AZ D'BACK Baseball...as well as other MLB talk

[boarderwoozel3]

When do the MVP and Cy Young awards get announced?

[boarderwoozel3]

Matt Stairs is my temporary hero :D :D :D :D

[iv3rdawG]

I thought he was their 3rd base coach.

[whynotsmile99]

what an exciting game. sucks the Dodgers lost it. Really though, this series with Philly is awesome.

[humanoid]

When do the MVP and Cy Young awards get announced?

usually in the few weeks after the World Series is over, I don't know that they've announced the specific dates yet though

[nahuatldream]

Hearbreak, man! Freakin' two homers. I hope the Dodgers can at least stretch it to seven games, and don't fold it up on Wednesday.

[ThomThom]

That eighth inning hurt alot but it was Torre's fault for making some terrible pitching changes throughout his rotation tonight. Major League Baseball is dreading a Phillies/Rays world series, it would be yet another world series that nobody in the country is watching.

[boarderwoozel3]

I'll watch the WS no matter who plays. And this business about Leagues dreading teams X & Y in the championship is silly. In the long run parity is good for sports.

[Down Rodeo]

I'm so depressed right now. We had this game in hand and just blew it. Who would have thought the Dodgers' bullpen would pick that moment to collapse? They had been lights out the whole postseason - it's not Torre's fault for the decision he made (although I wish Kuo had stayed in the game longer).

[humanoid]

I'll watch the WS no matter who plays. And this business about Leagues dreading teams X & Y in the championship is silly. In the long run parity is good for sports.

my team sucked this year, but I still watch the playoffs every year...simply, I love baseball too much to not watch the playoffs

It's definitely good for different teams and their fans to get a taste of winning every now and again....hopefully the Rays will get some fans out of this! (and keep them for a while, not just the playoffs)

[fatbastard]

Son of a bitch!

[Hopeless Semantic]

How can you not root for a team like the Rays? Yeah, they play on the opposite coast from me and other Los Angelenos, but that team is a feel-good story that I can definitely get behind. They've got a couple local products in Evan Longoria and Matt Garza (who, was mother fuckin' lights out against Lester yesterday) who represent the So. Cal area with talent and ability. While it would've been awesome to see the Angels vs. Dodgers series, I can get behind rooting for the Rays against the Phils just on principle.

[luckyface]

How can you not root for a team like the Rays?

Their fans.

[Hopeless Semantic]

Their fans.

They have fans?

[luckyface]

They have fans?

Case in point. They averaged like 16k fans a game before they started winning. Now that they are good, suddenly double that show up and think they deserve something for their 1 1/2 months of interest. The really sad part is even though the Rays are one of the best teams in baseball, they still can't draw shit for attendance. I don't know what it is about non-football sports fans in Florida. They really suck (Marlins & Heat fans, in particular).

[Hopeless Semantic]

Case in point. They averaged like 16k fans a game before they started winning. Now that they are good, suddenly double that show up and think they deserve something for their 1 1/2 months of interest. The really sad part is even though the Rays are one of the best teams in baseball, they still can't draw shit for attendance. I don't know what it is about non-football sports fans in Florida. They really suck (Marlins & Heat fans, in particular).

I wonder if it has to do with Florida being the end of the road for many Americans? I followed the Rays a close 2nd behind the Angels this year, and I noticed how empty the ballpark was. The thing is, they're getting a brand new field eventually and the question remains are they going to fill that one up or is it going to be a mausoleum like the Trop? Maybe baseball was a bad idea in Florida? The Marlins are 2-time world champions though, so it would be kinda sad to see them have to move. But, that is the way it is down there in Florida.

[TommyboyUNM]

Tim Wakefield is getting LIT UP! Tampa Bay leads 5-0 in the top of the 3rd. Carlos Pena, Evan Longoria and Willy Aybar with homeruns.

[bakersfield]

It is kind of crazy how hot those Rays bats are right now.

[Mr. Dylanja]

Let's hope Justin can look like BJ next year, dude's rakin'!

[faxman75]

Who celebrated the 5 year Bartman anniversary yesterday?

