's about to go buh-bye. As the Hostiles are using Dharma's sub to ship Widmore back to the mainland, we can assume this scene takes place at some point after the 1992 Purge.

Just like The Swiping of Alex, The Banishment of Widmore wasn't exactly what I thought it would be. Many of us had assumed that he'd turned the Frozen Donkey Wheel, and that's why he could never find the Island again. At the very least I figured there would be some sort of hocus-pocus element to getting Charles off of his favorite rock. But no, he was just handcuffed and escorted down the dock and into the submarine, never to return.

Not before he had these ominous words for Ben, though...

WIDMORE: Are you quite certain you want to do this, Benjamin?
BEN: You left the Island regularly. You had a daughter with an outsider. You broke the rules, Charles.
WIDMORE: And what makes you think you deserve to take what's mine?
BEN: Because I won't be selfish. Because I'll sacrifice anything to protect this Island.
WIDMORE: You wouldn't sacrifice Alex.
BEN: You're the one who wanted her dead, Charles, not the Island.
WIDMORE: I hope you're right, Benjamin, because if you aren't, and it is the Island that wants her dead, she'll be dead. And one day, you'll be standing where I'm standing now. You'll be the one being banished, and then you'll finally realize that you cannot fight the inevitable. I'll be seeing you, boy.

I definitely got chills during the "she'll be dead" part.

What's going on here? (And just to make some of what I'm going to say below a little easier to write out, let's assume Widmore left the Island in 1993, even though we have no concrete proof of that.)

1) Between 1993 and 2004, something must have changed with the Others' "rules," because we all know that Ben, Tom/Zeke and Richard have left the Island before. Perhaps if anyone left on "Others Business" it was OK, but if Charles was going to shore just to, um, get his freak on, then that was not OK.

2) On that note, who was this "outsider" he had a child (presumably Penny) with? Could it be Ellie/Ms. Hawking -- was she gone from the Island by that time? And would she really ever be considered an outsider since she was not only a Hostile in 1954, but also seemed to be working on behalf of the Island when she met Desmond in 1996, and then obviously when she helped get the O5 on Ajira 316 in 2007? If Ellie is Widmore's sister, as many have theorized, then perhaps the identity of Widmore's wife/lover is unimportant. All that matters is that the Hostiles frowned upon his involvement with this mystery woman.

3) Were Rousseau and Alex truly "not meant to live"? Why would the Island want them dead? Were their murders the universe's or Island's way of course-correcting what should have happened sixteen years prior? Or were their deaths what most of us saw them as: awful events that can be blamed on Widmore (and Keamy)?


WAITING FOR YOUR CHANGE OF HEART
IT JUST TAKES A BEAT
TO TURN IT AROUND

By the time we got to the scene with Ben at the marina, I was beside myself with glee over how awesome all of the flashbacks had been. There's no denying that some serious pieces of the puzzle fell into place in this episode. But because (during the real-time events) Ben had told Sun to pass along his apologies should she ever see Desmond again, I was bracing for something horrible to go down once Ben aimed his gun at Penny.

Thankfully, Little Charlie ran out onto the deck of Our Mutual Friend in all of his mop-headed glory, and Ben hesitated just long enough to allow Desmond to spring on him and pummel him senseless. Speaking of Desmond, did anyone else think that the reason there was no blood when Ben fired at him wasn't because of a strategically placed can of beans, but rather because the Island won't let him die? That maybe Ms. Hawking knew what she was talking about in "316" when she said the Island's not done with him yet?

Now, before I end with my analysis of the flashbacks, I have to bring up one more thing. Let's rewind a little bit and talk about the scene where Ben called Widmore to inform him that he was about to kill Penny in revenge for Alex's death. During their tense chat, Ben also told Widmore that he would be returning to the Island later that same day, to which Charles replied, "The Island won't let you come back, trust me. I've spent almost 20 years trying to return."

I wouldn't have thought twice about this line until reader JH-Z sent me a message and asked why the math didn't add up. Don't know what she's talking about? Consider this:

- It was probably 1993 or 1994 when Charles was banished from the Island. We know this because we know Alex was sixteen when she was killed, and she was definitely killed in 2004. The fact that she looked to be about six years old when Ben was pushing her on the swing is in line with this.
- So Alex's timeline makes sense... but Widmore's definitely does not. Miles stated earlier this season that Widmore had been looking for the Island for twenty years. Now Charles just repeated this same number to Ben on the phone. But, um, twenty years from 1993 would be the year 2013. So what in the @#(#*$(&*@ is going on?!?!

My dear friends, I'm at a loss. Because of the drama I referenced at the beginning of this post, I have not have a chance to investigate this mystery at all. So I put it out there for you to think about... and I'm sure you'll let me know if another Lost blog has cracked it. Off of the top of my head, the only two high-level explanations I can think of are: 1) It's another innocent goof, similar to what happened with Charlotte's age, or 2) it is a huge clue. Since Charles repeated the "twenty years" line in this episode, though, I have to think it's a clue. But my mind can't process anything beyond that. Sorry!



Consider the flashbacks covered... now onto the Island.


TOGETHER AGAIN

Ben woke up to find Alive Locke looking down at him. Talk about awkward... but of course Ben quickly recovered and claimed that he figured Locke would probably bounce back from his murder-by-strangulation. Then he's like, "But don't you judge me... let's let The Monster judge me." (Did anyone feel a bit weird hearing two grown men talk about "The Monster" throughout the episode? I mean, I know "Smokey" isn't any better, but I really wish the writers had chosen to give Ben a clue about the real name for The Monster. Like "Cerberus" or whatever else we've all been thinking it might really be called.)

In the very next scene, Ben was up to his old tricks, trying to convince Caesar that Locke is one suspicious bald dude. I was totally shocked... I had really thought that Ben would be on his best behavior once he realized that the Island brought Locke back to life. However, a few scenes later, everything made sense; Ben had taken the sawed-off shotgun from Caesar during their little chat, and then used it to kill him when he stood in the way of Locke and Ben heading out to the main Island.

Color me surprised once more -- I certainly did not expect Caesar to leave us so soon. We may still see a flashback on him or something, but I sure was totally off in my "He's Our You" recap, in which I proposed that Caesar, not Ilana, was going to be the Important New Character. I'll get to her a little bit later, though.



THE BOYS ARE BACK IN TOWN

Ben and Locke made it safely to the main Island, and Locke waited outside while Ben went into his old home to see why a light was on. Now -- trust me -- I have not forgotten that Ben is a master manipulator and serial liar, but I honestly believe that he did not know: 1) who Christian was (when Frank referenced him) or 2) that some of the 815ers were in living among Dharma members in the '70s (when he saw the orientation picture Sun handed him). Could Ben truly be unaware of the time travel the 815ers have experienced? And does that mean that they were all gone by the time he returned to Dharmasville as a young boy?

Locke joined the group inside, and when Frank saw that he was no longer dead, he's like "THAT'S IT! If I don't find me a bottle of Jack Daniels right quick, I'm going to spontaneously combust!" He must've figured his chances of coming across the hard stuff would be better back on Hydra island, so he bid adieu to Sun and ran off before anything else supernatural could happen.

Before I move on from this scene, I have to share one thought that popped into my mind when I heard Sun say that Christian told her that if she wanted to see her husband again, she'd have to wait for Locke. I couldn't help but wonder if the torch was being passed, so to speak, from one Island Zombie to another. Now, you all know that I personally do not want to believe that Locke might not be 100% alive anymore. But I have to keep what I want to happen and what I think could be happening separate... and between Sun's comment and some of the other things that I'll talk about shortly, I have to begrudgingly admit that Locke might not be as flesh and blood as he once was.


I'VE BEEN A BAD, BAD GIRL

Let's jump back to Hydra for a moment. Frank makes his way up the beach, and he's all, "For the love of God, has anyone found the stash of mini-bottles of booze from the plane yet?" But the rest of the 316ers had much bigger issues to worry about. Ilana and some meathead dude (and I think two other guys) were now armed with rifles, and were working on opening a huge metal crate.

Frank is asked, "What lies in the shadow of the statue?" and he's like, "Are you serious? Is this a joke? Dammit, I thought Ben and Locke were the freak-shows... why did I come back here?" But it was too late for our favorite pilot... he was taken to be tied up.

Obviously the riddle Ilana rattled off was similar to the "What did one snowman say to the other snowman?" joke that both Kelvin and Desmond posed to Swan hatch intruders. Does that mean that Ilana is part of a "new Dharma" that's attempting to re-establish itself on the Island? That would definitely jibe with the events of last summer's Comic-Con, where Dharma was looking for fresh recruits (yes, it was all an elaborate marketing effort for the show, but you get my point).

Regardless of what group Ilana represents, how did they find out about Ajira 316, what's in the crate, and what are they going to do now? Is this all part of "the war" that's coming to the Island, which Widmore warned Locke about?

All I know for sure is that I do not like Ilana, and that thick-necked guy is already bugging me, too. They better not hurt our Frank or there will be hell to pay!



SMOKE GETS IN YOUR EYES

And now for the climactic finale...

Locke tells Sun that he can't help her find Jin until Ben checks "GET JUDGED BY SMOKEY" off of his to-do list. Next, a bunch of exceedingly bizarre things happen:

1) Ben goes into his secret room and calls Smokey by draining out a nasty pool of slop. ?!?
2) Locke walks off into the jungle after he apparently told Sun that he had something to take care of. ?!?
3) Ben tells Sun that he has never seen the Island bring somebody back to life, and the fact that it seems to have done just that with Locke frightens the holy hell out of him. ?!?
4) Ben warns Sun that something is about to come out of the jungle that he can't control, and so she better take cover inside. Shortly thereafter... Locke comes out of the jungle. ?!?

And then finally, the scene we'd all been waiting for. Bring on Smokey!

Locke says that they're going to have to go under the Temple in order for Ben to accomplish his task. I don't have the brain-power right now to process what that could mean, but I'm sure it means something. Just like I'm sure it means something that Locke knew where to go to find Smokey in the first place, and Ben didn't.

Sun, who tagged along, falls behind once the two men head underground. Ben tumbles through a break in the structure, and while Locke runs off to find a vine for Ben to pull himself up with, Ben explores the chamber he's landed in. Hieroglyphics abound, and the camera focuses on one that appears to be Smokey and The Statue God in a face-off. Even though I was aboard the Taweret Theory Train in my "LaFleur" write-up, I'll admit that if the four-toed statue is meant to be the same Egyptian god depicted in the carving Ben saw in this episode, then it's most likely Anubis.

Ben didn't get much more time to snoop around, though, because up rose Smokey through a vent in the floor. As a cloud of black smoke surrounded him, Ben's life literally flashed before his eyes, just like we saw happen when Mr. Eko had his first face-off with the monster. I have to admit, there was a teeny, teeny part of me that was worried that this was the last we'd see of Mr. Linus. But then a voice inside my head said, "Are you a freakin' idiot? Because the producers aren't -- Michael Emerson has scored two Emmy nominations for his role on this show -- he ain't goin' nowhere."

And sure enough, he survived. But he wasn't totally in the clear until Apparition Alex had her way with him. "I don't care WHAT baldy tells you to do... you will do it and you will like it! And you will stop plotting his second death, fool!"

Ben's like, "Geez, OK, I get it... ohandbythewayI'msorryIletKeamykillyou." And then Alex was gone.

Mysteriously, as soon as Smokey and Apparition Alex vanished, Locke reappeared, adding credence to the theory that Locke might either BE Smokey or somehow be controlling him. I certainly hope it's not the former, but definitely think the latter is a possibility. However, before Locke was on the Island, and before Christian was on the Island, we saw Smokey attack Danielle's group. So if a person controls/summons/unleashes Smokey, who was controlling him then? That's why I think it may just be a coincidence that Locke's appearances and disappearances were seemingly timed with Smokey's coming and goings.


That's it, folks! Be sure you read the section after the Best Lines for a note about the timing of my next post...


BEST LINES OF THE EPISODE

BEN: What has he told you?

CAESAR: When you were out cold, he was watching over you. And he said you killed him.
BEN: I killed him? Really? 'Cause he looks fine to me.



LOCKE: Well, Ben, I was hoping that you and I could talk about the elephant in the room.

BEN: I assume you're referring to the fact that I killed you.



LOCKE: Looks like we're not the first ones who decided to tie up here.

BEN: That would be Sun and Lapidus. I showed 'em where the boats were, and Sun thanked me by smashing me on the head with a paddle.



BEN: No. Someone else hurt my arm.

LOCKE: You just make friends everywhere you go, don't ya?



BEN: The man was unarmed because I'd stolen his gun--the gun he was going to use to kill you. I couldn't let that happen.

LOCKE: No sense in me dying twice, right?

BEN: You're welcome.



BEN (looks at 1977 Dharma orientation picture): Of course not. Where did you get this? Who gave this to you?
LAPIDUS: We met some crazy old man outside. He said his name was Christian. [e: This probably wasn't meant to be funny, but I thought it was.]



SUN: What you're saying, it's... impossible.

LOCKE: But here I am. I don't know how, I don't know why, but I'm sure there's a very good reason for it.
LAPIDUS: As long as the dead guy says there's a reason, well, then I guess everything's gonna be just peachy. And forget about the fact that the rest of your people are supposedly 30 years ago... now the only ones who are here to help us are a murderer and a guy who can't seem to remember how the hell he got out of a coffin.



LOCKE: You don't like this, do you?

BEN: What?

LOCKE: Having to ask questions that you don't know the answers to, blindly following someone in the hopes that they'll lead you to whatever it is you're looking for.

BEN: No, John, I don't like it at all.

LOCKE: Well, now you know what it was like to be me.


LOCKE: What happened?

BEN: It let me live.




PROGRAMMING NOTES

- I will be traveling this coming weekend and the one after that, so I will not have my recap of the April 15 episode up by Monday, April 20, and am not exactly sure when it will be done. But that's OK, because there's not a new episode on April 22.

- Instead, there's a clip show entitled "The Story of the Oceanic Six" that will air on the 22nd, and during that time I will be joining Ryan from Zap2It's Guide to Lost for a live chat about our favorite show. As soon as I have the final details about that chat, I will post them on LongLiveLocke.com so that you can hopefully join us and banter about the show with other Lost fans in real-time. (Side note: Ryan wrote a very nice article about the Seanie B plagiarism drama here, please check it out.)

Thanks again to everyone who wrote me messages of support over the last few days. I haven't been able to respond to all of them, but I have definitely read each and every one, and you have no idea how much they've meant to me.

Until next time,

- e

chairmenmeow47
04-14-2009, 08:47 AM
yay, airplane reading for tomorrow!!!!!!!!

GoEastYoungMan
04-16-2009, 06:57 AM
Anybody get a good look at what Jack was erasing from the blackboard?

invisiblerobots
04-16-2009, 07:12 AM
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e121/anil31/lost/season%205/513chalkboard.jpg

Young blood
04-16-2009, 08:47 AM
Last nights eps. was cool.

Quick theories,

Miles causes his dad to lose his arm.

Miles and Hurley and somehow this Jacob character try to blow up the swan hatch leading to the button being needed to be pushed. They are also lost in space and time giving them the ability to see and communicate with the dead.

The people who picked up miles in the van and that are on the island are farradays cult. They are looking for the memoir/diary/time capsule of how to travel to the beginning of the island and have control of the world, or create the world as we/actors know it.

Cancersticks1
04-16-2009, 12:53 PM
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e121/anil31/lost/season%205/513chalkboard.jpg

At this point I'm convinced that all of the Egyptian shit is massive misdirection. They're beating us over the head with it, which seems really uncharacteristic of Lost.

Cancersticks1
04-16-2009, 12:56 PM
Last nights eps. was cool.

Quick theories,

Miles causes his dad to lose his arm.

Miles and Hurley and somehow this Jacob character try to blow up the swan hatch leading to the button being needed to be pushed. They are also lost in space and time giving them the ability to see and communicate with the dead.

The people who picked up miles in the van and that are on the island are farradays cult. They are looking for the memoir/diary/time capsule of how to travel to the beginning of the island and have control of the world, or create the world as we/actors know it.

Why would Miles cause his dad to lose an arm? I agree that Hurley will try to sabotage the Swan, but Miles seems pretty firm in the "Whatever Happened, Happened" way of thinking. And I'd be pretty disappointed if Jacob turned out to be a Dharma flunky. And Farraday cult? What?

tessalasset
04-16-2009, 01:24 PM
At this point I'm convinced that all of the Egyptian shit is massive misdirection. They're beating us over the head with it, which seems really uncharacteristic of Lost.

good point cancer.

Young blood
04-16-2009, 01:26 PM
Why would Miles cause his dad to lose an arm? I agree that Hurley will try to sabotage the Swan, but Miles seems pretty firm in the "Whatever Happened, Happened" way of thinking. And I'd be pretty disappointed if Jacob turned out to be a Dharma flunky. And Farraday cult? What?




I think Miles causing candle to lose his arm might be the star wars tie in. Some like it hoth. Luke, vadar. ect. I agree he's tied to whatever happened, happens, but the thing is he doesn't know what happens im sure it is all an accident. The same accident that causes Hurley to destroy or stop the destruction of the hatch, miles helping, and candle losing an arm. ( just a theory)


It looked like a bunch of college kids in a van that tried to kidnap Miles. I think Faraday started a cult/club to get Dharma going again.(see comic con video 08).


Also....darkufo...


Things I Noticed - "Some Like It Hoth" by Vozzek69
Posted by DarkUFO at 4/16/2009 07:47:00 PM (Comments: 53) Comment Pop-up
Labels: Recaps, Some Like It Hoth, Vozzek69

If you were like me, then you had the awesome Rebel trench base with the big rotating gun, collapsing bridge, and the pop-off Probot from Star Wars The Empire Strikes Back. What's this got to do with LOST? Not much. But I loved that little freakin' base. And I can't find fault in any episode of LOST that makes reference to Hoth. Things I Noticed:

Yeah, Sure... I'll Go
If you ask Neo, he'll tell you that the white rabbit always holds the key . Young Miles knows this through the use of his gift, channeling Haley Joel Osment to see things a 7-yr old kid would rather not see. And as the dead man from apartment 4's voice still echoes in Miles' head, Lara starts to realize that her son might've brought back a little tropical strangeness with him when they were exiled, Widmore-style, from spook island.
Some Like it Hoth is obviously a Star Wars reference, but that's only half of it. Some Like it Hot was an old movie about two musicians who witness the St. Valentine's Day massacre; the story details their attempted escape from the city before the mob can kill them. You can make a loose comparison to Hurley and Miles here, with at least one of them having indirectly witnessed a massacre (the Purge), and together they make dialogue this episode on how to avoid or somehow escape it. Hopefully they don't dress up like women, though.

Hot, heat, temperature... these things are found all throughout this episode. From the single white fire extinguisher on the door in the opening scene to row after row or red ones Miles passes as he walks along the rows of apartments. There's a picture of a volcano spewing lava in the schoolhouse next to Jack. There's a poster behind Naomi in the restaurant kitchen that reads 'Think about Temperature'. Things are about to heat up, and we're all getting a sense of it. As Juliet would say "Here we go".


Punk Miles Should've Hooked up with Goth Claire
I think that would've made Aaron a lot more interesting. And it's a good thing he didn't go anywhere near the magnetic anomaly with all that stuff in his face.


Hard Hats, 10-Ton Cranes, Underwater Stations, and a Big-Ass Sonic Fence
Is there a Home Depot nearby or something? Where does Dharma get the manpower or materials to make all this crap? Multiple stations across multiple islands, a whole damned zoo, cameras monitoring what must be a miles-long perimeter of encampment guarded by the best mid-70's sonic technology... hell, the Looking Glass alone must've taken a team of engineers, hundreds of workers, and assloads of time. And now we're treated to the construction of our beloved Swan hatch, and on the other side of the truce-line too.

Were the Others on vacation for a few years? How'd they not know about all this stuff? It's one thing to live peacefully with other inhabitants... but letting someone turn your sacred island into a multi-decade construction zone is quite another. My point here is this: is Chang's ultra-cool camouflage jungle-fence really what's keeping the Others in the dark here? What's their plan for drowning out the sound of 10-ton cranes and jackhammers? You got me.

And so as Miles joins Ben Stiller in the circle of trust, I'm not so sure it's really needed. Something must be happening during this time period to really occupy the Others' time. Either that, or they're not opposed to new construction. LOTS of new construction. You guys tell me, because I'm baffled. Much of the stuff Dharma does is largely bullshit, as evidenced by Chang's derision over the polar bear fecal studies and what we saw of those poor saps in the Pearl launching message tubes of gibberish into the jungles of nowhere. Maybe the Others (wrongly) hoped Dharma would just spin their wheels for a while before finding nothing significant and going away.

I thought it ironic though, to see Radzinsky overseeing the excavation of the Swan hatch. Unknown to him, he's digging his own grave.


Seems It Never Rains in Southern California...
This song was very interesting in that all of a sudden, I realized it might be right. We've seen rain come and go very quickly all throughout LOST - during deaths, impending events, right before the whispers, and recently on and off throughout the time skips. But ever since everyone arrived at 70's Dharma? I can't think of a single time it rained. If I forgot one please remind me, but yeah, it hasn't rained on-island in a long, long while now. Does this mean they're all in Southern California? No comment. I will however, agree with the last line of the chorus: it's going to pour.


Behold! My Swingset Theory
AGAIN we see the swingset. That makes 10 or 11 separate times now. Last week I suggested that soon the swingset might need its own flashback episode, and maybe I wasn't kidding. Tonight we see that there are actually two swingsets, one of them being the evil mirror (bad) twin of the other! So here's my theory: in the last episode of LOST, the screen blurs to pure white... when it finally fades back into focus every one of our main characters is just a little kid playing on the same swingset. All the people who've ever died were merely called into the house for supper. The camera pans in on Vincent, sleeping in the grass under the see-saw, and then the LOST logo slams onto the screen with a thunderclap. Cue credits, and about 60 million angry phone calls.


Jack's Janitorial and Damage Control Clean-up Service
There was lots of juicy writing on that blackboard behind Jack, all having to do with Egyptian mythology. When dealing with clues that obvious, I usually don't put much stock into them. More interesting though, was the way Jack erased the boards from right to left, one board at a time. It kinda reminded me of someone showing a list of possible answers, and then one-by-one removing the wrong ones until only the correct answer remains. Not sure if that was the case here though.

I thought Jack's handling of Roger's suspicions was pretty terrible. His intentions were to protect Kate, but his actions were foolish. He would've been better off pretending not to know Kate at all, then clapping Roger on the shoulder and telling him he's just being paranoid. Offer to drink a beer or two with him later, and the whole thing's done. Instead, I think Jack's defense of Kate made Roger even more suspicious.

And if you think the "Use Your Imagination" poster behind Jack was only referring to Arts & Crafts day, think again. Ditto for the butterfly.


I Can Talk To Dead People - Anytime, *Anywhere! (*certain cremation rules may apply)
As we endure yet more flashback daddy-issues pushed upon us by the writers of LOST, we get to see how Miles uses his unwanted gift to pay off what must be some pretty exorbitant Hot Topic bills. We learn that his abilities are limited to the vicinity of the corpse, and that not being near the body prevents him from being able to commune with that person. We also learn, through his explanation to Hurley, that he can't really "speak" with the dead at all. His knowledge is limited to their own knowledge and thoughts up to the point where they died.

I have to say, this seems pretty inconsistent with what we saw in Confirmed Dead. Didn't Miles talk back and forth with that dead woman's grandson? And didn't he answer Miles by knocking on the wall to show him where his bankroll was hidden? This goes against the residual life-only information Miles claims to have privy to, and points more toward what my good buddies at GhostHunters would call an 'intelligent' haunting. But maybe the scriptwriters changed their minds since then, so who knows.

It doesn't really matter for poor Mr. Gray, who gets a very unwanted refund. Miles gave this guy his money back because he didn't want him to let him off the hook for the same type of thing his father did to him. The funny part here is that Miles had inwardly convinced himself he was doing it because he'd scammed the guy... it's not until the guy gets all upset that I think Miles realizes he did it on purely on the revenge tip. Daddy issues hurt more than you think, something Hurley calls him on later.


I Think We All Know What Happens If Miles Changes His Own Diaper...
Okay, now the meaty stuff. We get confirmation of two big things here: first, that someone (Miles) can absolutely positively exist twice in the same timeline - we already pretty much knew that, but there were still skeptics. Second, we learn that Chang is not only Miles' father, but that he abandoned both him and his mother when he was just a baby. Daddy douchebag? Maybe. But then again, maybe not.

All you ever really need to know about life can be found in the movie Point Break (this isn't just opinion, it's proven FACT). And all you ever really need to know about time travel can be found in Jean-Claude Van Damme's Time Cop. Matter can travel through time and space, but it cannot occupy the same time AND the same space at the same time. And if it does - well, really bad shit apparently happens. Bill Murray would tell you that shouldn't cross the streams, either.

Assuming this is true, perhaps this is the reason why Pierre Chang shoots his wife and baby back to the mainland like he's launching skeet. Let's go out on a limb and say that in the next episode or two, Chang realizes that grown-up Miles is really his son Miles. Remember how wigged out he got with the double-rabbit situation in the Orchid orientation video? Miles changing his own diaper would probably have similar catastrophic results. Couple this with the fact that the Swan hatch is currently being built - which means that the incident can't be far off - and all kinds of crazy discoveries are about to happen with the Orchid... and the DI timeline is winding up to some pretty hairy stuff. I'm willing to bet Chang simply wanted to protect his family rather than abandon them. In watching the loving way he was reading Miles that polar bear book at the end of the episode, I can come up with no other conclusion. I'll bet it all happened so fast that his mother never really knew it either, which is kinda sad.


Did Sawyer Just Call Jack a Dyke?
I think he did! Jack helps Sawyer out this scene with some vital information, letting him know that he's still got his back. Sawyer shows genuine appreciation of Jack's help, too. This was good to see, because both of them are powerhouse LOST characters from the show's inception. They've also always been out of sync with each other: as one of their stars is rising, the other one seems destined to fall. Just as Jack and Locke argue Science and Faith, Jack and Sawyer's power and popularity are stuck in their own kind of Ying-Yang balance, going all the way back to supremacy of the ****-pong table and ending with the battle for Kate's panties.

I for one am looking forward to them forming the dream-team again, both finally getting back on the same side like they did when they kicked some Other ass a few seasons ago. Each of them are good, but together they're worth more than the sum of their individual parts. I think we're all ready to see another 815 rally, and I hope it comes soon. And maybe somewhere along the lines, someone should mention to Juliet that she's wearing a red shirt, too.


Hurley Couldn't Be More Right About Those Damned Ewoks
The Ewoks were a lot like Kate in that they totally ruined everything. Even as a child I knew those rocks and sticks weren't penetrating stormtrooper helmets or armor, but somehow I suspended my disbelief long enough to swallow that whole 30 minutes of sappy kiddie-shit. Damn.

The whole Hurley and Miles Star Wars scene was hilarious and awesome, but you should also take something a little bit more significant away from it. Hugo mentions having seen The Empire Strikes Back over 200 times. More repetition. More circles (Pierre Chang: "I wasn't aware there were circles"). Then Hurley explains how he wants to send George Lucas a script with a couple of his own improvements. Miles tells him he's being stupid. But is he?

Just as Hugo knows the Rebel base on Hoth will be overrun by AT-AT's (unarguably the best scene in any of the movies!) he also knows that Dharma will be overrun by the Others. He knows ahead of time that everyone's going to die. Miles, Dan... both of these people have told Hurley that this is inevitable - it can't be stopped no matter what they do. But here we have Hugo trying anyway, writing a new script, attempting to change certain things. Hurley's silly belief that he can change this upcoming Star Wars movie is a reflection that he believes change can occur at all.

Later on he tells Miles at the gas pump: "The best thing I ever did was give my dad a 2nd chance". And while he is referring to Miles' dad here, I'd suggest maybe Hugo's also referring to the whole outcome of the Dharma purge. And do his words sink into Miles' head? Maybe he somehow gets through to him, causing Miles to tell his father who he is. Maybe this leads to change... or maybe it leads Pierre Chang to hurriedly send his wife and kid off-island in order to avoid the ramifications of time travel, the purge, or anything else Miles might tell him about the near future. This makes Miles himself responsible for his own bastardization! Total craziness.

Either way, Hurley should be giving Lucas scripts for Episodes 1 through 3. Those movies were a total crapfest and the whole world knows it. Back in 1977, maybe just a quick sketch of Jar-Jar with his fingers in his ears while sticking his tongue out might've been enough to save us all from that silliness.


Charlie Bronson Always Had Rope...
Sorry, but Phil had it coming. That little monobrowed punk has been sticking his nose where it doesn't belong for several episodes now, and he was one flaming arrow away from being Frogurt. Sawyer's punch was the merciful hand of justice, but now LaFleur's dike has yet one more hole in it. And he's running out of fingers.


Shadow-Statue People: 1 Fish-Tacos: 0
Seeing Bram and his mysterious masked van crew was totally unexpected for me, but then again if they're going to introduce new enemies I suppose they'd better get moving. The van-napping of Miles was non-violent, and some of the things said to him during this scene are open to a lot of interpretation. To get anything out of it we'll have to draw some sketchy conclusions.

The most telling fact of all was that Bram and his people needed Miles to not want to get on the freighter. They could've just kept him for a week or two, causing him to miss the boat... but instead they sat there trying to convince him. This obeys one of the quintessential LOST rules: there are times when you can't make someone do something. You've got to want them to do it, so you need to incentivize them the way Naomi did in the back of the restaurant by offering Miles 1.6 million dollars.

Widmore had done his homework, he knew money was the best way to get through to Miles. But when he asks Bram for double the amount, Bram just shakes his head. "Uh uh. We're not paying you". He goes on to promise Miles something much more important than Money: enlightenment. He promises answers for Miles, answers to the questions he's been searching all his life for: who he is, why he has such a gift, and what exactly happened to his father. Even though Miles balks sarcastically at Bram's mention of the empty hole inside him, I think he does realize that these people are pulling on some very personal strings. Where and how they got this knowledge is a mystery at this point.

The more we hear about Ann Arbor, the more we should realize that important stuff happens off-island while Dharma is pouring cement and building cool lab crap everywhere. When the D.I. presence on the island disappears all at once (the Purge) we can't assume these people just forgot all about the island. Even if they couldn't find it, they were probably always working on a way back to it - just like Widmore. Seems maybe they found it with the Ajira flight, just as Widmore's freighter did once before. And no, I don't think they were still making 'food drops'.

Still, I'm not fully convinced that Bram & co. are nothing but Dharma/Hanso people. They could very well be related to Hawking, especially since we don't have a clue how she got off the island or if she ever wanted back on. I get the nagging impression they could also represent another much older interest group. But no matter who they are, they obviously represent the 3rd party that Widmore mentioned in the war that's about to be waged. And Bram seems pretty confident they're going to be the winning team.


How Daniel Got His Groove Back
Faraday steps out of the sub in a badass new black Dharma jumpsuit, complete with ultra-top secret Swan clearance and ball-kicking confidence. This explains where he's been for the last long while (three years?) although it doesn't tell us anything about what he's been up to. Yet whatever that is, he's either crazy or stupid enough to drag himself back to the island. And so the big question: why?

As huge a proponent of the 'Whatever happened happened' theory Daniel's always been, I'm willing to guess he might've been looking for a way to change that ideology. The Daniel who left the island was a gibbering, resigned, broken man. The guy who steps out of the sub looks newly confident and ready to rock. Just like Benjamin Linus, I think Daniel is now prepared to fight the inevitable. Whatever he did in Ann Arbor, it probably involved some rats and some mazes and some insane mathematics. I'll bet he came back to save his friends, but mostly to save one other person from the inevitable: Charlotte. Whether he succeeds, or whether the Ewoks take over the later half of a really kickass trilogy... we'll just have to wait and see.

tessalasset
04-16-2009, 01:27 PM
omg cant wait to read

Young blood
04-16-2009, 01:50 PM
I just read it and it kicks so much ass. <3 the lost bloggers.

Cancersticks1
04-16-2009, 01:54 PM
I also enjoy Doc Jensen's reviews:

http://www.ew.com/ew/article/0,,1550612_20250233_20272495,00.html

He also points out the overwhelming amount of Egyptian iconography and offers an interesting theory on what might actually be going on.

Young blood
04-16-2009, 01:55 PM
sweet! next read. They stopped posting Doc Jensen's reviews on darkufo for some reason. Probably had to do with EW.

kitt kat
04-16-2009, 01:57 PM
Last night was a pretty good one. I want to talk to dead people.

atom heart
04-16-2009, 03:13 PM
A few things I want to know:

Who did Widmore need Miles to talk to on-island? There are plenty of dead people, and Naomi's wording was odd ("...dead people residing..."). Was Naomi referring to the undead types like Christian or possibly Jacob? How many undead types would Widmore know?

What has Daniel been up to? He looks like he's turned into a bit of an action man.

Who are these Statue types? I'm disinclined to call them enemies-- they probably won't be as evil as Widmore let alone Ben. Are they adherents of the island's old culture?



As for the Egyptian thing it probably isn't a complete misdirection. Lost concerns itself a good deal with death and somewhat with the afterlife-- two things that Egyptian culture took great stock in. How it figures exactly I don't know.

Cancersticks1
04-16-2009, 09:49 PM
A few things I want to know:

Who did Widmore need Miles to talk to on-island? There are plenty of dead people, and Naomi's wording was odd ("...dead people residing..."). Was Naomi referring to the undead types like Christian or possibly Jacob? How many undead types would Widmore know?

What has Daniel been up to? He looks like he's turned into a bit of an action man.

Who are these Statue types? I'm disinclined to call them enemies-- they probably won't be as evil as Widmore let alone Ben. Are they adherents of the island's old culture?



As for the Egyptian thing it probably isn't a complete misdirection. Lost concerns itself a good deal with death and somewhat with the afterlife-- two things that Egyptian culture took great stock in. How it figures exactly I don't know.

I wouldn't say it is COMPLETELY misdirection. You're right about Lost dealing with death/the afterlife, and they have also thrown out a lot of religious nods over the years. The difference being, usually we get a nod like an episode titled "316" or characters named after philosophers typically outside of the day to day knowledge of the viewers. The blatant references, (anything involving Eko, Doubting Thomas, Locke's reincarnation, etc.) are usually spaced further apart, and typically relate to a specific episode or mini-arc, whereas the Egyptian iconography, at least the Egyptian iconography from this season, has been thrown at us left and right, and with little relevance to current plot points. The blackboard is the clincher, as it in no way reflected the tone of the episode. But also the ankhs (Amy's and the statue's), and the overwhelming amount of drawings in Smokey's cave, the most prominent of which was a none-too-subtle, blatant-as-hell image of Anubis, favorite of 4-toed statue theorists. It's just too in your face. Maybe it's simply that their deadline is drawing near, but I tend to think it's sleight of hand.

captncrzy
04-21-2009, 02:21 PM
Tessa, I saw the following on Sunday. I tried to break out my camera but he just went by me too fast.

http://www.channel4.com/entertainment/tv/media/L/lost/boone.jpg

fikus222
04-22-2009, 10:10 PM
BIGGEST BULLSH!T EPISODE EVER!!!!!!!

Cancersticks1
04-23-2009, 08:52 AM
I missed the O6 thing yesterday, was it all recap b.s. or was there anything of value?

p.s. Avoid the DarkUFO spoiler section. Usually I've only ever found benign tidbits, but they have some serious shit up there right now I wish I hadn't read.

fikus222
04-23-2009, 11:23 AM
I missed the O6 thing yesterday, was it all recap b.s. or was there anything of value?


Absolutely nothing of value was contained within that waste of a re-cap episode.

chairmenmeow47
04-23-2009, 02:12 PM
that was fucking stupid. i can't believe someone took the time to put that shit together.

Monklish
04-23-2009, 02:28 PM
yeah that was really disappointing. How many eps left in the season? New one next week I hope?

fikus222
04-23-2009, 03:06 PM
yeah that was really disappointing. How many eps left in the season? New one next week I hope?

This season has 4 more episodes left, for a total of 17.

Next week's episode looks pretty cool...1977 falls apart.

Courtney
04-28-2009, 11:25 PM
Ooh, tomorrow is Lost's 100th episode!

Lost twitter teaser: expect to learn more about Faraday and see a young Charlie!

shakermaker113
04-29-2009, 07:20 AM
so I finally caught up. I'll reiterate everyone's comments about how retarded last week's was.

Young blood
04-29-2009, 07:40 AM
100th episode. pumped.

chairmenmeow47
04-29-2009, 08:42 AM
today is going to be the longest day ever waiting for lost, i'm ready!!!

Sexecutioner
04-29-2009, 09:42 AM
Who did Widmore need Miles to talk to on-island? There are plenty of dead people, and Naomi's wording was odd ("...dead people residing..."). Was Naomi referring to the undead types like Christian or possibly Jacob? How many undead types would Widmore know?

im pretty sure she was referring to the grave full of dead dharma people that ben gassed. remember, that meeting of naomi and miles happened way after the time period we are watching now. it was right before the freighter came to the island to rescue/kill them.


today is going to be the longest day ever waiting for lost, i'm ready!!!

no shit. lets do this already!

tessalasset
04-29-2009, 09:45 AM
Tessa, I saw the following on Sunday. I tried to break out my camera but he just went by me too fast.

http://www.channel4.com/entertainment/tv/media/L/lost/boone.jpg

sweeeet!! it's good to know he's a repeat coachella fan.

SkipLaCombe
04-29-2009, 12:25 PM
***new favorite thread***

chairmenmeow47
04-29-2009, 12:25 PM
welcome :) we're nice here as long as you're caught up!

SkipLaCombe
04-29-2009, 12:28 PM
I'm up to date, I even read the lostpedia's for theories...i'm kinda a lost nerd

locachica73
04-29-2009, 12:35 PM
Tessa, I saw the following on Sunday. I tried to break out my camera but he just went by me too fast.

http://www.channel4.com/entertainment/tv/media/L/lost/boone.jpg

yum...

tessalasset
04-29-2009, 01:42 PM
sweet, welcome Skip. We are a hardcore bunch for sure. Hardcore for the Coachella board at least. So excited for tonight!!!

fikus222
04-29-2009, 01:46 PM
sweet, welcome Skip. We are a hardcore bunch for sure. Hardcore for the Coachella board at least. So excited for tonight!!!

Hey, my core is more chewy and gooey, but you're right, we do love us our Lost :D

Tonight is going to be rawking!!!

SkipLaCombe
04-29-2009, 02:35 PM
sweet, welcome Skip. We are a hardcore bunch for sure. Hardcore for the Coachella board at least. So excited for tonight!!!