[humanoid]

Case in point. They averaged like 16k fans a game before they started winning. Now that they are good, suddenly double that show up and think they deserve something for their 1 1/2 months of interest. The really sad part is even though the Rays are one of the best teams in baseball, they still can't draw shit for attendance. I don't know what it is about non-football sports fans in Florida. They really suck (Marlins & Heat fans, in particular).

to be fair, this happens with most teams. The Yankees have the highest attendance in baseball, but in the 80's and early 90's, when they sucked during several seasons, they had weak attendance

I live in Orange County and have attended hundreds of Angels games over the course of my lifetime. Even during the pennant race of 2002, many fans did not attend regularly until they made the playoffs. Once they won the world series, it became trendy to wear all read and go to Angels games, now they sell out regularly and their fans are as obnoxious as teams that they used to ridicule

Its not as fun for fans to go watch terrible teams. There are plenty of newly obnoxious Rays fans, I completely agree, but it's definitely not unique to them
Success breeds higher attendance numbers

[paulb]

Wasnt there a Marlins game this year where paid attendance was like 200 or something? Just crazy all those empty seats there...

[luckyface]

to be fair, this happens with most teams. The Yankees have the highest attendance in baseball, but in the 80's and early 90's, when they sucked during several seasons, they had weak attendance

I live in Orange County and have attended hundreds of Angels games over the course of my lifetime. Even during the pennant race of 2002, many fans did not attend regularly until they made the playoffs. Once they won the world series, it became trendy to wear all read and go to Angels games, now they sell out regularly and their fans are as obnoxious as teams that they used to ridicule

Its not as fun for fans to go watch terrible teams. There are plenty of newly obnoxious Rays fans, I completely agree, but it's definitely not unique to them
Success breeds higher attendance numbers

It certainly does happen everywhere, but 14,000 fans for a baseball game is just pathetic. That is like less than a 1/3 capacity there!

[humanoid]

I agree it's pathetic, but to me, it's also partly the organization's fault for not putting a quality product on the field that the fans could enjoy watching regularly....their cheap strategy and terrible finishes though guaranteed them many high draft choices over the years, and they are beginning to reap the benefits...their team will at least be competitive for the next several years which should boost their fanbase, especially if they win it all this year....assuming they don't pull a Marlins move and jettison anyone making any money right after they win!

The Rays home attendance average is only boosted to the level it is too because of the 18-20 home games a year they play against the Red Sox and Yankees, without the numbers those teams bring in, it would be even far lower!

[ThomThom]

I wonder what kind of extension the Dodgers will offer Manny. I just hope it leaves room for them to re-sign some the underachievers, most of which will land elsewhere for more money.

[suprefan]

Lets drop all the money on Sabbathia and Manny, come on!!!! Yeah right, the McCourts are some cheap asses...

[boarderwoozel3]

Oh-so-sorry Dodgers :D

[Mr. Dylanja]

LA, you somehow manage to pull off some of the most lopsided trades of all time and still find a way to lose, thank you.

[humanoid]

I wonder what kind of extension the Dodgers will offer Manny. I just hope it leaves room for them to re-sign some the underachievers, most of which will land elsewhere for more money.

doesn't he have 2-$20 million a year team options that they would have to pick up then extend his contract?

whose contracts are up for them?

Furcal
Kent
Nomar
Lowe

anyone know who else?

[CuervoPH]

I don't remember off the top of my head who else as far as contracts go. I would personally like to have seen Kershaw start game 5 to get him some big game experience. Granted, he came out of the bullpen during the series, but I would think the Dodgers would want (and right now need) him in their starting rotation on a regular basis going forward. And, if he had started, the game 5 result couldn't have been much worse, especially with Furcal playing kickball at shortstop.

That being said, congrats to the Phillies, but go Rays!

[C DUB YA]

Just for the record - Dodger stadium really started to empty during the 8th inning. Esp the expensive seats next to Pat Sayjak (sp?), and Frank Gifford.

Fans just don't stay at those games like they do at other teams.