Thanks! I don't have too many people I can talk LOST with. Can Not Wait!!!!

bballarl
04-29-2009, 02:58 PM
Those week-long breaks are frustrating. Can't wait for tonight.

OnlyNonStranger
04-29-2009, 03:06 PM
I missed the episode from two weeks ago because I was driving to Coachella and got to watch it last week when I got home. So for me it feels like there hasn't been a break at all.

bballarl
04-29-2009, 03:07 PM
Good planning. Respect.

tessalasset
04-29-2009, 03:13 PM
Remember how we have to wait from May until February for new episodes? A one-week break doesn't feel quite as bad.

Blinken
04-29-2009, 03:57 PM
yeah that was really disappointing. How many eps left in the season? New one next week I hope?

I still really find your 180 turn on this show hilarious.

Welcome to the thread Skip, beware a few east coasters post here to so best not to check the thread from 6pm pst until after you see the newest episode.

I didn't even bother with the recap last week, just completely ignored it. Tonight is gonna be great i feel it.

Young blood
04-29-2009, 07:11 PM
so awesome. So many answers. Its obvious what happens from here on out to the end of the show its just fun to see how they got to where there are.

Lost= masterpiece.

SkipLaCombe
04-29-2009, 07:31 PM
ts obvious what happens from here on out

oh? fill us in on the final 23 or so episodes...

Young blood
04-29-2009, 07:35 PM
Last Eps.

Jack wakes up in the jungle after the plane crash.

Cancersticks1
04-29-2009, 08:37 PM
Yep, that unfortunate spoiler I saw was correct... :(
Other than that, that episode didn't really show us anything that wasn't pretty obvious already.

captncrzy
04-29-2009, 09:06 PM
Last Eps.

Jack wakes up in the jungle after the plane crash.

Oh, SHIT. That just made my head explode.

bballarl
04-29-2009, 09:37 PM
Holy shit. That was the best episode ever.

apostle2
04-30-2009, 02:31 AM
Holy shit. That was the best episode ever.

QFT. Faraday + his mom + desmond + Alpert? Holy shit that's an episode.

bartelby
04-30-2009, 04:02 AM
crazy crazy crazy

so now it'll be 'the nukin' nutso' Jack vs. 'save the island' Locke but from different timezones?

i'm not sure i like this idea of nuking the island to avoid having the plane crash in the future...in the end, didn't most of those on Oceanic end up in better situations than if the plan hadn't crashed? (dismissing those who died, of course)

i'm pretty sure Kate would like to avoid going back to jail...and Sun/Kim would like to keep their baby....Rose is happy to not have cancer (wherever the hell she is!)...etc etc

and how would nuking the island in the 70s get Jack et al back to the future? i can see the Christopher Lloyd guest appearance now...

questions questions questions

gotta love Lost

Cancersticks1
04-30-2009, 06:53 AM
Yeah, not gonna happen. They'll try to sabotage the swan and end up causing the incident themselves.

SkipLaCombe
04-30-2009, 07:56 AM
good stuff! I freaking love this show.

ivankay
04-30-2009, 08:20 AM
i love when they lead you on to a predictable ending then have Daniel's mother kill him and just slather a whole new layer onto her character. Maybe Daniel's the dead guy Miles needs to talk to.

i think i'm going to retract my Charles being the captain of the Black Rock statement from a few pages back. i watched that Oceanic 6 recap before last night's episode and was reminded he was 17 when he met Locke in 54. Kind of weird to have him even be a crew member if he considered himself 17 at that time. Maybe he's just a native, but why would he be special?

chairmenmeow47
04-30-2009, 08:22 AM
Last Eps.

Jack wakes up in the jungle after the plane crash.

or we see everyone land in LA just fine.

OMG WHAT AN AWESOME EPISODE!!!! maginificent, brilliant. i re-watched instantly. only, i used the closed captions cause my hearing ain't so great and i want to make sure i caught everything. whoever did CC last night for lost was on crack, observe the following dialogue and the corresponding CC:


hopefully really soon dr chang is gonna ask a bunch of people to get on the submarine & leave the island. when he does you and your mommy you're gonna have to leave

http://ivy.aholic.us/gallery/d/781354-2/lost+1.jpg


i tried to avoid telling you this

http://ivy.aholic.us/gallery/d/781358-2/lost+2.jpg


(no actual talking, just the sound of a gun passing from one hand to the other)

http://ivy.aholic.us/gallery/d/781362-2/lost+3.jpg

it was just awful. i'm sure glad i'm not actually deaf, wtf?!

i wonder if the rest of this season is going to be trying to execute dan's plan, but what about next season?!?! where does this leave us?!?! AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!

what a fantastic episode. not much else to say right now, but WOW.

ivankay
04-30-2009, 08:28 AM
it was just awful. i'm sure glad i'm not actually deaf, wtf?!



my parents are deaf. They don't watch Lost, but this has been a problem since the beginning of captioning and affects all shows. Live shows are the worst, but that's understandable. When it's a pre-recorded show, it makes no sense and is really annoying for the deaf. Hopefully some day they get it right all the time.

SkipLaCombe
04-30-2009, 09:05 AM
I can't see how they could end it with something so simple as their plane landing safely at LAX...still a lot of info left to find out...

Young blood
04-30-2009, 09:26 AM
i love when they lead you on to a predictable ending then have Daniel's mother kill him and just slather a whole new layer onto her character. Maybe Daniel's the dead guy Miles needs to talk to.

Ohhhh I like that theory.

I loved this episodes transitions. In that Eloise was at the hospital with Penny and realized that her know journey was over. She had created her fate and her destiny and done what she needed to do and that its up to the island to decide what happens next. The 100th episode took a weird juxtaposition from past effecting present to past effecting future, like the audience came out of the time loop.

Im sure the darkufo blogs episode recaps will explain this better than me.

bballarl
04-30-2009, 09:38 AM
So is Penny Eloise's daughter as well? Because young Eloise looks a lot like her.

Young blood
04-30-2009, 09:38 AM
Im guessing yes.

fikus222
04-30-2009, 09:55 AM
Yeah, not gonna happen. They'll try to sabotage the swan and end up causing the incident themselves.

Guaranteed.

Courtney
04-30-2009, 10:25 AM
Ohhh bam. That was a good episode.

The Daniel/Theresa/Eloise scene at Oxford was the one I saw them filming at my work back in February (http://coachella.com/forum/showthread.php?p=1053200#post1053200). Interesting to know that their filming has a two month lead time before episodes are aired.

Also I'm pretty certain that the Indian restaurant scene with Daniel and Eloise was actually shot at Grand Cafe and Bakery (http://www.grandcafeandbakery.com/) in downtown Honolulu. I recognize the interior because I like to eat lunch there!

I still need to think about the plot and try to wrap my head around everything.

tessalasset
04-30-2009, 11:01 AM
courtney that's awesome. totally that scene. anyone else think long haired dan could look like russell brand if he wore makeup?

i love that i'm sorta dumb watching this show because widmore being dan's father was a TOTAL curveball for me. i was watching it with my friend and he was like "ummm tessa? you didn't catch that? seriously?" it's more fun when i just let it hit me like that.

and since they did the close up of dan's last breath, he's super dead isn't he? like charlotte and ethan and charlie dead? i gasped when eloise came out with the gun. i can't believe she shot her son. and that old eloise sent him back in time to be shot by her younger self. why did she need him to stop from saving the swan station? did she just not want him to set off the H bomb? or did she want the whole hatch to be built and their plane to come down? oh man this show is a mind fuck. soooooo good. and did they ever tell us in that other episode what experiment he did on himself and teresa that put her in a coma? did the experiment on himself make him lose his memory but hurt her much worse? or did something else make him lose his memory? what the hell was he doing?

chairmenmeow47
04-30-2009, 11:19 AM
i'm pretty sure dan is "super dead". or at least nothing good comes from the shot as eloise started to tell widmore before he cut her off "knowing damn well that...".

also, i don't think penny is eloise's daughter. eloise said "your daughter" and didn't seem to have any emotional attachment to penny or the baby, other than through desmond. i have a feeling eloise and widmore hooked up either on island or shortly after, possibly even BEFORE they shot daniel, cause how old is daniel anyways? if it's 1977, that means that even if he was born in 1977, he'd only be 27 in 2004 when he was on the freighter. according to lostpedia, he became a professor in 1996 at oxford. he HAD to have been born before 1977; i find it next to impossible that he became a doctor and professor before the age of 19. it's possible, but highly suspect.

i have a feeling at some point after widmore is sent off the island, he tries to have a "normal" off-island life and has penny with someone else. i'm sure that either before or after he was exiled from the island, he and eloise have a falling out.

guess we'll see though...

and i don't know that they ever told us what the experiment was. according to lostpedia (http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Daniel_Faraday), it was the same experiment that was done on the rat:


As a Professor

Daniel is shocked to hear his future-self sent Desmond. ("The Constant")In 1996, Daniel Faraday had become a professor at Queen's College, Oxford University. He was conducting unauthorized experiments involving time travel, and had created a machine that allowed a living creature's consciousness to travel through time. The benefactor who funded this research was Charles Widmore. ("Jughead")

When visited by Desmond Hume, who claimed to know about the machine, Daniel initially believed that a colleague was playing a practical joke on him, but when Desmond mentioned Eloise, Daniel's lab rat, he believed Desmond. In his lab, Daniel tested the numbers Desmond supplied to him. He used the machine on Eloise, enabling her to unerringly complete a maze that she would not be taught how to run for another hour. Daniel's blackboard revealed his interest in the Kerr metric as part of his theory of time-transported consciousness.

A being that undergoes time-transported consciousness, according to Daniel's explanation to Desmond, must identify a constant, something existing in both periods of time travel that can serve as an anchor for the being's consciousness; failure to find a constant results in instability of consciousness, and the resulting stress can lead to brain aneurysm and eventual death. At some point, Daniel identifies Desmond as his constant, noting so in his journal. ("The Constant")

During his days as a Professor, Daniel also studied the DHARMA Initiative and wrote all he knew about it in his journal. This would later help him when he eventually joins the DHARMA Initiative. ("Because You Left") ("LaFleur")

Eventually, after testing his theories on himself, Daniel performed the same experiment on his girlfriend and lab assistant, Theresa Spencer. The experiment apparently resulted in Theresa permanently coming mentally 'unstuck' in time, with her condition deteriorating to the point that she became permanently bedridden. Soon after this accident, Daniel left Oxford for America, and all records of his stay at Oxford were deleted. Charles Widmore agreed to pay for Theresa's care, but Daniel never saw her again. ("Jughead") Daniel's experiments on himself also appear to have played havoc with his memory. ("Some Like It Hoth")

tessalasset
04-30-2009, 11:43 AM
oh and ivy i laughed so hard at those farraday translations, especially since jennie and i had to keep rewinding to understand what he was saying. he slurs so much.

chairmenmeow47
04-30-2009, 11:46 AM
he also speaks a bit softly which makes it hard. i also had to make sure i heard widmore correctly before he was cut off about faraday being his son too. i always hope that the CC will translate the random shouting in the background but it never does :(

tessalasset
04-30-2009, 11:48 AM
I love that Dan named his rat after his mom. I wonder if she knew that.

Cancersticks1
04-30-2009, 12:39 PM
I'd like to see a 360 where Desmond ends up being the "Time-Cop" rather than the wild-card. They've built up so much that Desmond is uniquely special and could change the past, and we've all been waiting for it. But he seems pretty content with the way things have panned out for him at this point, and with Jack & company seemingly about to task themselves with Farraday's final wish to fuck it all up, whether or not they actually can, it would be interesting to see him attempt to preserve the time-line instead. Considering that if they were to succeed in preventing the hatch from being built, what exactly would have happened to Desmond? Would Penny have even been born? If Widmore was blown up I would guess not, he certainly wouldn't have planned any boat races. Also, that would have some major consequences for Daniel, Miles, & Charlotte. I'm seeing a bit of the lame ending to "The Butterfly Effect" here. I still maintain that, maybe with the exception of Desmond, they cannot affect the past, but the problem is that Desmond already has; Saving Charlie long enough to deactivate the blocking signal, communicating with Daniel in the past, all of his mind-travels in "The Constant." Whether the others can change anything is irrelevant as it seems this isn't exactly the way things panned out anyway. How much the ripple could affect the future remains to be seen. My guess, there may be slight change, but for the most part it's going to course correct anyway.

Blinken
04-30-2009, 12:47 PM
Here is my issue with Faraday. He says that Free Will is what will change everything, and is he truely beleived this then he wouldn't talk to Charlotte as a kid. That is the one thing he knows for sure that he will do. It is a simple change that he can make and thereby prove free will. Instead he proves that free will does not exist on the island, the future is already determined for everyone.

Was I the only one annoyed with how the losties and Faraday approached the hostiles. There was no need to go and get some guns, in fact it made things worse for everyone involved. If they had just snuck away then Swayer and his peeps would have been able to do the same. But for some reason they decide they need guns to talk to Daniels mom, and fuck everything up.

chairmenmeow47
04-30-2009, 12:57 PM
i was annoyed with faraday approaching the hostiles the way he did until he got shot. that made it all make sense. one of the recurring themes in this show is that approaching situations like this doesn't work, and they continue to show us why. the losties getting all lord of the flies, the new losties acting the same way, the others holding people hostage and trying to kidnap people in the middle of the night... these things never work out for anyone on lost. it's only when people like locke take a chance and try to take a leap of faith and talk to someone that anything gets done in a way.

and i'm trying not to put too much on desmond. they built walt up to be some special key to the puzzle and then dropped him. lost is a fickle bitch!

Young blood
04-30-2009, 01:44 PM
Here is my issue with Faraday. He says that Free Will is what will change everything, and is he truely beleived this then he wouldn't talk to Charlotte as a kid. That is the one thing he knows for sure that he will do. It is a simple change that he can make and thereby prove free will. Instead he proves that free will does not exist on the island, the future is already determined for everyone.

Was I the only one annoyed with how the losties and Faraday approached the hostiles. There was no need to go and get some guns, in fact it made things worse for everyone involved. If they had just snuck away then Swayer and his peeps would have been able to do the same. But for some reason they decide they need guns to talk to Daniels mom, and fuck everything up.

I wish that they would have made Faraday believe that there were actually variables and free will and had him give that speech to Charlotte by accident, like he saw her on the swing and went up to her and told her something different and believe that he changed past. Then she over hears him saying it to some one by accident.

Ivy I also see Desmond playing a huge role in getting 1977 losties to the place they should be.

I <3 LOst, a show that can come up with the premise of future and present actions affecting past events and at the same time the exact opposite. Awesome.

chairmenmeow47
04-30-2009, 01:53 PM
i think he'll play a role, i just have doubts that desmond will get all NEO on us, lol.

and i think faraday told charlotte what he did so that she would in fact leave. he wants her to leave. so even though he was doing something he already knew happened, he knew it would lead her to leave. just like telling candle that miles was his son, even if candle didn't believe him, faraday certainly scared him to the point where he just might send away his wife and kids, and not delete miles out of the picture back to the future style, lol.

Blinken
04-30-2009, 02:30 PM
i think he'll play a role, i just have doubts that desmond will get all NEO on us, lol.

and i think faraday told charlotte what he did so that she would in fact leave. he wants her to leave. so even though he was doing something he already knew happened, he knew it would lead her to leave. just like telling candle that miles was his son, even if candle didn't believe him, faraday certainly scared him to the point where he just might send away his wife and kids, and not delete miles out of the picture back to the future style, lol.

But then free will does not exist on the island, and they plan with jughead is not going to work. Really the best way for them to prove this, and change the future, is to do nothing. Just step back and say "I am out" then watch from the sidelines. Ben's survival should have proved that nothing can be changed. I don't think Desmond can change anything either, he is just the false hope. The thing is Faraday should have known that free willl does not exist and it is only an illusion. Why is Faraday lieing to everyone about this? He seems to be trying to cause the incident, but why? Just because he knows he has to? There are no varibles though because what has happened has already happened.

gimpboy76
04-30-2009, 02:48 PM
i have a feeling eloise and widmore hooked up either on island or shortly after, possibly even BEFORE they shot daniel, cause how old is daniel anyways? if it's 1977, that means that even if he was born in 1977, he'd only be 27 in 2004 when he was on the freighter. according to lostpedia, he became a professor in 1996 at oxford. he HAD to have been born before 1977; i find it next to impossible that he became a doctor and professor before the age of 19. it's possible, but highly suspect.

i have a feeling at some point after widmore is sent off the island, he tries to have a "normal" off-island life and has penny with someone else. i'm sure that either before or after he was exiled from the island, he and eloise have a falling out.

guess we'll see though...

and i don't know that they ever told us what the experiment was. according to lostpedia (http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Daniel_Faraday), it was the same experiment that was done on the rat:

I think that Young Daniel is already alive when Old Daniel has been shot, as Daniel lays dying he tells Eloise he is her son, and she seems to recognize something in him, perhaps seeing features she would recognize in Young Daniel in Old Daniel, although I could be wrong as they do make the point of mentioning that Daniel was the youngest ever doctor to graduate from Oxford. Either way she knows his fate which is why she tells him to quit playing piano, avoid the distraction of girls, etc. She knows his time is short and that he must finish his work prior to being shot.

On the other hand does the bomb really have to destroy the island? That didn't seem to be Daniel's motive, perhaps the Electro-Magnetic energy will counter some of the H-Bombs power. It really just seemed that he wanted to destroy the Swan station, nothing else.

benhur
04-30-2009, 06:05 PM
courtney that's awesome. totally that scene. anyone else think long haired dan could look like russell brand if he wore makeup?

is that the lead singer of silversun pickups?...cause when i was watching them I couldn't stop imagining that it was daniel faraday on lead vocals lol.


i don't know if this is definitive evidence or not, but i think i can prove that penny isn't eloise's daughter. when the others are exiling widmore and ben talks to him before charles gets on the sub, one of the reasons ben said widmore was exiled was that he had a relationship with a person outside the "other" community and had a daughter.....i think ben would consider eloise to be in the "other" community and wouldn't have mentioned that otherwise.

EDIT: haha i meant Brian Aubert....after looking at pics of him there is some resemblance but from if you were to look at him from farther away they look exactly the same.

marooko
04-30-2009, 06:22 PM
i know you guys are way past this, but "Dave" was fucking crazy. that episode really threw me for a loop.

atom heart
04-30-2009, 07:13 PM
DAAAAANNNNNNNNIEELLLLLLLLL NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO


well if it wasn't Des is it was going to be Dan.


Oh look, and now Jack and Kate are going to fumble through Dan's journal. I knew the moment that Dan was being all spacey with the gun that he was going to get himself in trouble. Poor Dan-- jumping through hoops for his mother all his life which ends when she SHOOTS HIM IN THE BACK.

I'm liking Alpert more and more. He's always so calm and collected and he wanted to hear Dan out. I hope the writers get around to explaining his eyeliner shrouded mystery.

signmeup
04-30-2009, 11:31 PM
dammit daniel!
i hearted him and now hes (apparently?) dead :(

but that was awesome none the less. I really hope they dont end with it all never happening, I feel they would because its so obvious, but eloise and widmore being daniels parents was pretty obvious too. I thing the whole "what happened happened" theory is the truth (for now) and jacks plan to carry out farradays plan is just going to backfire by causing the incident or something. and this too



just like telling candle that miles was his son, even if candle didn't believe him, faraday certainly scared him to the point where he just might send away his wife and kids, and not delete miles out of the picture back to the future style, lol.

tessalasset
04-30-2009, 11:34 PM
egyptian god.

atom heart
05-01-2009, 07:43 AM
Before next week's ep rolls around I'm just going to say that I think Richard is the original priest for the temple, the undying right hand man for whomever wants to take up the Island's cause. He seems to be the most reasonable of all the Others, and if he's an Island proxy he's the least menacing.

http://www.bestweekever.tv/bwe/images/2008/05/Richard_Alpert.jpg

And with those eyelashes he would fit right in with any ancient Egyptian fashion.

Young blood
05-01-2009, 07:52 AM
Richard is bad ass. He is the only one that truly understands whats going on.



Things I Noticed - "The Variable" by Vozzek69
Posted by DarkUFO at 4/30/2009 07:03:00 PM (Comments: 233) Comment Pop-up
Labels: Recaps, The Variable, Vozzek69

Oh boy... commentary this week should be nuts! Winding down toward the finale, The Variable begins closing out the Dharmaville chapters of LOST and promises us the warmth and familiarity of our old "back on the beach" episodes. We're about to trade knowing what's going to happen next for the joy of being completely blind again, living in lean-to's, and running from invisible monsters (sorta). Congratulations to everyone involved with this great show on 100 amazing episodes. Things I Noticed:

'Sorry, but You're Gonna Have to Be a Physicist'... Performed in D-Minor

Finally, someone with mommy issues! Daniel's mom interrupts his future as a concert pianist to give him a lesson in destiny, and to encourage a lifetime of pocket protectors, razor-thin ties, and high-level mathematics. Either way, he's not getting the cheerleader. But hey, let's talk about destiny for a minute.
I've always thought destiny to be a fixed, predetermined future (in fact, wikipedia agrees with me). Destiny isn't something you can argue or bargain with - it's the fixed and unchangeable path down which you're meant to travel. Yet here's a young Ms. Hawking, once again trying to convince someone that they're destined to do something. She even tells us it's her 'job' to guide people along the right paths. Doesn't this contradict the very definition of a pre-determined future? If it's already Daniel's destiny to do the things he's supposed to do, why can't she let him play the piano for a while? Maybe even make him a sandwich?

Since when does destiny need deputies? If the universe always corrects itself, why does Hawking have to play time marshall?

If you want the answer to that, then here it is: because she's been bamboozled into believing this crap. Just like we've all been. Just as she tried to convince Desmond that he couldn't change anything (and he did), she's trying to convince Daniel that he needs to put down the metronome and pick up a math book. Growing up on the island and following the standard Others' playbook has brainwashed Eloise Hawking into spending the rest of her life 'putting people where they need to be'. I'm calling bullshit on that one.

Hawking is putting people where the ISLAND needs them to be. Plain and simple. All her life she's been too foolish to know it... at least up until the moment where she realizes she was wrong. I'm guessing that moment came somewhere between shooting her son and slapping Widmore in the face. I'm betting she put the O6 on Ajira as penance for her sins, knowing it might potentially change something. I also think that when Hawking helped Ben get on that plane, she knew full well it was something she wasn't 'supposed to' do - not according to the island, anyway.

This begs a much bigger question: just what the hell are the Others trying to accomplish? Think of all the hoops they've thanklessly jumped through... Widmore, Ben, now Hawking... to believe in something so strongly that you're willing to sacrifice your own kid(s) for it? Something has got the Others scared totally shitless... whether they've seen the end of the world or whether it's something more personal, we don't know just yet.

Whatever it is, I think it's up in the air now. It's no longer set in stone. In the past, I think they've allowed the loop to complete itself - this was the safe way of doing things. By allowing time to fold over on itself and endlessly repeat the same stretch over and over, they've effectively avoided the horrific ending they all seem to dread. But now, this time through, we're all going to see something different happen - the Others included. God help us all.


A Picture's Worth A Thousand Words - Or At Least A Really Quick Sub-Ride

Somewhere back at HQ in Ann Arbor, the editor of the Dharma newsletter is missing a initiation photo. Last week we knew Dan came back to the island for specific reasons, but this week we're shown the catalyst that put him on the latest sub: seeing that Jack, Kate, & Hurley somehow made it back to the island. Apparently this was unexpected by Daniel, and he's extremely curious as to how they managed to pull it off. It seemed to solidify what he'd been working to prove while grooving out in 70's Michigan these past few years: that things can, in fact, be changed. This is very exciting news to him.

So exciting in fact, that he's willing to arrive on the island mere hours before a catastrophic incident that he has full advanced knowledge of. Somehow Dan expects to convince Chang he's a time traveler, have him evacuate a hundred or so people (by sub, no less), gather up help from the entire 815 crew, meet up with his trigger-happy mother, and then find and detonate an atomic warhead - all in less than 6 hours. Yeah, good luck with that.

In fact, Dan is so bad at planning ahead that even master-tactician Jack does everything but slap his forehead and say 'doh!' when Dan strides into the hostile's camp with a hurried attitude and an ominous-looking pistol dangling from his untrained hand. But that scene is for later on.

I guess the important thing here is Dan's new attitude. Last time he was telling us that whatever happened, happened (WHH). But the new Dan has suddenly ditched his tie, changed his tune, and is ready to roll up his sleeves and do something. Up until he saw the photo he was only working on equations. But once he saw Jack's crew in 1977, it gave him the proof he needed - at least in his own mind - that the upcoming incident could be avoided.


Miles Is Putting on A Lot of Miles

As the official chauffeur for all the main characters, Miles drives Dan to Jack's house. This is partly because Daniel still believes him to be the leader, but mostly it's just a gratuitous excuse for another shirtless Jack scene. Dan tells Jack that his mother was wrong to send them back, and that they don't belong in 1977 (or even on the island) at all. We'll find out later where he believes they really do belong: arriving on time in LAX back in 2004. Holy crap that seems like such a long time ago.

This sends Jack knocking at Sawyer's door, where the whole Dharma jig is just about up. It was a little sad to see the disappointment on Sawyer's face as he finally gave up on his temporary happiness. Juliet inviting Jack inside was the final nail in that coffin; two episodes ago she'd already known the charade was over. It took Jim LaFleur a little longer to accept it, but as he calls a partial meeting of LOST's superpowers - while Phil bleeds all over his cabinetry - even he knows the lie is over. See you back at the beach.

At this point we're going to see Dharma fade back into the obscurity it once had when it consisted of a few hatches, ruins, and skeletons scattered across the island. It looks to me that after the incident, it will be modern times again. From a mental perspective, I find it interesting to note that everyone had to leave or somehow let go of Dharma before this could be accomplished. Just as the O6 had to let go of their off-island lives before they could return to the island, so do the Dharma newbies. And this time, Sawyer's the last one off the playground.


Good night, Future Boy!

Oh MAN I thought Chang was going to believe Dan at the Orchid station! But then Miles totally blew it for him. Which was kinda weird, because I would've thought Miles would back Dan up on the whole back-to-the-future thing. Perhaps Miles was still trying to keep up his end of the whole Dharmaville facade, or maybe he didn't want his dad to believe Dan. He already knows that Chang sends mom and baby Miles off island when he suspects something bad is going to happen, so maybe Miles is trying to change a little future of his own here... and keep the family together. Maybe Hurley rubbed off on him a little during all those van rides?

"I'm just making sure your father does what he's supposed to do". I'm not sure what Chang is supposed to do, but whatever it is, Faraday probably just planted the seeds that will cause him do it. Is this the way it always happened? Hehe. Could be.


I'm Taking My Son Out For Curry, No Vegetables

Not much new in this scene, except that we get to see pre-trippy Theresa and a whole bunch of Indian-themed decor. Hawking's only here to monitor Dan's progress and to keep him on the right path. She fully believes she knows her son's destiny, and it's always been her job to weed out annoying distractions like piano lessons, women, and apparently haircuts. But there's a causality clause in the conversation:

Hawking tells Daniel, "Your work will always come first". Daniel's response: "Only because that's what you've always pushed me to do".

Once again, was Dan's destiny really etched in stone? Or was his fate sealed only because his mother had preconceived notions of precisely what it needed to be? Was Dan's life nothing more than a self-fulfilling prophecy, orchestrated entirely by his mom - and later on, by his dad as well? Yup.


Party at LaFleur's House, BYOB

In what's probably our last calm scene in Dharmaville, all of the big kids meet up to discuss what their next move should be. This is a pretty far cry from the old days, where everyone would just grab a few guns and storm off into the jungle with a half-assed plan (but at least they had Sayid back then).

For most of LOST, the 815 survivors have worked toward getting off the island. But now that they've got a legitimate way to leave, they're actually looking to stay and finish things. Heading back into the jungle and starting from square one doesn't seem to bother anyone - there's not a rookie or a red-shirt left among them. As Hurley says, leaving now would be kind of wishy-washy. They're finally realizing that they're all here for a reason, and that nothing's going to get resolved until they figure out what that reason is. I think Locke would be proud.

Daniel explains that his mom can get them back to where they 'need to be', which I'm assuming is back in their regular time period. How or why she can do this is a mystery, but Faraday probably knows what he's talking about.


The Sunken Wreckage of Flight 815 and My Own Never-ending Stubbornness

Charles Widmore finally "reveals" he sunk the phony plane, which would seem to put this mystery to bed for good. But before we tuck it in, I'm going to slap it on the ass one more time. After this, I promise to leave this topic alone. This time for real. :)

First off, look at who Charles is talking to: Daniel Faraday. He conveniently shows up just as the 815 footage is being played on the television, then uses it as a cattle prod to get Dan on his freighter crew. So do we take what Widmore is saying at face value? First let's run down the steps someone needs to take in order to pull this off:

a) Purchase a retired Boeing 777: un-parted out

b) Paint it to look exactly like Oceanic 815

c) Fill it with dozens of rotting corpses you stole from a Thai cemetery

d) Sneak it out into the middle of the Indian Ocean, over the Sundra Trench

e) Somehow do all this without anyone (but your evil henchmen!) knowing

f) Dump it and then 'pretend to find it

Pretty slick, right? But hey Widmore has lots of money, so everyone naturally believes this can be done. Okay fine. So now let's examine the reasons why he'd do something like this:

1) To "throw off" the search parties looking for Flight 815. (Yeah, right)

2) To point fingers at Ben, convincing people he's evil (Seems like a lot of trouble, no?)

3) To convince Daniel to get on the freighter (Hawking's prodding accomplished that just fine I think)

4) I can't even think of another reason.

No one can convince me that there'd be much of a search effort for a plane that disappeared "somewhere in the Pacific Ocean". And you also can't convince me that Widmore's "afraid of the public finding the island" when he's spent an unsuccessful 20 years trying to find it using his own vast resources.

Without going into too much detail, I'll say this: I believe we're looking at the actual wreckage of Flight 815. Just as there's an iteration of 815 laying in pieces all over our favorite beach, there's another iteration of 815 that crashed in the real world. This is why Daniel is crying - because I think deep down in his super-intelligent mind, he knows it.

The biggest clue, given to us a long while ago: the plane in the Sundra Trench is broken into the exact same three pieces that the original Flight 815 broke into. How the hell could that be possible? Widmore had no way of knowing this, and he couldn't have gotten that lucky. Nah, I'm not buying any of it. (I guess I'm not buying lots of stuff lately).


Oh NO he DIDN'T!

Sawyer calling Kate 'Freckles' made me cringe more than the Austin Powers/poison gas/Tempest station episode. And I loved Juliet's swift, immediate revenge. Sawyer you dumbass!


The Swingset Is My Constant

Scoring one for the WHH team, Daniel just can't keep himself from the inevitable scary-haired meeting with young Charlotte. His hopes that she'll leave the island in time are overshadowed by his fears that she won't. We also see a repeat of her last words to Daniel; she's not allowed to eat chocolate before dinner. In the mind-skipping right before her death, Charlotte must've flashed back to being on that swing, hearing herself speak those same words.


Shootout at The Motor Pool, and Radzinski Missed His Lithium

Not sure why, but I thought this scene was hilarious. A big messy shootout, ducking for cover, Jack shooting fuel barrels into fiery explosions... it felt like 1993 and I was playing DOOM all over again. Kate handing Daniel a loaded gun - wow, what a big mistake.

I think Radzinski's character grows increasingly awesome. He's on top of everyone at all times, showing up at the worst possible moments. I think HE probably should've been head of security. Then again he's so high strung it wouldn't surprise me if the Kurgan does end up blowing his head off just to get him to shut up.


Whatever Happened Happened...

... So long as there's an informed army of time-cops like Hawking, Widmore, Ben Linus, Abaddon, and God knows who else, dedicating their entire lives to guiding everyone along the right paths, at exactly the right times, putting them in exactly the right places, in order to ensure that destiny "succeeds".

Are you kidding me? No, really - go back and read that again. Destiny needs a pretty spectacular A-Team in order to make sure that predetermination is, well... pre-determined? I call time out for a minute.

Daniel seems to be under the impression that things can be changed, and this time he has mathematical proof. Don't believe me? Just look in his journal. Or check out the Wired magazine he's reading, which says "Forget Science Fiction... Here's the Science!" (yes, I'm being facetious). Faraday's whole variable speech to Jack and Kate seemed pretty convincing at the time, but then again, so did his WHH speech to Sawyer and company. So which is it?

Again this episode, there are arguments for both sides. The very act of Daniel getting shot by his mom seems to indicate that he's wrong in his assumptions. But just because he's killed, does that mean his equations and conclusions were incorrect? Or was he just a victim of poor execution? I mean, come on... even Jack could see that his plan for diplomatic relations with the hostiles totally sucked. And when Jack's making wincing faces at your plan... that's never a good sign.

Daniel's death points firmly toward the fact that whatever happened was destined to happen, just as Hawking predicted. But did she really predict it? Or did she cause it to happen... through years and years of planning... through a lifetime of manipulation in order to get him there? Couldn't I argue that Hawking is the actual variable in that equation? That she could've assumed any other value: one of a loving mother, a protector, a piano aficionado, instead of a cold-blooded deputy of the island willing to sacrifice her only son?

Sure I could. So then tell me: what makes all the island's protectors go to such great lengths to do the things they do, if they're truly convinced that WHH anyway? Why jump through any hoops at all? It's funny, but in all these weeks no one in the WHH camp has explained this one yet - at least not to my satisfaction. Admittedly, I first chose the Things Can Be Changed stance because I think it's just a lot more fun to believe the story will play out that way. But I think we're seeing more and more evidence, from both Hawking and now even from Daniel (the original WHH guy) that no one's destiny is truly set in stone.

To say that WHH, you're saying that the past is irreversible. But who's past are you talking about? How do you qualify the perspective of that particular past? Like Daniel tells Jack, "this is our present". To them, everything they're experiencing in Dharma is not something they've already experienced in the past. Which is why Daniel doesn't have a scar on his neck when Jack meets him.

Taking this into account, every day that dawns is a new future... but only for Jack, Kate, Hurley, Sawyer, Miles, etc... This new day is filled with potential possibilities for them because, unlike their past, it's not yet set in stone. They can change things, even if they don't yet realize it, which seems to be why people like Hawking try so hard to convince them that they can't. They ARE the variables. I can totally dig what Dan was saying this episode.

WHH works when you consider that the past "is the past". But although these people time traveled back to 1977, it's a 1977 where they weren't supposed to be (Daniel's exact words to Jack). This isn't the "true" past as it once happened. This is a new past, which becomes their present, which is filled with all new potential future possibilities. This allows for change WITHOUT changing the past. They're not altering the past, they're changing their future. You have to look at it from their perspective, not from the perspective of someone on the outside, like us, sitting here in 2009.


Umm, I'm Not Really Sure... Let Me Get Back To You On That One

I think Ms. Hawking not knowing what's going to happen next is pretty big. This seems to be an admission that something has already changed, and Desmond isn't even back on the island yet. Which means that if you're in the WHH camp and think Desmond is the only person who can change things (the only variable), then him keeping Charlie alive long enough for the freighter to get to the island has produced a timeline in which everything can run shit wild. Anyone can now do anything. It's Thunderdome!

Hawking's admission that she doesn't know what comes next seems a pretty big shock to her - very similar to what Ben's going through now. Desmond's changing of things has thrown them all in a tizzy. Eloise seems to know there are two possible endings, and she seems to have been working her whole life to ensure one of them will happen. Unfortunately, I'm thinking she's just now realizing that she was working for the wrong side.


See You In Another Show, Brotha!

"I'll never leave you again, Penny". Does this mean Desmond never goes back to the island? Or does it mean that Penny goes with him? It's entirely possible that (aside for some flashbacks) his job is done. By saving Charlie long enough to flip the jamming switch, Desmond set into motion a chain of events that allowed everything to be set up exactly where it is. He plugged the people/variables into the equation. The resolution of the equation, however it may turn out to be, will have been Desmond's doing no matter what at this point.

I've been saying that for a while now, but many WHH people have refused to consider it. They seem to need Desmond to do things by his own hand, or else it somehow doesn't count. I've talked doppler effect, I've talked ripples in a pond... everything was refuted. "No, no, no Vozzek, only DESMOND can change things". Yeah? Well I say take a look around - I think he already has.

Maybe I'll go one step further and say that Jacob's "list" of people is actually a list of variables that can change the end game. The Others were capturing them because they don't want things changed. Woooo!

Personally, I don't think Desmond's finished. And I'm definitely hoping he isn't. If anything, Desmond has to get back to the island the same way he came in: by boat.


How Kate Just Solved LOST

Alright, don't take me literally on that one, but something Kate said sort of blew my mind. She was pointing out the obvious paradox that would happen if they were to somehow prevent their own plane from crashing. Then she said "This is a mistake. He's talking about erasing everything that's ever happened to us, Jack".

Now, there are lots of people - me included - who've theorized that LOST ends as it begins: with flight 815. From S2 we've seen the story moving in one big circle, and as we approach the end of the show we all know that the finishing point of any circle is at its beginning. Hell, the show was even called 'Circle' before it was called LOST, from what I understand.

But it got me thinking: maybe that's why they're all on the island in the first place. Maybe they're LOST because through the very act of changing things, they're erased their very own existence.

Now I'm not claiming this is the solution, and I'm not saying I believe it, and I know it goes against everything the producers have said about the show. But... even if you hate the idea, just think about it for a second. If the main characters somehow prevent their crash on the island, then either their plane lands safely in LA, or it ends up at the bottom of the (Indian?) ocean. Either way, there's an iteration of each of them that still exists on the island itself. This iteration shouldn't exist at all, but somehow it does. Which explains why Charlie's "Where are we?" was so damned spooky in the first place. They're in a place that (according to Ben) God can't even see. They're LOST.

Maybe season 6 will be about them becoming un-LOST. :)


One Last Quick Thing

I think the whole finale reeks of bait-and-switch tactics, which is why I'm still on the Things Can Change side of the fence. But whether you believe like I do or whether you're a diehard member of the WHH team, I think we should all agree on one thing: The show has rocked our balls off this season. And for those viewers without balls, take my word for it: if you'd had them, they would've been rocked right off. (Andy, that's bullocks to you mate!)

Laura owns you
05-01-2009, 07:59 AM
So i just realized theres a Lost thread on this board. Count me in.

chairmenmeow47
05-01-2009, 08:06 AM
welcome laura and thanks for posting, J$$!!!

i also want to point out how much i loved that this episode had some chopin in the beginning, always a good sign <3

gimpboy76
05-01-2009, 12:02 PM
Ivy-love that your location says your from Aquabania, cadet #439 here!

chairmenmeow47
05-01-2009, 12:07 PM
thank you!!! i wish i would have become a cadet!!!