[bakersfield]

doesn't he have 2-$20 million a year team options that they would have to pick up then extend his contract?

whose contracts are up for them?

Furcal
Kent
Nomar
Lowe

anyone know who else?

Not positive, but I believe Casey Blake

[nahuatldream]

Of the big names: Manny, Blake, Kent, Garciaparra, Furcal, Lowe, Maddux have contracts through 2008. Manny's options were voided as part of his agreement to get traded. Penny has a team option for 2009. Saito and Beimel are free agents after 2008 as well. I think they'll work to bring Manny, Saito, Beimel and Furcal back. Schmidt, Andruw Jones and Pierre are signed through 2009, 2009, 2011, respectively. Ew. They'll try their damndest to get rid of those guys. Andruw might be easier to move. Their young players remain under Dodgers controll, most of them are not even eligible for arbitration yet. The future is bright for the Dodgers.

[luckyface]

doesn't he have 2-$20 million a year team options that they would have to pick up then extend his contract?

The Dodgers waived the remaining two years on the contract. That is why Manny was a petty little bitch and forced his way out of Boston. Despite his talent, I think the Dodgers would be better served to let him walk.

[TomAz]

When I saw Furcal booting that grounder last night, the very first thing that popped into my mind was: "I need to turn that into a FAIL picture."

[humanoid]

The Dodgers waived the remaining two years on the contract. That is why Manny was a petty little bitch and forced his way out of Boston. Despite his talent, I think the Dodgers would be better served to let him walk.

oh yeah, I remember that now...thanks

Scott Boras is his agent so the Dodgers will inevitably be dragged into a ridiculous bidding war and nonsensical conversations about 6 year contracts and such if they are interested in keeping him. Without a doubt, Manny is one of the best run producers in baseball history, the guy can hit lie crazy...but I would definitely be vary wary of giving him a long term deal considering his unpredictable moods, lack of defensive ability and the fact that he will be 37 next may..he can hit with anyone, but I'm not sure I'd be willing to go over 3 years for him, but someone absolutely will

[TommyboyUNM]

Well. Top of the 1st and no outs and it's already 2-0 Rays. B.J. Upton with a 2-run HR. Man I hope the Rays can pull this out!

[paulb]

Lets drop all the money on Sabbathia and Manny, come on!!!! Yeah right, the McCourts are some cheap asses...

Sorry Chris, CC will be a Yankee next year.....

Im Calling It.

[bmack86]

When I saw Furcal booting that grounder last night, the very first thing that popped into my mind was: "I need to turn that into a FAIL picture."

yeah, you really do. That was pathetic. He did his part to make sure that the Dodgers didn't go to the World Series, in more than one game.

[vinylmartyr]

CC is building a house in LA and is strongly rumored we are his team of choice. I think the Dodgers will sign both of these guys. Man Ram 4 year 100 million and CC will get slightly less than Zito got. like 5 years 80 million.

[Sushov23]

Why do you guys think the Braves let go of Furcal? The Braves know when to unload/not resign players. Andruw Jones LA fans. hahaha. Rays in 5, wow.

[vinylmartyr]

The rumor is the Braves are gonna go after Lowe.

[Sushov23]

nice, I hadn't heard that. It makes sense, the braves need a reliable starting pitcher. I had only heard about the possible Jake Peavy trade.

[boarderwoozel3]

When I saw Furcal booting that grounder last night, the very first thing that popped into my mind was: "I need to turn that into a FAIL picture."

That is a wonderful idea.

[boarderwoozel3]

Oh, and I'm really looking forward to this TB vs. Pilly WS. Two young, exciting teams, looks pretty good on paper anyway. This is going to be the first year in a while that a Wild Card team didn't make the Series, interesting.

[humanoid]

Sorry Chris, CC will be a Yankee next year.....

Im Calling It.

as much as I would like that, I don't see him wanting to leave the NL....he has experienced amazing success after switching leagues, and he enjoys hitting

I know the Yanks will go hard for him though, after the PR hit they took after not seriously pursuing the Johann Santana trade

[humanoid]

fucking Red Sox aren't done yet....I really want them to be, but they've done this before...