*does the WO-WO-WO-WO-WO hand signal thingy*

fikus222
05-01-2009, 12:13 PM
Jack and Sawyer have clearly swapped roles, which I find pretty nifty, but over the past few episodes Sawyer has seriously needed a swift kick in the pants. He is way too concerned with saving 1977, when he should have always known that they were living with the Dharma Initiative on borrowed time. When he finally decided to leave for the Beach, they show them trying to bring a butt load of clothes, instead of grabbing a backpack and some guns and then run. He deserved to get caught.

Jack, Kate and Daniel's gunfight at OK Motor Pool Corral was pretty sweet. It was nice to see Jack bring it like that.

chairmenmeow47
05-01-2009, 12:25 PM
Jack and Sawyer have clearly swapped roles, which I find pretty nifty, but over the past few episodes Sawyer has seriously needed a swift kick in the pants. He is way too concerned with saving 1977, when he should have always known that they were living with the Dharma Initiative on borrowed time. When he finally decided to leave for the Beach, they show them trying to bring a butt load of clothes, instead of grabbing a backpack and some guns and then run. He deserved to get caught.

i felt the same way. i thought it was very out-of-character for him to be packing like that and i'm glad he got caught for it.

bballarl
05-01-2009, 02:52 PM
I'm looking forward to Walt being the answer to everything.

chairmenmeow47
05-01-2009, 03:02 PM
andrew, i feel the same way, but tessa's reporting from the lost panel and walt's last appearance don't really make me think that's going to happen.


i just got back from the Lost panel. it was so much fun.

Someone asked if they ever had characters that they were going to go one way with and ended up having to scrap them or weren't able to do what they wanted to do with them. Carlton goes "uhhh....Paolo and Nikki?" and everyone laughed. The questioner said "I was thinking more along the lines of Walt, actually." and Carlton, instead of saying something cryptic like "we havent seen the last of Walt," actually explained that sometimes shit happens. In the case with Walt, the actor just grew up way too fast and they couldn't really fit him into the story lines anymore. He pretty much admitted that Walt's story line is done. He also referenced Eko, and how the actor who plays him straight up just didn't like living in Hawaii and asked to be killed off. I know we know that already but yeah.

jusbcus25
05-01-2009, 03:03 PM
Wow. I just noticed this thread as well. I love lost. The first season I missed and bought the dvds. I watched the whole season in two days because it's such a great show. Almost LOST me this last season thoughbecause nothing was getting answered and they finally got off the island.

At least things are starting to get answered now.

And i agree walt has to come back into the equation again and holds a major factor somehow, but daniel is the man even though hes an emotional wreck right now. LOL

chairmenmeow47
05-01-2009, 03:09 PM
welcome! and i swear you are on drumcore... :)

Young blood
05-01-2009, 03:12 PM
, but daniel is the man even though hes an emotional wreck right now. LOL

not any more.

jusbcus25
05-01-2009, 03:22 PM
welcome! and i swear you are on drumcore... :)


thanks. and yes I post on drum-core. not much anymore because that site is dead? whats up with that? I also noticed you posted there. I live in Tucson and used to go up to Phoenix all the time. I hung out with Zack and Wes from PM Dark alot before Zack moved. I met you a couple of times way back but that was years ago. Ivy correct? nice to meet you again, I'm Jeff . LOL.

chairmenmeow47
05-01-2009, 03:25 PM
sup, jeff! yes i am ivy and we've probably met, lol. drum-core is sooooooo dead and even when people do post, it's generally to provide cryptic mystery clues about their events :p

being a fan of drum & bass and lost makes you awesome though!!! :)

i have a feeling we'll still see some of faraday in flashbacks. i mean, we need to find out how he knew his mother was a hostile, but how he did not know that she kills him for starters.

jusbcus25
05-01-2009, 03:34 PM
not any more.


Thats right. I forgot his mom shot him. But he has to come back somehow and if Lock keeps coming back why can't Daniel. That's if Jack and Kate can save the Island. Between LOST, Heroes, and Law and Order. I get them confused and mix the story lines in my own head sometimes. Kind of odd I know. Sorry.

jusbcus25
05-01-2009, 03:44 PM
sup, jeff! yes i am ivy and we've probably met, lol. drum-core is sooooooo dead and even when people do post, it's generally to provide cryptic mystery clues about their events :p

being a fan of drum & bass and lost makes you awesome though!!! :)

i have a feeling we'll still see some of faraday in flashbacks. i mean, we need to find out how he knew his mother was a hostile, but how he did not know that she kills him for starters.

Yes that site seems like a Spam site now of days. or more of a dubstep board. I mainly go on there to see if anyone good is coming. did you see Raiden is coming? I doubt I'll be able to go but that is pretty huge for Arizona. You too are awesome because you love Coachella, dnb, and awesome tv shows like myself!!

And faraday will be back. The island will bring him back. If not wouldn't that kind of screw up the future Faraday? He confuses me with his scientific talk. We are the variables LOL, his journal would be a trip to look at.

bballarl
05-01-2009, 03:48 PM
Even if the actor who played Walt grew up...the character was far too important to just drop. It wouldn't make much sense if they just left Walt out of the equation in the end considering they imbued him with all of these powers and spent time focusing on them. Plus, didn't Miles visit his house in a flashback?

chairmenmeow47
05-01-2009, 03:51 PM
no, that wasn't his house in the flashback. but i totally want him to become an integral part of the show again too.

and yes, jeff. if i'm in town i will be there!!!

matsuolost
05-01-2009, 04:00 PM
Next week, LOST introduces a small, green alien named Ozmodiar that only Jack can see.

matsuolost
05-01-2009, 04:04 PM
And faraday will be back. The island will bring him back. If not wouldn't that kind of screw up the future Faraday?.

no. do you even understand how it works?
he could as well have seen himself there as a baby and nothing wouldve happened. he can die for all anyone cares (and actually is supposed to die there, hence her mom telling widmore "you dont know sacrifice" or something like that) and it wont matter to his old self. he will still grow up to be him
what happened, happened

with that said, that was the best episode of this scooby doo season

jusbcus25
05-01-2009, 08:35 PM
I understand that. but thanks for breaking it down. glad you could put me back on the right LOST path. He also said not to disrupt things and all I was saying is the Island is unpredicatable. Right when you thought you figured it out *bam* they switch it all up.

matsuolost
05-01-2009, 09:23 PM
absolutely. this is just the current state of the show
next week it can all change and we're back to zero
thats why its so good
constant challenge

tessalasset
05-01-2009, 11:27 PM
i havent read anything on this page yet but i just wanted to say today i was leaving work and one of our lighting guys was parked behind me so he came to move his car. he goes "oh so this is YOUR car. i was wondering who had the swan logo on their windshield." so i go "oh sweet, you're a lost fan??" and he goes "yeah i am, but i also worked on the show for the whole second season." turns out this guy was the head painter on the show. he said they paid him enough that he lived like a king in hawaii and they invited him back for season three but he had too much going on back in LA to move out there permanently. he was even wearing his Lost crew shirt today. he said he was gonna bring in a ton of stuff he took back with him to show me. so crazy. i told him how i got to visit the set during season 2 during ana lucia's and libby's funerals and he said "yep! i was on set that day." what a small world.

Jenniehoo
05-02-2009, 01:54 AM
This week's episode was amazing. We're getting into such a mind-blowing potential version of time travel that it genuinely puts your mind to the test while making you challenge whatever "Back to the Future" based physics you realize your biased brain might hold as true. The problem is that a lot of what they're discussing is based on circular reasoning rather than time travel - and some of that is difficult to interrupt.

I believe that (SPOILERS, IF I NEED TO DO THAT HERE) - Daniel's dying breaths were devoted to his realization of the fact that his variable theory was incredibly wrong. He was destined to die there - and be killed by his mother. But I keep reading things discussing the provocation of this season to be Jack and Kate trying to reguide the hatch incident in the way Daniel prophesized was possible. Like they don't recognize his realization and instead give merit to what he confided just before in the woods.

The variable theory is flawed. Someone close to me pointed out that the past must have been altered - that's why Daniel came back - their pictures appeared in the old group photo. But I still think it must be explainable - this must have always happened. Escaping from that theory is so deep and full of holes that I don't think the show would go that way to reinvent the physics-based theory of time travel and black holes to substantiate their writing. Although, if they did, I'd probably still be on board to see how it played out.

Even with the answers being supplied each week, this show is still managing to be mind bending. LOST is still so good.

atom heart
05-02-2009, 06:22 AM
On the other hand, the episode showed all of Eloise's incursions on Daniel's life. I don't quite know how to formulate my thoughts here, but if Daniel was always going to be shot by his own mother on a godforsaken island, why would she always be pushing him to do his work? Wouldn't it happen naturally if it was destiny?

Daniel did realize something. I think he realized that she knew of his death, and didn't do anything about it. In fact, actively pushed him to that end. Eloise, as a native Other guides him to his death. But could it have happened any other way? If she didn't feel so strongly about destiny could another iteration of Daniel have been a pianist and died at the same moment in a car accident? If Jack and Kate manage to reset everything, will Shannon and Libby and Boone and Steve and Stan and annoying guy with that was flaming-arrowed all die in their time?

Cancersticks1
05-02-2009, 06:54 AM
On the other hand, the episode showed all of Eloise's incursions on Daniel's life. I don't quite know how to formulate my thoughts here, but if Daniel was always going to be shot by his own mother on a godforsaken island, why would she always be pushing him to do his work? Wouldn't it happen naturally if it was destiny?

Daniel did realize something. I think he realized that she knew of his death, and didn't do anything about it. In fact, actively pushed him to that end. Eloise, as a native Other guides him to his death. But could it have happened any other way? If she didn't feel so strongly about destiny could another iteration of Daniel have been a pianist and died at the same moment in a car accident? If Jack and Kate manage to reset everything, will Shannon and Libby and Boone and Steve and Stan and annoying guy with that was flaming-arrowed all die in their time?

Frogurt.

ivankay
05-02-2009, 08:22 AM
On the other hand, the episode showed all of Eloise's incursions on Daniel's life. I don't quite know how to formulate my thoughts here, but if Daniel was always going to be shot by his own mother on a godforsaken island, why would she always be pushing him to do his work? Wouldn't it happen naturally if it was destiny?


Eloise in 77 is one of the higher Others. She probably is absolutely devoted to the Island and 100% down with the destiny philosophy. What little she will know about Daniel after shooting him, she will have to play her role in making it happen. If she finds out he was the youngest person to graduate from Oxford with a degree in dount making, she would do whatever she could to fufill that role. She knows she has to follow a path that will have him going back to the Island the way he did, with the people he did, the way he did. Widmore would also be finding out he has to follow his role as well if he found out it was him who financed the venture to get the Faraday Group to the Island. They will also be finding out they have to make sure a certain group of people are on flight 815 to make sure they get to the Island in 77 and 54 and all the other times just to insure Locke gets there. If Eloise and Charles didn't try to fufill their roles, they would be disobeying what the Island wants...Others don't do that.

shakermaker113
05-02-2009, 09:01 AM
The variable theory is flawed. Someone close to me pointed out that the past must have been altered - that's why Daniel came back - their pictures appeared in the old group photo. But I still think it must be explainable - this must have always happened. Escaping from that theory is so deep and full of holes that I don't think the show would go that way to reinvent the physics-based theory of time travel and black holes to substantiate their writing. Although, if they did, I'd probably still be on board to see how it played out.

the variable theory is totally flawed. since it is their present that means they do not know what will happen to them, but it still happened and they cannot change that. for someone who was supposed to be so fucking smart, he must have been delusional to believe his variable theory for even a minute.


Eloise in 77 is one of the higher Others. She probably is absolutely devoted to the Island and 100% down with the destiny philosophy. What little she will know about Daniel after shooting him, she will have to play her role in making it happen. If she finds out he was the youngest person to graduate from Oxford with a degree in dount making, she would do whatever she could to fufill that role. She knows she has to follow a path that will have him going back to the Island the way he did, with the people he did, the way he did. Widmore would also be finding out he has to follow his role as well if he found out it was him who financed the venture to get the Faraday Group to the Island. They will also be finding out they have to make sure a certain group of people are are flight 815 to make sure they get to the Island in 77 and 54 and all the other times just to insure Locke gets there. If Eloise and Charles didn't try to fufill their roles, they would be disobeying what the Island wants...Others don't do that.

that's it. you've just explained everything. what are they even going to do next week now?

atom heart
05-02-2009, 11:51 AM
But what about the Others' desire to keep events on the Island the same? Are the Others and therefore the Island responsible for keeping every single little thing straight in time? Is course correcting time really in the hands of these people?

ivankay
05-02-2009, 12:25 PM
But what about the Others' desire to keep events on the Island the same? Are the Others and therefore the Island responsible for keeping every single little thing straight in time? Is course correcting time really in the hands of these people?

Don't know how it's going to be woked out, but i would think if they have knowledge of events that "happened", they would not fight their part in it like it appears Faraday was and Jack is going to and has been. Looks like whenever anyone tries (Michael could not kill himself, Charlie unable to avoid dying), the Island prevents their trying to be a loose variable. We'll see if Desmond is really capable of doing what Daniel suspects and he is truly a variable that can change things. So far it looks as if Desmond is following a path of destiny that is being guided by Charles and the Others (hell he probably sent Penny to the Monastary knowing they would meet and fall in love). It's like they are the rats in the maze that have to make it to the end somehow. The walls (Hanso Corporation, Widmore, Eloise, maybe even the Oceanic survivors if they never leave 77) will guide them. If they come to a dead end, they turn around and find another way and maybe get helped with paths being cleared or being forced into a differnet direction. Is Desmond the rat that is going to jump out of the maze and say "Fuck this" and change the whole of reality as it was known? Could be. And is the the horrible disater the Others are trying to avoid the possiblility of causing chaos (ceasing our reality to exist?) and not following the order of the universe?

Love this show. Best show evah.

Somewhat Damaged
05-03-2009, 09:32 AM
But could it have happened any other way? If she didn't feel so strongly about destiny could another iteration of Daniel have been a pianist and died at the same moment in a car accident?

I think it would've been pretty damn difficult for another iteration of Daniel to have been a pianist and died as an adult in 1977 any other way.

atom heart
05-03-2009, 06:19 PM
What I mean is Daniel dying at that age. Daniel died in his own present, not when he was -30 years old.

kitt kat
05-04-2009, 12:21 PM
i finally watched the episode last night...and all i can say is WTFFF

and i totally called the eloise+charles=farraday thing a long time ago

chairmenmeow47
05-04-2009, 12:57 PM
so i wonder if the half-sister connection of penny through daniel is what makes desomond daniel's constant or if it's something else.

kitt kat
05-04-2009, 10:59 PM
also, ivy, i totallky posted those funky farraday captions on my tumblr. they made me spit out whatever i was drinking at the time.

Young blood
05-05-2009, 10:14 PM
...


"The Variable" Recap and Analysis, by Erika
Posted by DarkUFO at 5/04/2009 09:23:00 AM (Comments: 56) Comment Pop-up
Labels: Erika Olson, Recaps, The Variable

Here is the Episode 5.14 - The Variable recap from Erika Olson (aka "e") from LongLiveLocke.com.

[Don't you dare mess up one strand of his glorious hair!] I was pretty sure that "The Variable" was going to be a Faraday flashback, so when the hour began with doctors rushing a stretcher-bound Desmond into the hospital, I was completely thrown. At first I thought, "Did Daniel do something in Ann Arbor in the '70s to cause an alternate reality in which a can of baked beans didn't protect Des from Ben's bullet and Des didn't then proceed to beat the crap out of Ben?" Next I figured that we were going to see Daniel in the waiting room, and learn that he'd finally figured out a way to physically time travel (without the help of the FDW) and was there to convince Des that he had to go back to the Island because he was "the variable." Obviously I was all kinds of wrong.
The episode was in fact Faraday-centric, though you could probably argue that we learned just as much -- if not more -- about his mummy Eloise through both the flashbacks and the present-day sequences. What I learned is that I definitely don't like her. At all.

Let's get the "Evil Mom" flashbacks over with first, shall we?


DAN ABNORMAL
NOT NORMAL AT ALL
IT'S NOT HIS FAULT
WE MADE HIM THIS WAY

['Chopsticks' is for wussies.] Rare is the child who wants to play the piano and doesn't have to be carried kicking and screaming to his music lessons. However, Young Daniel Faraday was not your normal kid. He not only loved plinking out tunes on the ol' ivories, but he was also able to keep Raymond Babbitt-esque track of the metronome beat-count at the same time. Unfortunately for him, his mother wasn't exactly a fan of extracurricular activities... or free will.

ELOISE: Daniel... do you know what destiny means?
DANIEL: No.
ELOISE: Destiny means that, if one has a special gift, then it must be nurtured.

Uh-uh, lady. That is not what destiny means. In fact, it pretty much means the exact opposite. But I'm singing to the choir here, aren't I? Surely all of you had the same creeping suspicion as the show progressed... [If he'd chosen something less nerdy, like the drums, things might have turned out differently.] the feeling that Hawking was going to make Daniel's life a living hell in order to ensure he did what fate demanded he do. Didn't she ever stop to think that if her son's destiny was truly to be a geeky physicist, that that's what would've happened no matter what -- even if he toured with Billy Joel or Elton John or got a job at a dueling piano bar on the side just to earn some extra cash?
Alas, she wasn't about to risk Daniel losing focus for any significant period of time. There would be no Happy Meals, no Nintendo, and no Saturday morning cartoons for Little Dan, much less any piano-playing. In fact, now that we have confirmation that Daniel's parents are Hawking and Widmore, I think it's safe to assume that Eloise gave her son the same last name as scientist Michael Faraday (Mr. Electromagneticism Extraordinaire) simply to go the extra mile in pleasing that fickle bitch called destiny.

[It must've been true love if Theresa put up with that hair...] Over a decade later at Dan's graduation from Oxford, we see that his mom still can't deal with him having a life outside of his work. She refused to acknowledge Theresa as anything more than her son's research assistant, and then whisked Daniel away to a tense lunch. Only after she learned that her ex had given Dan a huge grant did she lighten up a little bit... but then left before he even opened the gift she got him: a journal. (Was I the only one expecting that the pages were already going to be full of Faraday's scribblings? Was I also the only one who first thought that the gift would be the freakin' skinny black tie?)


I DON'T REMEMBER
I DON'T RECALL
I GOT NO MEMORY OF ANYTHING AT ALL

[Who's your daddy, dan?] The next flash began just like the second episode of Season Four did, with Faraday getting all teary-eyed over the Oceanic 815 wreckage footage on the news. However, this time around we got to see what happened moments afterward: Widmore showed up on Daniel's doorstep and offered him a job. Through their conversation we learned that Daniel had tested his time-travel gizmo on himself, which ended up adversely affecting his memory. Afterward he apparently tried it out on Theresa and the results -- as we saw when Desmond paid her a visit in "Jughead" -- were disastrous. So I think we can now put the mystery of why Daniel was crying about Flight 815 and why he was playing the card game with Charlotte in "Eggtown" to rest: [AND I get a rockin' tie for the job? Sign me up!] his consciousness had been through the wringer and had probably jumped around in time, though he no longer could remember those experiences.

Next, Widmore dangled a carrot in front of Faraday -- the promise that going to the Island would fix his mental issues and restore him to his rightful nerdalicious state.

But Dan remained doubtful and seemed to be leaning toward sticking with his normal routine of being waited on hand and foot by some woman named Caroline. Life was good -- she made him eggs! And we all know what a big deal eggtastic breakfasts are on this show...

[I heard a pretty redhead will be there, son. Now do you want to go?] So of course his mom had to come and ruin Dan's dreams of enjoying a life of leisure. In the only scene of the night that made me cry, she encouraged him to take the job Widmore had offered:

FARADAY: You really want me to... to go?
MS. HAWKING: Yes.
FARADAY: Will... [voice breaks] will it make you proud of me?
MS. HAWKING: [Whispers] Yes, Daniel. It will.
FARADAY: [Sighs] Then I'll do it.

It's so much worse now that we know what Eloise knew! Grrrr.


How 'bout we take a break from Daniel's extremely depressing life story and make a quick stop in 2008 to check in on the Hume clan?



THE FUTURE'S NOT OURS TO SEE
QUE SERA, SERA

I'm now convinced the most important scene of the night was one I originally didn't pay much attention to: the exchange between Penny and Hawking in the hospital's waiting room.

[Lady, you're weird.] MS. HAWKING: I came, Penelope, to apologize. Your husband has become a casualty in a conflict that's bigger than him, that's bigger than any of us.
PENNY: What do you mean? Is Des gonna be okay?
MS. HAWKING: I don't know. For the first time in a long time, I don't know what's going to happen next.


So here's my take on all of this. Let's revisit Season Three, when we saw Hawking try to convince Des of what he was "supposed" to do in the trippy "Flashes Before Your Eyes." She told him that if he didn't fulfill his destiny of going to the Island and pushing the button in the Swan, then everyone in the world was going to die.

But knowing what we know now, I can't help but think that she may have been fibbing a bit about Desmond's purpose. Yes, he definitely took over resetting the Countdown Timer o' Doom after he accidentally killed Kelvin (who was planning to abandon his hatchmate)... but what else did Des do? He caused 815 to crash. Maybe Hawking knew that without Desmond, certain things critical to the ongoing protection of the Island -- including one John Locke landing there -- wouldn't happen.

[Not so calm, cool and collected now, are you?] You might be thinking, "But if Hawking is so gung-ho about destiny, why did she feel the need to say anything to Des at all? Why wasn't she secure in the fact that if Desmond's fate was to end up pushing the button, then the universe would see to it that Desmond ended up pushing the button -- with or without her help?"

My answer to you would be, "Because Hawking has always known that DESMOND is 'The Variable.'" That's why, when the Scotsman's life hung in the balance in the hospital, it was the first time that Eloise panicked and realized, "Oh, crap, now I'm like the rest of the bloody fools on this planet and have no idea what's going to happen." Hawking knows that only Des can right whatever action he made in the past that set off "the wrong" chain-reaction of events on the Island. Forget about The Incident at the Swan... all of that was supposed to happen. The hatch was supposed to be built, 815 was supposed to crash, etc., etc. But once Des started messing with Charlie's fate, that's probably when things went awry. I've made this argument a lot this season, so I'm not going to repeat it all again here... I just wanted to say that this scene between Penny and Hawking strengthened my belief that Desmond's the key to fixing everything, and that's why "the Island's not done with him yet," as Eloise said earlier this season.

[I got here as quickly as I could on my superfast teleport jet.] Two more things that support this theory:
- Why would Hawking turn up at the hospital to see what happened to Desmond in the first place, if he wasn't critical to helping the universe to course-correct? (And on a side note, how did Widmore get there so quickly? Wasn't he in London a few hours earlier when Ben called him from the marina?)

and

- This episode's title was "The Variable." But Daniel -- in his rant to Jack before he ran off into the Hostile's camp -- only talked about variables in equations. He always used the plural form of the word. I admit that I could be reading too much into things at this point, but I believe that the episode's title was a clue that Daniel had it all wrong in his final exchange with Jack when he said, "Us. We're the variables." They are not the variables... there is only one variable, and it's Desmond.

[I'm sure Charlie's safe... it's not like anyone just tried to kill you or anything.] Have I convinced you yet? No? That's OK, because I'm not totally convinced myself. "Desmond is The Variable" is just one of a few theories that I feel the most strongly attached to. I'll discuss the others at the end of this post.

Before we head back thirty years, I should probably quickly mention the fact that two mysteries were solved through the scenes I've covered so far: 1) Widmore did stage the Oceanic crash (though technically this was confirmed in the clip show the week prior), and 2) Widmore and Hawking are Daniel's parents, meaning that he and Penny are most likely half-siblings.

Finally, let me say here, for the record, that I'm really nervous about how Little Charlie was left alone in the hospital. Really. Nervous.

And now, to the Island.


DON'T COME AROUND HERE NO MORE
WHATEVER YOU'RE LOOKING FOR
HEY!
DON'T COME AROUND HERE NO MORE

[Didn't you see 'Back to the Future'? Oh, I guess not.] Fresh off of the submarine, Faraday asked Miles to take him to Jack because he was freaked out to see his old Island buddies in the 1977 Dharma Recruits picture. At the barracks, Daniel learned that his mom gave The Mad Doctor her standard "it's your destiny" line in order to get him on Ajira 316. Then Faraday had Miles drive him to the Orchid, where we saw the season's opening scene replayed from a slightly different angle. After Chang ordered his workers to stop drilling near the FDW chamber, Daniel trapped Miles' dad in the elevator and tried to convince him to evacuate the Island because of a supposed impending catastrophic incident at the Swan. But Chang was like, "You're on crack -- stay away from me, freak!" Since Miles wouldn't play along with Daniel once the men were all together above-ground, Chang drove off in a huff as an exasperated Faraday looked on.

But once Chang had left the area, Daniel's temperament changed a little bit. I think all he'd wanted to do was put the ideas in Chang's head that 1) Miles might indeed be his son... from the future, and 2) something reaaaalllly bad was about to happen on the Island. [Three words to describe my buddy here: Crack is wack.] He probably didn't actually expect his fellow scientist to drop everything and obey his commands right then and there. Perhaps Daniel knows that something else will transpire over the next few hours that will convince Pierre of the need to get his people to safety? Who wants to bet that we see Chang force his wife to leave with their baby son before the season's over?

While we're on the topic of Daniel's interaction with Chang, I should probably mention the building mystery around the Comic-Con video I linked to in my last post. If you haven't seen it, you might want to check it out here, or else the rest of this section will make no sense. A lot of people -- myself included -- assumed that the voice in the background was Faraday. I watched the clip again moments ago and still believe that's the case. But now we know that Daniel dies shortly after he saw Chang at the Orchid... so when in the heck was this video made?

I'm pretty stumped on this. There are a few ideas I have for what could be going on, but all of them are pretty weak:

[Yeah, I'm stylin'] 1) The voice was not Faraday's. Some people think it may be Miles, which I guess is a possibility, but I don't see why Miles would be all upset that "this is never going to work" like Daniel would've been. Maybe the voice belongs to someone else entirely.

2) Daniel doesn't die. He's not only saved by the Hostiles after his mom shoots him, but then he also goes on to totally convince Chang about everything he told him earlier in the day... so much so that Chang changes out of his lab coat, into a velour track suit, makes the video while Daniel tapes it -- and while Lara and Baby Miles annoy him in the background -- all within a matter of hours before The Incident happens. (Doesn't seem likely, does it?)

3) There are multiple timelines at play and in one of them, Daniel and Chang work together to not only attempt to change the course of events, but also call for Dharma to be reformed in the future.

4) The video was never shown on the series, so it doesn't even matter. It was just something to keep a bunch of nerds occupied over the summer -- and it worked. Joke's on us!


IT'S ALL ENDING
WE GOTTA STOP PRETENDING
WHO WE ARE

[Suddenly hangin' with Smokey doesn't seem so bad anymore.] Miles and Faraday returned to Dharmaville to find a meeting of the minds underway. After a short debate, the majority of the group decided that the jig was up and they needed to go back to "square one" (the beach), whereas Jack and Kate agreed to help Faraday find his mother out in the jungle. And with that, everyone took off in different directions.

Faraday made a heartbreaking stop at the swing set, where we heard Adult Charlotte's last words repeated by her younger version: "I'm not allowed to have chocolate before dinner." And then Daniel -- despite his better judgment -- said to her what he swore he wouldn't say. Or at least we can be pretty sure he did... the camera panned back while he supposedly warned her to never return to the Island once she'd left.

I know I keep harping on this, but I once again had visions of The Time Traveler's Wife while Adult Daniel and Young Charlotte talked. The faraway shot of the two of them at the swing set reminded me of this promotional still I saw of the TTTW adaptation that's coming out this fall. It would've been even cooler if the movie stuck with the little girl (Clare) being a redhead and the guy (Henry, played by Eric Bana) being all gangly.

[Sniff.] [Will you just read this book already?]


Next, Jack, Kate and Daniel got themselves some guns, but before they could head out into Hostileland, Radzinsky and his crew went berzerker and a pretty cool shoot-out ensued. [That's right. I'm off my meds.] However, Kate was able to get her group to safety thanks to her Jeep-driving skillz. While she disarmed the sonar fence, Faraday made a little speech (reiterating the ominous point Miles made in "Whatever Happened, Happened") about how any of them could be killed. That should've been a big hint about his fate... but it definitely went right over my head. I've been thinking for a while that either Juliet (who was wearing a red shirt in this episode, for God's sake) or Sayid were doomed this season, so I guess the possibility of Daniel dying never even entered my mind.

[Do you think I'm overdressed?] Back at the barracks, Sawyer and Juliet were in the process of packing up their things and bidding adieu to the happy life they'd built together for the past three years. I really liked how they played off of each other in this episode, with Sawyer being the more emotional one and Juliet being the first to accept the reality of the situation. What I didn't like was how easily they were captured by Radzinsky. Boo.

Finally, we saw Jin and Hurley head out to meet the others after gathering up their stuff. Anyone else no longer confident that there's a guitar in Hurley's guitar case? I don't think it's a weapon or anything, since he had to get through airport security with it in LA, but I'm just starting to wonder whether there's something more than a guitar inside. (On that note, I'm still hoping we eventually get to see what/who changed Hurley's mind about boarding Ajira 316...)


JUST AS I THOUGHT IT WAS GOING ALRIGHT
I FIND OUT I'M WRONG
WHEN I THOUGHT I WAS RIGHT
IT'S ALWAYS THE SAME
IT'S JUST A SHAME
THAT'S ALL

[The bromance that could've been.] Jack, Kate and Faraday stopped to rest for a bit before they reached the depths of Hostileland. It was at this point that Faraday rattled off his master plan for preventing The Incident at the Swan. Did anyone else see the fire ignite in Jack's eyes when Daniel came to the end of his rousing speech?

DANIEL: "Us. We're the variables. People. We think. We reason. We make choices. We have free will. We can change our destiny."

I think this was a very clever way for the writers to provide a motivation for Jack to reclaim his old leadership position on the Island. Let's face it, he's been pretty lost (pun intended) so far in 1977 -- shuffling around with his janitor's mop and following Sawyer/LaFleur's orders. But when Daniel said the magic phrase, "free will," I definitely saw a "Hell, yeah!" look cross The Mad Doctor's face. Rewatch the scene. You'll see it, too.

[Twitchy guy + Gun = Bad news.] I'll revisit why this is so important in the next section, but there's no avoiding a discussion about what happened once Faraday left Kate and Jack and made his way (in a Dharma jumpsuit... uh, not the brightest idea) into the Hostile's camp.

He came face to face with Ageless Richard and kept a gun on him while he demanded to see Eloise. Then, he threatened to shoot Richard on the count of three. When the shot rang out, I swear that I still didn't think that the victim could possibly be Daniel. De Nile ain't just a river in Egypt, folks!

Alas, Faraday had in fact been shot by his own mother, which he pointed out right before dying -- and right as the reason for her being such a cold-hearted you-know-what all those years became clear. And yes, I'm pretty sure he's dead (link goes to a TV Guide interview with the producers about this topic). This IS a pretty good Death Face, after all.

[Is it wrong to ask what become of the tie? Because seriously, I want to know.]

If only he'd written "NEVER -- UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES -- TAKE OFF YOUR TIE" in his journal. I'm pretty sure that black, skinny neckpiece would've somehow kept Daniel out of harm's way.

Rest in peace, Faraday. You will most certainly be missed.

Finally, in case you're wondering whether or not Eloise will believe that she just shot her own son, the reason I think she will is because Baby Daniel has to already be alive. It's 1977, and by 1996 when Des visits him at Oxford in "The Constant," he's a professor. Surely he couldn't be younger than nineteen at that point. Also, I'm pretty sure we'll find out (or can infer) that Eloise named her son after the curious dude who flashed in and out of their camp in 1954. (Meaning, she named her son after... her son.) That's why she had this look on her face upon hearing Daniel's last words:

[Worst. Mom. Ever.]

She put everything together and realized what she'd just done.



WHERE DO WE GO?
WHERE DO WE GO NOW?
WHERE DO WE GO?

Now what's going to happen? The only dude who had any clue as to what was going on just kicked the bucket?!?!

[Sorry guys, you're on your own now.] With only one episode left before the two-hour finale on May 13th, I've started thinking about theories in the context of the following two questions:
1) What would make for a jaw-dropping Season Five cliffhanger?
and
2) How would the final season of the series play out based on that cliffhanger?

I've never been one to tie myself to a single theory, and I don't think that there could ever be one overriding explanation for everything that's gone on in the show. So here are the three theories I'm considering as Season Five comes to an end -- they only deal with the question of whether or not the Losties will be able to change the past... and not any of the other mysteries like "What is the Smoke Monster?"

(I haven't visited other Lost sites to come up with these theories as spoilers always seem to be around every corner when the finale nears each year. So rest assured that these are just my own thoughts and are not based on known spoilers.)


[Just a typical day in the hatch, crashin' planes...] 1) Desmond is The Variable
I covered this one a bit earlier in this post, but here's how I think it would play out this season and next: The Losties try to follow Daniel's journal instructions to prevent The Incident, but they fail. Season Five will end with the chaos of The Incident taking place, which includes something that makes all of the 815ers return to 2008. Alternatively, something Locke does in '08 may help the time-traveling group get back to their rightful year.

In the meantime, Penny and Des are going to find out that Charlie has been kidnapped and they will be told he was taken to the Island (whether that's true, I'm not sure). Season Six will then show Des and Penny back with the others on the Island, which gives Des a chance to correct whatever it was he messed up the first time around, as he is The Variable. Des and Penny might end up in the past, and they might end up as the skeletons in the cave. While Des is doing his thing, the 815ers will spend the season fighting "the war" on the Island in 2008. The series will end with us finding out whether or not Des was able to change the past.

[It actually worked?] 2) Free Will Wins
Daniel was right -- the Losties can change their destiny... or at least the destiny for the versions of themselves that are still kids in 1977. So Season Five will end with the hydrogen bomb exploding and The Incident being prevented and the 815ers looking at each other like, "That. Just. Happened." I still think that they'll somehow return to 2008 when the bomb goes off, and now we'll have Jack vs. Locke all over again, as both characters have been emboldened by circumstances that strengthen their original Science and Faith stances. Jack was able to prevent The Incident (score one for free will!)... and Locke was resurrected by the Island (score one for destiny!).

Season Six will start off with the 815ers not understanding why they're still on the Island if they stopped the chain of events that Daniel warned them about. But they will soon come to understand that their pasts cannot be changed... only the pasts of their 1977 baby/kid selves and beyond are affected.

[Dare to imagine a world with a happy-go-lucky Miles!] The best character to help explain this Miles, since we've now seen two of him on the Island in 1977. If the hydrogen bomb goes off and The Incident is prevented, Adult Miles will still have come to the Island in December 2004 because Charlie, who will have still crashed on the Island via Flight 815 in September of that same year, will have opened up communications. But Baby Miles will have a totally different life now that The Incident has been avoided in his present. He and his mom might not be sent away from the Island, or even if they are, he might reunite with his father and go on to live a completely different life from one of a scamming ghostbuster. Get it? So once Season Six tries to explain that in a way that will make sense to the average viewer (good luck, guys), the series will focus on the 815ers in 2008. They're still on the Island and still need to fight "the war."

The series will end with both the present 815ers finding a way to leave the Island and having to make the decision whether or not they want to go back home (Jin and Sun definitely will because of their daughter, but I'm not sure if anyone else will) AND a shot of the Flight 815 that the other version of themselves (who were kids in 1977) boarded landing safely in LA. If they were on that flight at all.

Confusing, I know... but I like it. This is what I hope happens.


[It's so good I don't mind eating it over and over and over and over and over again...] 3) Destiny Wins
Season Five will end with the Lostaways failing to prevent The Incident, after which they will be transported back to 2008. Season Six will probably continue to have Jack hellbent on changing things until he learns he can't with the help of New Locke. They'll all band together to fight "the war."

Since "whatever happened, happened," the final season will fill in all of the pieces that have been missing for each character and will explain all of the other mysteries without having to deal with multiple versions of events. The series will end with the 815ers facing a choice whether or not to stay on the Island forever or leave for good. And, as many of us have suspected all along, we'll see Flight 815 crash all over again and Jack wake up in the jungle.

All three theories above share the following elements:
1) The time-traveling characters will return to 2008, most likely by the end of Season Five. (Or that will be part of the cliffhanger and we'll see that they're back in 2008 in the first episode of Season Six.)
2) There's no avoiding "the war" on the Island once everyone's back together in 2008. I'm still betting on the fact that it's New Dharma, led by Bram and Ilana with the help of whatever's in their crate. The Losties will have essentially come full circle since their plane originally crashed. They will now work with the Others to help protect the Island from new intruders. Poetic, no?
[Here we go again.] 3) Absolutely nothing that happens is going to "erase" the original Flight 815 crash for the characters we've come to know and love. (Whether or not they can prevent the crash for future versions of themselves, however, is up in the air. See theories 1 and 2.)

I've said before that I think it would be an extremely depressing note for the series to end on if we find out that everything is predetermined and that nobody can do anything to change his or her fate. So I'm hoping either some version of theory 1 or 2 comes to pass, though I admit that they would be much harder to execute than theory 3. For now, however, I can dare to dream.


BEST LINES OF THE EPISODE

MS. HAWKING: ... I'm Eloise Hawking, and I believe it's my son's fault that Desmond has been shot.
PENNY: Your son is Benjamin Linus?
MS. HAWKING: [Scoffs] Good lord, no.




DR. CHANG: That is utterly absurd. What could possibly qualify you to make that kind of prediction? Hmm?
FARADAY: I'm from the future.


[You shoulda pushed Twitchy off the sub!] FARADAY: Hey, James.
SAWYER: Welcome to the meeting, Twitchy. Good to see you again. Pound cake's in the kitchen. Help yourself to the punch. [To Miles, in a lowered voice] Is he still crazy?
MILES: It's on a whole new level, man.



FARADAY: Well... why would you tell me that?
WIDMORE: Because come tomorrow, you won't remember I did.




[Just don't Jump the Shark like I did, guys.] SAWYER: Your mother is an Other?
FARADAY: You met her, actually, when the Island was skipping, back in 1954. They were calling her "Ellie."
HURLEY: You guys were in 1954? Like... Fonzie times?