[zenidogx]

tie game!!!

fuck!

[suprefan]

Oy.

[TommyboyUNM]

This fucking team won't die!!

[humanoid]

I hate the Red Sox, but I have to be impressed by their resilient nature..hope the Rays can finish them off in game 6

[bakersfield]

That was fucking crazy!

[paulb]

that was sad.... comon Tampa Bay! Beat those fucks.

[TomAz]

That was some crazy shit last night. You could see the wheels falling off the cart soon as Ortiz hit that homer.

I wish that Stephen Drew and Justin Upton were as good as JD and BJ.

[humanoid]

/\ well JD is about 7 years older than Stephen & BJ is about 3 years older than Justin...so you still have a little time for your wish to possibly come true for your your guys

[C DUB YA]

I'm now hoping the sox can come back.

amazing game last night.

[humanoid]

as a Yankee fan, I am more than familiar with ridiculous comebacks by the Red Sox...everyone I know kept saying"Sox are done".....but I'm not convinced yet

[paulb]

as a Yankee fan, I am more than familiar with ridiculous comebacks by the Red Sox...everyone I know kept saying"Sox are done".....but I'm not convinced yet

same here.... no lead is EVER safe with Boston still having at bats... Its crazy, during the regular season, their opponent scores 5 runs in the top of an inning, Boston come right back and score 5 aswell... Its just how it goes... I expect Boston to be out in game 6.... but i wouldnt be suprised if they won this series and swept the world series

[Hopeless Semantic]

I don't see Beckett having much this year. He's struggled the two times out this postseason, but then again, this is the damned Red Sox. Somewhere, someway, a Cubs fan is crying. I'm holding hope for the Rays to finish it on Saturday. If they dont then it'll be a Boston-Philly world series and I will tune out--but secretly wish for Philly to win. I'd take J-Rollins flashy ways over that douchebag Youkillis' Rasputin look anyday.

[vinylmartyr]

Jake Peavy said he would accept a trade to the Dodgers.

[Hopeless Semantic]

Jake Peavy said he would accept a trade to the Dodgers.

That's a pretty big anouncement. So, this means they can either go after CC too, and let Manny walk or vice versa...right? Or, do they go in a whole different direction?

[Sexecutioner]

i changed the channel in the top of the 7th last night, only to find out today what happened. i cant fucking believe that shit. god i hate boston sports teams more than any other city. their fans are the biggest douchebags ive ever come across. man, i hope they lose this series. or maybe it would be better for them to go on just to lose in the world series, just like the pats.

[vinylmartyr]

That's a pretty big anouncement. So, this means they can either go after CC too, and let Manny walk or vice versa...right? Or, do they go in a whole different direction?

I think we need to keep Manny at all cost. What good is Peavy if we don't score any runs. We would have to give up a lot to. I doubt it will happen but it's nice he thinks highly of us.

[humanoid]

Jake Peavy said he would accept a trade to the Dodgers.

I have a hard time believing that the Padres would want to get dominated by Peavy 5 times a year though, unless the Dodgers really, really blew them away with an offer

[paulb]

how the hell did Boston force a game 7!!! fuck them!

[boarderwoozel3]

Get your shit together TB. Bleh!

[C DUB YA]

You all know Boston is going to win tonight right?

[humanoid]

You all know Boston is going to win tonight right?

I was thinking to myself last night while watching Game 6, "if Boston wins tonight, they're taking the series"...hope not, but i see it being difficult for TB to quell this surge of momentum from Boston....I could kind of see Boston scoring like 5 runs in the first and winning like 13-2..or something similarly ridiculous

[paulb]

nothing hurt more than that Johnny Damon grand slam in game 7 back in 2004....

[humanoid]

nothing hurt more than that Johnny Damon grand slam in game 7 back in 2004....

that's exactly what I was envisioning when I was thinking about Boston knocking TB around tonight

that was weird, that night, I watched game 7 with this girl friend of mine....needless to say, I was terribly devastated, but right after, we walked across the street to watch Bob Dylan live at UC Irvine, had a great time, then after that, walked back across the street and watched Garden State and had another great time

wonderful evening, covering a broad range of emotions for myself...thankfully I did all the rest of that to soothe my pain from the horrendous Yankees collapse

[Sushov23]

I just changed it to the game, and I noticed fucking BOSTON is already up 1-0? what the hell?