JACK: She can say what she wants to say. Kate... You made me promise to never ask what happened to Aaron, or why you came back here. But I know that reason isn't... it isn't here. [Scoffs] It's not now.
SAWYER: Whatever her reason is, helping H.G. Wells here talk to his mommy ain't got nothing to do with it.



KATE: This is a mistake. He's talking about erasing everything that's ever happened to us, Jack. It's insane.
JACK: We disappeared off a plane in mid-air and ended up in 1977. I'm getting kinda used to insane.
(For once, it's Jack instead of Hurley who speaks for the audience!)


OTHER STUFF

- I'm still getting emails and comments about "the Seanie B situation." So in order to have a place to point people to instead of writing the same responses out over and over again, I included everything anyone would ever want to know about what's going on here.

- I'm on the road yet again next weekend, so chances are high that my next recap will be posted late. Sorry!

- There are so many great Lost-centric games, videos, toys, spoofs, shirts and whatnot out there that I gave up trying to link to everything I came across a long time ago. But something I read recently entertained me so much that I would be remiss if I didn't pass it along. It's a "Lost Haiku" contest that fellow blogger JOpinionated ran on her site. Some of the entries were just awesome, so I encourage you to check it out here.

As always, thanks for reading...

Until next time,
- e

Young blood
05-06-2009, 02:34 PM
awwww yeah.

chairmenmeow47
05-06-2009, 03:27 PM
i didn't read her theories cause i need to cut out soon, but thanks for posting! my thoughts:


Was I the only one expecting that the pages were already going to be full of Faraday's scribblings?

i TOTALLY thought the same thing.


[Lady, you're weird.] MS. HAWKING: I came, Penelope, to apologize. Your husband has become a casualty in a conflict that's bigger than him, that's bigger than any of us.

what kind of bitch uses the word "casualty" to describe someone bleeding out on a stretcher?!?!?


Finally, let me say here, for the record, that I'm really nervous about how Little Charlie was left alone in the hospital. Really. Nervous.

and i'm glad she mentioned this, cause i was really annoyed by this whole scene. i mean, if some sociopathic islander had just tried to kill me in front of my son and my baby's daddy was some crazy time-travelling key to the survival of humanity, i wouldn't let that child out of my grasp for a SECOND. but penny? "oh sure, just stand with these random people here, you'll be fine! here, this nice, creepy lady your daddy had a dream about visiting is here, i'll just walk away and hope the lady eventually leaves". i mean WHAT THE FUCK?!

TONIGHT, YAAAAAAAAY! i have a feeling it will be a lame "oh yeah, this is what the other losties are doing" type episode. of course every lost episode is good, but there's no way they can live up to last week.

Blinken
05-06-2009, 03:31 PM
what kind of bitch uses the word "casualty" to describe someone bleeding out on a stretcher?!?!?

Ummmm, he was a casualty. Maybe I am an asshole but that was the best description of his role in the whole thing. He was injured in the ongoing war between Ben and Charles, that is a casualty.

chairmenmeow47
05-06-2009, 03:47 PM
but when you're trying to communicate with someone, like eloise was with penny, using words like "casualty" to describe someone who was JUST shot and whose life hangs in the balance just makes penny focus on whether or not he is dead; it hurts the communication, it does not help.

Sexecutioner
05-06-2009, 03:51 PM
lost makes my brain hurt.

Blinken
05-06-2009, 09:24 PM
WOW, great episode. So much going on. Richard says everyone is dead, or were did they just jump to the near future? I don't know if we can talk about next weeks preview but interesting none the less. Can jacob be killed?Richard seems surprised by everything going on all the time. I really think the others now alot less than we give them credit for.

kitt kat
05-06-2009, 09:47 PM
WHAT
THE
FUCKKKKKKKKKK

im too drunk for this but

Richard is the smoke monster incarnate as a human
Miles will talk to dead Daniel

These are my predictions.


I CAN'T BELIEVE IT'S OVER NEXT WEEK :(

tessalasset
05-06-2009, 11:53 PM
i wanna know how the fuck kate, sawyer and juliet all get off the sub randomly. why does kate always mess shit up? that was SUCH an awkward 3rd wheel moment. i genuinely like sawyer and juliet together. i never would have guessed.

fikus222
05-07-2009, 12:01 AM
Yup, Kate sure has pussed out lately (but she has been disappointing me for a long time anyway).

Though, it's not like Daniel/Jack has a good or even viable plan. Detonate an H-Bomb and everything will be alright my ass.

Somewhat Damaged
05-07-2009, 05:39 AM
Richard is the smoke monster incarnate as a human


Maybe it's my dislike for Locke, but I actually think he may be the smoke monster incarnate. I strongly doubt the difference in him that Richard noticed last night was due to Locke finally having a purpose. He's credited the Island with providing him with so much knowledge/information yet he doesn't know how to find Jacob. I think Jacob is sort of an avatar of the Island, which is why Locke now wishes to kill him.

chairmenmeow47
05-07-2009, 08:17 AM
no way, seriously doubt it. i think jacob is just the voice of the island. seems to me alpert is probably merely the island's recruiter and business manager, lol.

i still maintain this statement about richard. why would the smoke monster be an incarnation of richard?! richard seems to be a human who has sacrificed some of his humanity (be it through a temple death like ben or something else) for the sake of the island and therefore the island uses richard to do it's bidding. i don't see why richard would be so powerful that a smoke monster is created by his presence.

last night was really confusing. i don't think alpert knows that the losties in '77 are dead, i think he just knows that the group of people they were associated with dies. i guess it's possible they could all be dead, it was just inserted into the episode so early on it makes me think it's a red herring.

sawyer on the sub was strange. they really focused on sawyer saying goodbye to the island, makes you wonder if they are gone for good. and fucking kate, what the hell?! you're in the 70's and you pissed off a bunch of crazy scientists, maybe you should have just stayed with the hostiles!!! ugh, i also felt bad for juliet even though i hate her. i'm kinda waiting for her to die at this point, what purpose other than keeping sawyer in line does she serve?

and killing jacob?! wtf?! an exodus of people into the jungle with the exact same music as season 4's pre-finale?! wtf?! i've got a critical eye on you lost, your move... make it a good one.

Sexecutioner
05-07-2009, 09:54 AM
i dont get why lock needed to tell alpert to go help him by the plane. this was the 2nd time it happened (at least). so how did it happen the first time? who told alpert to go there the first time if it wasnt lock? jeez, time travel is confusing.

and why the hell does lock want to kill jacob? my guess is that he thinks there is no jacob, and that jacob is really some false god made up to keep people on the island in line, just like every other god. thats why he asks ben if hes ever actually seen jacob. so "killing" him really means hes going to prove to everybody that he doesnt exist.

signmeup
05-07-2009, 09:58 AM
Maybe it's my dislike for Locke, but I actually think he may be the smoke monster incarnate. I strongly doubt the difference in him that Richard noticed last night was due to Locke finally having a purpose. He's credited the Island with providing him with so much knowledge/information yet he doesn't know how to find Jacob. I think Jacob is sort of an avatar of the Island, which is why Locke now wishes to kill him.

I agree, I think Locke is the Smoke Monster. Maybe Jacob has had control over him/it this whole time, summoning it, telling it who to kill etc, and he found Lockes body from the plane crash, took it over and is no longer tied to Jacob in that way so he is free to take his revenge.

signmeup
05-07-2009, 10:00 AM
and why the hell does lock want to kill jacob? my guess is that he thinks there is no jacob, and that jacob is really some false god made up to keep people on the island in line, just like every other god. thats why he asks ben if hes ever actually seen jacob. so "killing" him really means hes going to prove to everybody that he doesnt exist.


ooh this is also a good theory, but when Locke gets to the cabin to prove there is no jacob, there actually IS a jacob he punishes locke by killing all the others or something like that

chairmenmeow47
05-07-2009, 10:02 AM
why must the smoke monster be a manifestation of a person? just curious as to where these ideas are coming from.

tessalasset
05-07-2009, 10:03 AM
during that late night jungle hike i got super sentimental and murmured "awww....old school LOST."

ivy, sawyer's not gone for good. the preview showed sawyer, juliet and kate all back on the island, which made me ask how the hell did they get back there when the CG sub very unconvincingly submerged off the coast.

signmeup
05-07-2009, 10:04 AM
Alright, sorry for the triple post but has this been posted yet?


ABC says of next week’s two-hour fifth-season finale, titled “The Incident” and hailing the return of Rose and Bernard:

Jack's decision to put a plan in action in order to set things right on the island is met with some strong resistance by those close to him, and Locke assigns Ben a difficult task. Guest starring are L. Scott Caldwell as Rose, Sam Anderson as Bernard,

i removed the rest of the cast list in case it is spoilerish but LOOK! ROSE & BERNARD

tessalasset
05-07-2009, 10:07 AM
they better have an all-star lineup next week. i got goosebumps watching the preview. LOST movie!!!

signmeup
05-07-2009, 10:07 AM
why must the smoke monster be a manifestation of a person? just curious as to where these ideas are coming from.

I dunno haha, assuming that the hallucinations people have are caused/actually are the monster, it could take any shape? possibly? just a hunch really I suppose. most likely not true though

chairmenmeow47
05-07-2009, 10:09 AM
THANK YOU FOR POSTING ABOUT ROSE & BERNARD! my friend and i were getting really annoyed about that last week.

thanks for the info, tessa. i want to know how they come back too. i wonder if the energy release or possible bomb detonation changes the "bearings" on how to leave...

signmeup
05-07-2009, 10:09 AM
http://www.aintitcool.com/node/40995

heres a link to the page with the full cast list, looks interesting!

minor SPOILERs

bug on your lip
05-07-2009, 10:10 AM
rose is the smoke monster

chairmenmeow47
05-07-2009, 10:11 AM
rose is the smoke monster

racist

tessalasset
05-07-2009, 10:11 AM
dont post the cast plz for anyone who clicks that link. i wanna be surprised!

adamnikyo
05-07-2009, 10:11 AM
sawyer on the sub was strange. they really focused on sawyer saying goodbye to the island, makes you wonder if they are gone for good.

Did you not watch the SCENES FROM NEXT WEEK that aired immediately after the credits?

bug on your lip
05-07-2009, 10:12 AM
the scenes from next week were from the past tho

keep up adam

chairmenmeow47
05-07-2009, 10:14 AM
Did you not watch the SCENES FROM NEXT WEEK that aired immediately after the credits?

no, my dvr cut this off :(

adamnikyo
05-07-2009, 10:15 AM
ivy, sawyer's not gone for good. the preview showed sawyer, juliet and kate all back on the island, which made me ask how the hell did they get back there when the CG sub very unconvincingly submerged off the coast. One time I got in my car and drove away from my house, but then I turned around and came back.

adamnikyo
05-07-2009, 10:16 AM
no, my dvr cut this off

Jack eats Sawyer.

Sexecutioner
05-07-2009, 10:19 AM
no, my dvr cut this off :(

reprogram that shit! i set mine to record a couple extra minutes to be safe.



and fuck, i feel like season 5 just started, and its already almost over. i hate you for leaving me, lost.

chairmenmeow47
05-07-2009, 10:22 AM
i actually had it set just fine, but someone on fark said it might start late last week, so i re-adjusted and messed myself up.

i am having a lot of trouble trying to figure out what season 6 will be, but i guess next week will open that can of worms.

signmeup
05-07-2009, 10:26 AM
and fuck, i feel like season 5 just started, and its already almost over. i hate you for leaving me, lost.

same :(

Somewhat Damaged
05-07-2009, 10:52 AM
why must the smoke monster be a manifestation of a person? just curious as to where these ideas are coming from.

I got the idea from one of those DarkUFO blogs that Young blood posts. It was initially posited in the review of that episode when Ben goes to the temple for judgment. The blog noted instances like Ben hearing a rustling in the woods after he's summoned the smoke monster, telling Sun to go inside because something's coming out of the woods that he "can't control," and Locke emerging instead. Then when Ben fell into the temple, Locke left to get something to help him out, and that was when Ben encountered the smoke monster, who told him not to "even think about trying to kill Locke again." After the smoke monster disappeared, Locke returned.
And of course there was a connection established between Locke and Smokey way back in season 1, when Locke confronted it and lived to tell the tale. This isn't to say that Locke has been corrupted by the smoke monster all this time, but perhaps the smoke monster assumed Locke's body/form after his corpse returned to the island.

I dunno. Not a theory I'd stake my reputation on, and I suspect we won't get a definitive answer on it this season, but it's something that struck me immediately after last night's episode ended.

Young blood
05-07-2009, 05:01 PM
I think that the smoke monster revived Locke in his casket and flashed all images to him that he needed to know in a similar fashion that it judged Ben in the Temple. Locke will not kill Jacob.....only set him free.

fikus222
05-07-2009, 05:08 PM
why must the smoke monster be a manifestation of a person? just curious as to where these ideas are coming from.

I know, right? Most of the time I don't even bother reading people's theories. Lost is weird and has some really cool twists and stuff, but most people take it way too far.

tessalasset
05-07-2009, 06:13 PM
One time I got in my car and drove away from my house, but then I turned around and came back.

thank you, sir.


it's just that there were waaayyy more people on that sub than just the three of them. 1) how did they know something fucked up? I guess dharma could have radioed them that something was going down and sawyer overheard it or something. 2) maybe they had to go back to pick up someone else? 3) sawyer, kate and juliet took over the sub? but still...i mean at least 2/3 of them REALLY wanted to leave. whyyyy would they go back? even if the sub was radioed that something bad was going down...they're in the safest place they could be right now.

tessalasset
05-07-2009, 09:29 PM
OMG. my friend alex just called me from LAX. he said they are sitting in traffic and marvin fucking candle is sitting alone on a bench at american airlines right next to them. i said "DUDE yell something out to him!!!" so they're gonna circle around and if he's still there he's gonna yell out "i'm from the future!" i was gonna suggest something like "we gotta detonate the hydrogen bomb" but then realized it probably wasn't such a good idea to yell that out at LAX.

chairmenmeow47
05-08-2009, 08:10 AM
i can tell you right now i'd fake a heart attack or something if i saw someone from LOST on my flight. fuck that shit, cause i generally sit in the tail and i'll be damned if imma let that ana lucia bitch run things.

ShyGuy75
05-08-2009, 08:12 AM
shit last episode was shit

Leeartlee
05-08-2009, 08:27 AM
Prediction: Sawyer, faced with the choice of choosing between his new love Juliet or his old flame Kate, will have a break down at a molecular level, morph into a blow fish, and swim into the open ocean. That and Locke will travel through time to have a greco-roman wrestling match with Jack, winner take all.

chairmenmeow47
05-08-2009, 09:19 AM
the wrestling comment made me wonder how many times we've had to watch jack take off/put on shirts. they must have quite a stash of those bai ling tattoos.

kitt kat
05-08-2009, 10:06 AM
http://21.media.tumblr.com/2sofxuLkTn7apz00FE8eVCxko1_500.jpg
LULZ

ivankay
05-08-2009, 10:09 AM
That's too funny.

Leeartlee
05-08-2009, 10:46 AM
I especially like the fine print:

"Venue may randomly change location without notice"

Young blood
05-08-2009, 10:49 AM
super.


Things I Noticed - "Follow the Leader" by Vozzek69
Posted by DarkUFO at 5/07/2009 07:47:00 PM (Comments: 216) Comment Pop-up
Labels: Follow The Leader, Recaps, Vozzek69

Last year's pre-finale episode of LOST, Hiking Across Hawaii, produced some pretty lackluster reviews. This year however, they remembered to fill the episode with some pretty kickass stuff. We got the trifecta this week: plot advancement, humor, and a dream-team which reunited Richard, Ben, AND Locke. In setting up the board for next week's big game, both the 77' and 07' storylines contained epic new material. And as they flashed between those storylines, I was happy no matter which one landed on my screen. When it comes to LOST, that's always a good sign. Things I Noticed:
When Someone Charges You on Horseback, You Might Wanna Duck

As we see Faraday shot again, Jack's urgent need to fix things is about to go head-to-head with Kate's infamous flight instinct. But before we can see which one wins, Widmore performs rhinoplasty on Jack with the butt of his rifle. This makes the 3,451st time the 815'ers are captured by the Others. But hey, who's counting?


Boar. It's What's For Dinner.

John Locke v.2.0 knows how to make a great entrance. As he assumes the leadership mantle of his new tribe, he also provides them with something a lot more appetizing than the hideous squid and fish they're drying. Locke continues his fresh new matter-of-fact approach to all situations, which is just fine by me. Being direct is not a skill the Others ever managed to acquire, but with John around it looks like that's going to change.

Richard's building of what could be the Black Rock might be a clue that he was once tied to the slave ship... but I don't think so. I'm pretty sure he'll turn out to be way older than that. This episode, we finally learn more about Richard's role in the story: he's an ancient advisor. So we've got deputies of fate like Abaddon and Hawking, and we've got Richard in the role of camp counselor. With his book of laws and a rusty old compass, he gets to sit around building model ships until it's time to help identify the next leader of the Others eternal campout. Oh yeah, and he gets to stay young forever too. Not that bad a gig, really.

There are a few important elements to this scene. The first are Richard's words to Sun, after she shows him the recruitment photo. The fact that he "saw them all die" doesn't mean much here, because he could easily be talking about the Dharma initiative in general and referring to the purge. But if he's not, it's gonna make the finale a hell of a lot more interesting.

I thought it was also important to note how compassionate Locke is still treating Sun. His agenda doesn't include Jin directly, but Locke is still stringing her along with kind words, offering her water, and patting her hand with reassurance. He even gives her his word, which may or may not be good at this point. But with Locke 2.0 being all about business, why would he take the time to show Sun kindness and emotion? I think the answer to that lies in the fact that although the new Locke is undoubtedly island-influenced, there's still a measure of the old John Locke lying somewhere beneath the surface. And I'll bet that when the show ends, that Locke is going to become very important.

Locke's words to Sun were also interesting: "I don't think we went through all this for nothing, Sun." This seems to indicate a definite sense of purpose; not just for him but for all of our main characters. Where old Locke was a follower, flowing along with the island's stream of never-ending (and repeating) events, new John Locke is suddenly anti-destiny, striding purposefully through the island's jungles and across its beaches in an attempt to make a difference. He's instilled with both knowledge AND an objective. And his objective is the exact opposite of Ben and Richard's, which I think I've finally figured out:

The Others: Extreme Campers? Or Something More?

Since last week, I've had the impression that the Others have all been guardians of LOST's time loop, living only to keep it alive. Somewhere down the line, a horrific event takes place that needs to be avoided. I think most of us can agree by now that the release of the island's inner energy causes time to fold back on itself, looping over and over again. This loop of time must begin somewhere and end somewhere (the incident? the 815 crash?), but everything in between is the only thing that matters to the Others. This is where they reside, and this is what they protect.

So these people survive on and on, living from generation to generation, making sure that everything happens up to and including the important point where time folds back upon itself. They have knowledge passed on from forever ago, and their agents (Hawking, Abaddon, etc...) use this knowledge to ensure that the everything happens in proper order. Richard is the Other's constant. Since he never dies, he's the keeper of all the advanced knowledge - he passes this on to each successive chosen leader. He knows what must be done and guides everyone accordingly. And if I were him, I'd probably be bored out of my skull right about now, too.

I'm thinking the Swan hatch MUST get built in order to allow the time loop to occur. Everyone knows this. This is why the Others are allowing a full-blown construction team to dig in their territory. This also explains why they'd leave Desmond alone for all those years, so he could keep on pushing the button.