[humanoid]

Dustin Pedroia hit a bomb in the top of 1

[Sushov23]

oh ok, fucking Red Sox. It's cool though, I know the rays will win. Once they do I can brag about being right about Rays in 7.

[humanoid]

/\ earlier in this thread, I also said Rays in 7 over Boston...but I'm not feeling so confident in that now

[dorkfish]

Rays win.

[Sushov23]

dodgers in 7, and rays in 7. the one I would like to see win is the Rays. Fun times.

WHAT UP BITCHES. Yes, fuck the RED SOX.

[humanoid]

impressive win, very cool

look how happy all their brand new fans are!

[luckyface]

I don't think I can watch the World Series. I have a massive headache from all of the bandwagon fans pounding on their cowbells.

[humanoid]

I'm happy for the few thousand that have been going regularly before last month

[Somewhat Damaged]

I don't give two shits about major league baseball but it warms my heart to know the fans of both the Boston Red Sox and Los Angeles Dodgers will have to watch the World Series without their respective teams in contention. Them and the Yankees can all go suck a dick.

[humanoid]

/\ That's what all of us Yankee fans have been doing since they were eliminated...lots and lots of dick, thankfully the Red Sox and Dodgers will all be joining in shortly

[Sushov23]

Now I hope the Rays win, but only because the Phillies are in the same division as the Braves.

[humanoid]

I hope the Rays win, because I want to be right about telling my friend back in July that they were going to win...and I get $50 out of it

unfortunately they're in my team's division, so that creates a problem, but I'll take them over the Red Sox any day

[Somewhat Damaged]

Which team's fans are more irritating? That's who I want to lose.

[Sushov23]

Both, they are both bandwagon fans. The rays didn't sell out their home divisional playoff games I think.

[humanoid]

/\ probably not, but remember the Braves didn't sell out their playoff games all the time either

they've sucked for so long, I'll cut the fans a little slack, not a lot, but a little....they had never won more than 70 games in a season

plus, half their fans are like 80 years old, it's tough for them to get out!!

[boarderwoozel3]

Which team's fans are more irritating? That's who I want to lose.

Philly and it's not even close. Sports fans in that town are a bunch of total assholes. TB is literally building their fanbase before our eyes.

I would like to see TB win and think they will on the strength of their pitching. David Price is going to make a nasty closer.

[humanoid]

/\ David Price is going to be nasty whether he's a closer or starter...he came up a starter, but he will be great either way

[TommyboyUNM]

/\ David Price is going to be nasty whether he's a closer or starter...he came up a starter, but he will be great either way


I think Price will be in the starting rotation next year. Can you imagine a rotation of Shields, Kazmir, Sonnastine, Garza and Price? Wow. I have a weird feeling I'm forgetting someone too..... Maybe not.

[humanoid]

Edwin Jackson is legit too, he's still only 25 and finally started to show some of the promise that they've expected from him for a few years

he won 14 for them this year

[suprefan]

Which team's fans are more irritating? That's who I want to lose.

Philly does hands down, classic franchise, and I know john Kruk is all happy about them going back to the series finally. TB hasnt been around long enough to get a rep about anything since nobody goes to see them play.

[zenidogx]

Rays in 7

[Sushov23]

Rays in 6.

[Mr. Dylanja]

Which team's fans are more irritating? That's who I want to lose.

They both already lost in the Championship Series....

[C DUB YA]

I'm not very interested in this world series.

But I'm pulling for the Phils

[Hopeless Semantic]

I have to root for the Rays. It won't matter who wins this Series--I like both teams better than the Red Sox, so I will have no horse in this race. I do, however, feel happy for Evan Longoria (Cal State University Long Beach), Matt Garza (Cal State Fullerton via Downey/Norwalk), Joe Maddon (Angels' longtime position coach) and Rocco Baldelli. The dude was almost forced out of baseball because of a mitochondrial situation. He singles in the 2nd run against his childhood team. Imagine doing that to a team you admire? I instantly began thinking about how special that must feel...

Regardless of the fans, Tampa deserved all of it.

[vinylmartyr]

I think this is Philly's year. The great thing is i'm pretty sure the Red Sox are over unless they really make some moves this off season. They will proabably still make the playoffs next year though. Any team counting on JD Drew to make it to the playoffs is in bad shape.

[Hopeless Semantic]

I think this is Philly's year. The great thing is i'm pretty sure the Red Sox are over unless they really make some moves this off season. They will proabably still make the playoffs next year though. Any team counting on JD Drew to make it to the playoffs is in bad shape.

Uh...no.

When you've got a starting rotation with Daisuke, Beckett (when healthy), Lester, and Bucholtz you don't need major moves. As big of a prick Papelbon is, he can damn well pitch. Also, homegrown talent like Pedroia, Ellsbury, and Masterson mean that the Red Sox can spend and do what the Yankees cannot--develop talent. Yes Ortiz, Drew, Varitek, and Lowell are all on the downslope of their careers, but to say they're not going to be right back chasing after the Rays in '09 is far from the truth.

I dislike the Red Sox, but I have to give them credit for being a well-runned organization.

[paulb]

now that was a great double play with the fly out and throw em out at home...

[humanoid]

I was surprised they tested BJ on that, he has a cannon, and it was pretty shallow

[Mr. Dylanja]

I think Ken Rosenthal is like 3'11''.

[bakersfield]

I have to root for the Rays. It won't matter who wins this Series--I like both teams better than the Red Sox, so I will have no horse in this race. I do, however, feel happy for Evan Longoria (Cal State University Long Beach), Matt Garza (Cal State Fullerton via Downey/Norwalk), Joe Maddon (Angels' longtime position coach) and Rocco Baldelli. The dude was almost forced out of baseball because of a mitochondrial situation. He singles in the 2nd run against his childhood team. Imagine doing that to a team you admire? I instantly began thinking about how special that must feel...

Regardless of the fans, Tampa deserved all of it.

Very well said!

[bakersfield]

I do like the way the Rays play ball.

[vinylmartyr]

http://www.all-nba-all-basketball.com/images/ANDREW_BYNUM_MIP_1.jpg

[bakersfield]

^Now...THAT's a wingspan!

[bakersfield]

Is anyone still watching the WS?
Discussion has evaporated. Probably like Fox's national TV ratings have evaporated for this nationally "uninteresting" matchup.
I have not been glued to the TV, but it is a good close series that I believe will go 7 games.

[paulb]

hopefully 7 games...or 6 for Tampa Bay.... but tonight is critical..if phillys win, they are taking the world series

[boarderwoozel3]

I've only been able to catch game one. TB really needed to beat Moyer.

[LooseAtTheZoo]

Which team's fans are more irritating? That's who I want to lose.

Cleveland has the most annoying fans in baseball, they are the one baseball team I actively root against every year. For the series, I would say the Rays, only because you know the majority of people cheering for them didn't give a crap about the team for the past 9.5 years

[vinylmartyr]

I hope the Phillies win cause it will make Mets fans miserable.

[paulb]

mets fans are already miserable....

[humanoid]

Is anyone still watching the WS?
Discussion has evaporated. Probably like Fox's national TV ratings have evaporated for this nationally "uninteresting" matchup.
I have not been glued to the TV, but it is a good close series that I believe will go 7 games.

I've been watching it casually..both teams looked a little sloppy the first few games, and it was a little uninspiring. I was all set to watch Game 3 on Saturday, but the rain delay screwed up my plans. Unfortunately that was the best game so far, but I only saw a little of it because I had something to do with my daughter.

I think Tampa Bay ran out of gas. They kinda spent themselves in trying to hang on against Boston in the ALCS, and they've looked terribly flat in the WS. Unfortunate. Hopefully they can still make it interesting, I don't want baseball to be over yet!