When you consider that only the leaders really know what's going on, the rest of the Others' tribe members are resigned to lame tasks like fishing, hunting, sewing up those cool cloth tents, and getting shot every couple of episodes. They're generations removed from knowing anything about what's going on. Every once in a while a leader gives them an important task that will shape the future, such as clearing off the runway on the Hydra island, but they're too much in the dark to even know why they're doing such things. They've been followers for so long, they no longer even know who or what they're following. Just look at how they all stumbled, zombie-like, into a line of well-behaved sheep when Locke announced he was taking everyone to the movies.

So now, where does Jacob fit into all this? And why are they following him? The answer is that they're not. Even worse, they never really were. More on that at the end.


Caged Heat (1977)

At long last, we finally get to see Jack dish out some crying. For five seasons now, he's always been at the receiving end of the waterworks. As Jack explains his plan to wipe the slate clean by changing history, Kate picks this exact moment to suddenly open up and express her true feelings to him. Awesome. This was information Jack could've used, oh I don't know, maybe 12,000 vicidins ago.

Kate looks horrified at Jack's suggestion that he erase their future past. From the face she makes when Jack mentions flight 815 landing in Los Angeles, some of it has to stem from Kate knowing she'll be back in handcuffs. But from the rest of it, I guess we're supposed to gather that Kate truly does love Jack. I never really doubted this, but I think she somehow loved Sawyer more. Can she love both? Not sure. But Kate seems to do the most soul-searching when she's in captivity, and her love always seems conditional on her current situation. This is exactly the type of flip-flopping that dooms her character to ridicule.

But let's not ignore the Aaron factor. Kate's tears are also for him. Reversing the past and not ever knowing the love a mother can have for her son would be absolutely devastating to Kate. Even though she'd be indirectly keeping her promise to bring Claire back, Kate can't stand the thought of destroying her entire past history as Aaron's mother. This is kind of touching, and it also makes her character more appealing to me.


Believability Sure Goes a Long Way Toward Advancing The Plot

It's pretty cool to see how a slow, rational explanation can finally go a long way toward influencing someone on LOST. Dan's gun-toting approach to diplomacy falls miserably short when compared to Jack's open, honest conversation with Eloise. And once again we're suddenly feeling a little sorry for someone who, only last week, was labeled a cold-hearted murder. The younger version of Ellie not only believes Jack, she also wants to help reverse her actions by agreeing to his pretty wild plan.

We also learn a little more here about Widmore and Hawking: both of them seem to be on equal footing when it comes to ruling the Others. I was surprised at how little resistance he gave her after she explained what she planned to to. Watching him place his hand on her stomach, we can also assume she's already pregnant with Daniel.


Are you SURE Radzinsky is Really Dharma Material?

Somebody needs to take a second look at his application. For someone hanging out in the 70's, Radzinsky's not very full of peace or love. His vehement assertion that the Swan station needs to stay on schedule seemed to indicate he's operating under a different set of orders. This was made even more clear by how easily he seized control away from Horace.

So why are the big bosses at Ann Arbor so obsessed with getting the Swan done? From what we know so far, its only purpose is to study a magnetic anomaly. This can't be the case anymore - someone definitely knows something (or maybe even has advanced knowledge of that something). Hopefully Radzinsky will reveal this later on. For now though, we get to watch him beat up Sawyer - and see Phil slap girls. Not cool Phil. If I were him, I wouldn't be doing that with the finale coming up and all.

And don't reduce Sawyer's loyalty solely to Kate. Just because they did a freeze-frame on her tiny little ass doesn't mean Sawyer wasn't trying to protect all his other friends too. This was apparent when Juliet was about to say something and he told her not to get anyone else hurt. Sawyer won't betray any of his friends. So when Radzinsky gives Sawyer pencil and paper, I'm pretty sure he's going to get a diagram of Disneyland. This should lead Radzinsky's team into a shitstorm of trouble during the finale... and it might put the blast door map a little off, too.


Alright Dude, We're From the Future...

Incredibly awesome scene. From the last minute grab of the vanilla cookies to the look Jin gives Hurley when he doesn't know the president, this is one of my favorite moments of the season. Chang continues to be amazingly cool. I loved the interaction between him and Miles when it was finally revealed that he was his son. By believing Daniel's prophecy and buying into their story, we're set up later in the episode for the inevitable send-off between Chang and his wife/son. Although we knew this would happen anyway, it was pretty touching to see. Miles' mom resented her husband not for doing anything wrong, but for not explaining why she had to be shipped off the island, never to see her husband again.


Desmond May be the Constant, But...

Gonna put a new spin on one of my old theories here, going back to S3 when I called him the 'indestructible epicenter of all things'. I talked about this a little on the ODI podcast last week, but I wanted to put it here for everyone who didn't hear it. Here goes:

The Variable is Hurley.

Since the very beginning of LOST, this has been true. We've never seen it so clearly until now, because we've never really had reason to scrutinize it. But let's examine the evidence for a minute, and then you guys can make your own assumptions. Here's what I'm saying:

* Hurley almost didn't make Flight 815. In fact, the woman at the counter tells him: "I don't think you're supposed to be on this flight, dear".

* When Ben sees Hurley on Ajira 316, he looks him in the eye and tells him: "Hugo, who told you to come?"

* In Left Behind, episode S3.15, Hurley stands on the beach with Sawyer sitting behind him. He then looks out into the ocean, and says "I'm not supposed to be here".

* In Locke's vision where Boone's wheeling him through the airport, Hurley's the only person not getting on the plane. Everyone else is boarding the flight, but Hurley is not a passenger: instead he's stamping tickets at the gate.

* In S1, Hurley knew he wouldn't die on the bridge. He just had a 'feeling' he'd be alright - and he was. At the end of S3 Hurley knew he could get that 30+ year old van to start... and he got it started. He drives the van into Pryce through a hail of gunfire, without ever taking a single bullet.

* Jack, Kate, Sawyer, and Hurley all get captured by the Others. But Hurley was the one person they let go.

Hugo has always been lucky: rolling the dice, winning at horseshoes, never missing at basketball, winning the lottery. He eternally makes his own luck... and if this is the case, it stands to reason that he can make his own future. Hugo makes his own kind of music - he's been doing this both on and off the island. He's untouchable, unreachable, and the island can't affect him for a very simple reason: he's not supposed to be here.

Think about Hurley's distractions, too. The island tried to bribe him with a storeroom of food, but Hugo blew it up. It tried to offer him romance, but then his potential girlfriend gets shot. It even tries to get him to kill himself... by using Dave to almost convince Hurley to jump off a cliff. Didn't work.

Outside of the island? Hurley's in a mental institution, where someone is watching over him (because they can't touch him) to make sure he stays put. He gets out anyway. Then he's captured and imprisoned by the police. Somehow he gets out of that, too. No matter what happens, Hurley can't be contained. Hurley can somehow even see Jacob's cabin, because he's not affected by whatever illusions or smokescreens the island puts up.

Even now, it's no coincidence that Hurley's the one voice arguing in favor that things can be changed. He argues with Miles in Whatever Happened Happened, and he's trying to rewrite history with his Empire Strikes Back script. Hurley's seen more ghosts than anyone else. Charlie comes to Hurley as a ghost, telling him "They need you". Who needs him? Everyone else in the story. The Hurley bird is even shrieking his name over and over in the finale. The answer is obvious to me: Hurley's the one person who'll end up changing things.

What's funny is that we've always thought the game changer would come from one of the bigger players: Desmond, Ben, Jack, Locke - but if you think about LOST in general, it makes sense that such changes would come from someone you'd least expect. Hurley is perfect because no one's expecting him to matter. He's done nothing but cook, divide up food, play **** pong, and make everyone else laugh - including us.

Hurley is the island's very big problem because he's the one person who's "not here for a reason". And that's the very reason why he'll end up being so important: WHH can't apply to Hurley, because he was never a part of the plan (timeline?) in the first place. In short, I'm saying Hurley is the variable. Just tossing that out there, so let's hear everyone's thoughts on it!


Benjamin Linus... Bitter Betty? Or Slow-Playing The Island?

Here's one to hate on: I think Ben's not half as stupid as he acts this episode. Michael Emerson is an amazing actor, which is why you can tell when he's intentionally over-acting. Ben's comments throughout this episode ranged from false bitterness ("Why John, afraid I'll stage a coup?") to artificial astonishment ("What just happened? Where did you go?") to over-the-top sarcasm ("Your timing was impeccable, John!"). If you doubt it, just listen to him when Locke mentions the Beechcraft: "What plane?!?!?!". Yeah, right. Clearly he's acting here, and not doing a very good job of it (Linus, not Emerson).

The reason for this is pretty simple: Ben's slow-playing the island. He intentionally wants the island (acting through Locke) to think he's stupid, that way it doesn't perceive him as a threat. Thinking pointedly back to Alex tossing him around that Egyptian chamber and calling him out on his murderous thoughts, Ben is attempting to keep the island out of his head. Acting dumb is the best way he can think of to accomplish this right now.

But one thing I don't think Ben's lying on... when Locke calls him on never having seen Jacob? That's the truth. I don't think Ben ever has seen Jacob. Ben was never meant to be a chosen leader of the island anyway.


Can Sayid Go Three Episodes Without Shooting Someone? All Signs Point to No

Just when it seems the 815ers and the Others finally have a common goal, Kate's flight instinct once again gets someone killed. Sayid interrupts the can't-we-all-just-get-along moment by shooting another one of the Others. And as he moves forward while keeping everyone at gunpoint, I thought it interesting how quickly Richard stepped in front of Eloise to protect her from getting shot next.

So many times throughout the show we've seen diverging agendas; groups splitting up because each disagreed with the other's end goal. Here we've got Jack and then Sayid arguing on the side of bringing everything to a bombtacular end, which as Sayid succinctly points out would finish the story one way or another. Kate somehow expects to "get everyone else" to convince Jack he's wrong, which didn't make a whole lot of sense to me at the time.

In any case, the Egyptians built one hell of an underground tunnel system. I'm not sure how or why the bomb got down there, but if it's directly beneath Dharmaville this whole time maybe it explains why Miles' mother seemed to be suffering from some sort of radiation sickness in her later years. She's one of the only Dharma residents who reaches old age anyway, so it's kind of hard to make a comparison.


Good Riddance. Again. And This Time I Mean It!

Sawyer's idea to buy Microsoft and bet on the Dallas Cowboys is probably one of the soundest plans on the whole show. With Radzinsky being led safely away to wherever Sawyer's map sent him, everything's looking good from all angles. He and Juliet get to leave the island for a sweet bell-bottomed lifestyle, and his friends can do whatever the hell they want... being in shackles absolves Sawyer of any responsibility toward them at this point. It's totally win-win for him.

But then, just like before, Kate arrives to screw everything up. Suddenly Sawyer is now one crazy landlord and a pair of short shorts away from starring in his own twisted version of Three's Company. So much for his plans of eating popcorn and watching the 78' Superbowl.

With the finale only a week away, it's obvious that the sub never gets to leave the island. I'm not sure how it happens, but if I had to guess? Kate convinces them to go back - which is a nice twist on Jack trying to convince her to go back two seasons ago. If Jack were to succeed in what he's trying to do, Juliet and Sawyer would never get to have their off-island life anyway. I'm thinking maybe Horace is also on the sub. He seems to owe allegiance to Jim Lafleur, and is probably pissed at being upstaged by Radzinsky. If I had to guess, he'd be the one to free them from the cuffs. Can't wait to see what happens to Phil.


There is No Spoon

As the episode progresses, Richard begins to understand Ben's point about Locke potentially "becoming a problem". It looks as if this new version of John Locke is going to pull back their curtain and expose the pile of bullshit that is Jacob. Or at least, maybe this is what Locke thinks. To Ben and Richard however, the story's probably a lot different.

There definitely has to be a Jacob. Not only have we seen his cabin, but we've heard him speak. We've also seen him actually re-wind time: at the end of Locke's first encounter with him, we saw that broken lantern (and the fire it started) instantly fix itself. We saw a ring of ash around Jacob's cabin, which originally seemed like it might've been there to protect it from being discovered or seen. Later on though, it became more and more obvious that the ring of ash was probably there for the opposite reason: to keep Jacob IN. We also saw a very worried look on Ben's face when he saw that the circle had been broken, almost as if he were worried that something had escaped. Incidentally, this is also when we started seeing quasi-evil Christian and Claire.

So Ben and Richard both know of Jacob, but instead of following his orders maybe they've just kept him imprisoned all this time. They do whatever's needed to keep the time loop on track, in order to keep whatever happened still happening correctly. "Jacob" is how they keep their followers in line. The refer to his "orders" whenever necessary, making sure everyone does what they're supposed to. No one can question Jacob, because no one has ever seen him. The very act of questioning him incurs everyone else's wrath. He becomes, in effect, the island's version of God.

On a side note, this also explains Widmore's wry reaction to Richard just after he'd brought young Ben to the temple: "Jacob wanted it done". As leader, Widmore knows Jacob said no such thing, but he also knows that's what Richard has already told his people. To keep up the illusion of this supreme being, he has to accept and acknowledge it in front of everyone else.

Now we find out Locke wants to kill Jacob. Perhaps he only wants to kill the illusion of Jacob - once he does that, he puts himself firmly in command. Or maybe he wants to free Jacob from whatever temporal prison he seems stuck in, and the only way to do that is through the same method he himself was resurrected: death. The only thing we can be sure of is that whatever spirit wants this done (the island? the smoke monster?) is now acting through Locke, and is probably trying to get rid of a long-standing island problem that both Richard and Ben were trying to hide or keep from it.

To sum it up, maybe Jacob did exist at one point. If so, I'm guessing he was a realllllllly bad dude. Maybe he caused assloads of problems and was finally contained, similar to a demon or something along those lines. It probably took a lot of time and a lot of effort to finally put Jacob down, and now Locke's talking about revisiting a very bad scenario. I think both Ben and Richard are genuinely afraid of Jacob - they don't seem to be pretending when it comes to that.

But what happens when Locke gets there? Can't wait to see it.

Blinken
05-08-2009, 10:53 AM
That poster is Awesome. :thu



the wrestling comment made me wonder how many times we've had to watch jack take off/put on shirts. they must have quite a stash of those bai ling tattoos.

Those tattoos are Mathew Foxes real tattoos.

chairmenmeow47
05-08-2009, 10:53 AM
previously lostpedia said the purge (http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Purge) was 92, now they're saying more like the 80s, wtf?!

and thanks for posting J$$$, i'm trying to finish before my next meeting :)

tessalasset
05-08-2009, 11:07 AM
yeah 80s sounds right. that 92 threw me off cause i was under the impression ben was supposed to be a late teen when he killed his dad, maaaaaybe early 20s. 92 would have made him like 30 something.

Blinken
05-08-2009, 11:28 AM
Great recap, I really liked the parts about Hurley.

jusbcus25
05-08-2009, 03:17 PM
I also wondered what happened to Rose and Bernard. This finale better be good. I wasnt impressed with this weeks episode but I guess its the calm before the storm. and Kate is such a third wheel. akward.

fikus222
05-08-2009, 04:49 PM
The scene was with the Sub pulling away from the dock and submerging had to be the worst special effects that Lost has ever had. They must have had like no time to put it together before it was aired.

benhur
05-08-2009, 05:16 PM
if u really go through the catalogue you'll see lost's special effects are all shite, but i don't really give a shit cause that's not why im watching.

kitt kat
05-08-2009, 05:52 PM
The scene was with the Sub pulling away from the dock and submerging had to be the worst special effects that Lost has ever had. They must have had like no time to put it together before it was aired.

this is the first thing my boyfriend said

fikus222
05-08-2009, 05:58 PM
if u really go through the catalogue you'll see lost's special effects are all shite, but i don't really give a shit cause that's not why im watching.

My favorite was the Polar Bear attack from Season 1. Someone did a screen shot and the Polar Bear looked like a stuffed animal that some crew member threw at Sawyer.

atom heart
05-09-2009, 07:00 AM
They need to pay their enormous cast before they give anything to their Mill.

tessalasset
05-09-2009, 12:17 PM
yeah it definitely looked like a cartoon but oh well. at least they put a shit ton of time and effort into their locales.

fikus222
05-09-2009, 12:58 PM
yeah it definitely looked like a cartoon but oh well. at least they put a shit ton of time and effort into their locales.

Definitely, Lost tends to be very beautiful. Anyway, I wasn't complaining about the CG, I was just commenting cuz it was funny.

tessalasset
05-09-2009, 11:11 PM
definitely it was.

Compound Eye
05-10-2009, 11:02 AM
I hope we get to see claire again in the finale. Perhaps an explanation as to why she hangs out in the cabin too

Tylerdurden31
05-10-2009, 02:09 PM
I just saw miles on the street which is kinda funny cuz I just watched the episode of Oz that he was in

chairmenmeow47
05-11-2009, 08:41 AM
all CGI on this show is shit, nothing new.

OnlyNonStranger
05-11-2009, 08:53 AM
I just saw the Onion movie and there is a sketch that Jin is in. He was hilarious.

chairmenmeow47
05-12-2009, 03:43 PM
is tomorrow's finale 1 or 2 hours?

i am so, so, SO bummed that my dad is graduating tomorrow and i will have to watch lost after :( at least i'll get to see obama speak, but man, what a shitty night to graduate!!! i'm going to have to turn my phone off till i watch!

Blinken
05-12-2009, 03:51 PM
2 HOURS :D :D :D :D :D

Courtney
05-12-2009, 03:54 PM
Before "Lost," Emerson, now 54, had carved out a career as a classically trained actor who hailed from Toledo, a small farming town in Iowa. He landed stage roles (and, while at the Alabama Shakespeare Festival in 1994, met his future wife, Carrie Preston, a fellow actor who now stars on HBO's drama, "True Blood"). He won the occasional TV guest role, and won an Emmy for his performance as a serial killer on "The Practice."

Then came a character Emerson hails for "alertness and calculation," even while conceding that Ben "is deeply flawed. He's a wreck. He's a teller of half-truths."

Not that truth, in any ordinary sense, is commonplace on "Lost," as the finale is sure to demonstrate. It left Emerson "a bit shocked when I read the script," he confides.

"Can they DO that?" Emerson says he asked himself, sounding like any "Lost" fan.

I want to know what is so shocking. (Full fluff article here (http://www.honoluluadvertiser.com/article/20090512/BREAKING04/90512074/-1/).)

chairmenmeow47
05-12-2009, 03:54 PM
HUZZAH!

YOU'RE SCARING ME COURTNEY!!!!!!!!!!

Young blood
05-12-2009, 05:05 PM
I have not read any spoilers but I bet the entire cast of losties 1977, dies.

bballarl
05-12-2009, 05:11 PM
There is an interview with him in the Onion AV Club as well. Let me find it.

BobCaygeon
05-12-2009, 05:12 PM
More from Michael Emerson on tomorrow's finale:

TylGeXzd9as

Depending on what you consider a spoiler, you might not want to watch it...

bballarl
05-12-2009, 05:13 PM
http://www.avclub.com/articles/michael-emerson,27850/?utm_source=homepage_recent_features

kitt kat
05-12-2009, 05:59 PM
my boyfriend is done with all his finals tomorrow at 1, and THAT is when we begin drinking to celebrate the end of the lost season/the semester.

...i even think his housemate made a facebook event. *facepalm*

tessalasset
05-12-2009, 10:17 PM
can. not. wait.