[C DUB YA]

I have had about 3-4% interest in this series.

[TomAz]

net or gross?

[Hopeless Semantic]

After witnessing the demise of the Red Sox, I really lost any interest in viewing the show. I don't know why, but I can't hate on either team winning the title. It is a breath of fresh air to know that Boston won't have anything more to celebrate this calendar year. Now, the talk is the Cassel-led Patriots have a darkehorses' shot at winning the title. Anyhow, it is for me at least a disdain for Boston (I'm a L.A. fan think Lakers/Boston) that has dulled the series.

[TomAz]

I have been watching bits and pieces of the series, mostly with the sound off so it's not so obtrusive. One thing I have noticed is the fans in Tampa are pretty lazy. Bases loaded, two outs, tie game, and they're sitting on their asses like they're enjoying sundowners on their yacht in the bay.

[Hopeless Semantic]

Florida is a conundrum in fandomship...

Outside of Gainesville, there isn't a fanbase that is really knock-your-socks off in terms of passion. I mean, the Bucs have a boisterous crowd, but the Marlins, Rays, Heat, and even the Dolphins (that could be attributed to the product on the field) lack that home field support. The only place I've seen anything substantial in The Swamp and that is truly amazing. How else can you watch a game where the local male population wear more jean cutoffs than the females. Mullets notwithstanding of course...

[paulb]

I think Philly's will win tonight..... but i hope Tampa Bay can come back...doubt it though

[bakersfield]

I am hoping the Rays can extend it at least another day.
For that to happen Longoria & Pena need to hit.

[zenidogx]

anyone watching the mudbowl?
it's pretty ridiculous. Upton was very lucky to make it home without slipping. this condition favors the power hitting Phillies. it'd be a shame if the Rays lose under these conditions.

[zenidogx]

update: rain delay

[ThomThom]

Hahahaha, did anybody see Bud Selig and the umpires at the press conference after the game?

[suprefan]

Game suspended til tomorrow at 5pm.

[Stainofmind]

This World Series is UNWATCHABLE. RED SOX and Phillies would of been a better series to watch. This is a repeat of 2006. No one gives a shit but the people in Philly and TB. Baseball Season is officially over for me.

[boarderwoozel3]

TB's offense is laying an egg and the pitching sucks too. Can they take game 5 at least?

[bballarl]

Thank you Rocco Baldelli.

[humanoid]

BJ Upton has killed every rally he's seen in the World Series...there can't be more than a couple at bats that he hasn't swung at the first pitch...relax man

[boarderwoozel3]

Seriously, I wonder if he's getting bad scouting or really does need take at a few pitches.

[boarderwoozel3]

If Philly is going to win the series I hope they do it tonight. Its cool seeing teams celebrate championships in front of their fans.

[zenidogx]

noooooo!

i missed the game up to this point!
no! damn you Phillies! if they were an AL team they'd never make it this far!

[menikmati]

those were some shitty called strikes.

[zenidogx]

well, until next year.

see you in the Spring, thread.

Phuck Philadelphia. I hope it gets AIDS.

[superfiction]

so close. and yet so far.

[humanoid]

why exactly did Maddon pinch hit Zobrist for Baldelli who had hit a huge clutch home run in his previous AB? it drives me crazy when guys over manage and put so much stock in the lefty vs righty thing....

oh well, congrats Philadelphia

[jazzz]

fuck! what a bore. It would of been fun to watch the low payroll RAYS take it.

[bballarl]

Bummer. Good season Rays.

[boarderwoozel3]

Can't remember who was asking which team had worse fans but who is watching the award ceremony? All the boooing... Those fans are such pricks.

[bballarl]

This awards ceremony is terrible. Why do they let women do this shit.

[rage patton]

How was that half hour long Obama comercial?

[boarderwoozel3]

Seeing as I didn't watch it I couldn't say. But Obama must have money coming out the ass if he can afford a half hour commercial/mini-program right before the World Series!

[humanoid]

How was that half hour long Obama comercial?

I'm so sick to death of election coverage, I couldn't bear to watch it

[Mr. Dylanja]

How was that half hour long Obama comercial?


All he wants is 4 small payments of $79.95.





































(S&H not included)

[vinylmartyr]

A's just got Matt Holiday

[humanoid]

A's just got Matt Holiday

I was very surprised about that one...hopefully it actually gets done, its not completed for sure yet

I'd never want to leave Colorado if I were a hitter!

[MeowMixer]

I Giv UP!@

[humanoid]

Lincecum for NL CY Young....is Cliff Lee gonna get the AL???

[vinylmartyr]

There are rumors that the Dodgers may sign Sabathia within the next 36 hours.

[vinylmartyr]

On the Dodgers message boards at least.

[dorkfish]

Giants have backed off of Furcal. They signed Edgar Renteria for 2 years / $18M.

[paulb]

There are rumors that the Dodgers may sign Sabathia within the next 36 hours.

i hope not.

[dorkfish]

If the Giants sign Sabathia, he'll lose all of his magic and get yanked all-season long after a couple innings.

If the Dodgers sign Sabathia, he'll be having Tommy John surgery before the season starts.

[dorkfish]

Pirates sign Indian pitchers from reality TV show

PITTSBURGH (AP) - The Pittsburgh Pirates hope Rinku Singh and Dinesh Patel really do have million-dollar arms.

The two 20-year-old pitchers, neither of whom had picked up a baseball until earlier this year, signed free-agent contracts Monday with the Pirates. They are believed to be the first athletes from India to sign professional sports contracts outside their country.

Singh and Patel came to the United States six months ago after being the top finishers in an Indian reality TV show called the "Million Dollar Arm" that drew about 30,000 contestants. The show sought to find athletes who could throw strikes at 85 mph or faster.

While neither pitcher threw hard enough to earn the $1 million prize, Singh made $100,000 from the contest and Patel made $2,500, plus his trip to the United States.

The contest was sponsored by a California sports management company that believed it could locate major league-worthy arms in a country of more than 1 billion. After working extensively with Southern California pitching coach Tom House since May, the pitchers staged a tryout in Tempe, Ariz., on Nov. 6 that was attended by 30 major league scouts.

"The Pirates are committed to creatively adding talent to our organization," Pirates general manager Neal Huntington said Monday. "By adding these two young men, the Pirates are pleased to not only add two prospects to our system but also hope to open a pathway to an untapped market. We are intrigued by Patel's arm strength and Singh's frame and potential."

Neither pitcher has taken the mound in a game situation, no doubt a first for a Pirates prospect. They have pitched in scrimmages against junior college competition.

Both threw the javelin in India, a country best known for producing cricket players, and neither the right-hander Patel nor the left-hander Singh had left his small village before coming to the United States. Singh was born in Bhadoni, Uttar Pradesh, and is the youngest of nine children. Patel is from Varanasi, Uttar Pradesh, and has four brothers and sisters.

The 5-foot-11, 185-pound Patel hit 90 mph on the radar gun during his tryout, and the 6-2, 195-pound Singh topped out at 84 mph. Each has thrown harder during workout sessions that weren't attended by scouts.

"Think of them as two Dominican kids," House told the scouts. "They're very raw. But I think this has a huge upside."

When they first came to the United States and began playing catch, the pitchers were mystified by the concept of gloves and had to taught not to try to catch the ball with their bare hands.

Despite being more than raw, the pitchers were signed by well-known agent Jeff Borris, who was attracted by their potential after watching them work out at Southern Cal.

Borris estimates they will need three to four years of minor league experience before becoming major league ready.

Patel and Singh are learning English, most of which they have picked up from watching ESPN's "Baseball Tonight" and by taking online classes.

"These young men have improved a tremendous amount in their six-month exposure to baseball and we look forward to helping them continue to fulfill their promise," Huntington said.

The signings represent a shift in policy for the Pirates, who have mostly ignored nontraditional markets such as Asia for players.

[MeowMixer]

Patel and Singh are learning English, most of which they have picked up from watching ESPN's "Baseball Tonight" and by taking online classes.

I love those Indians. They never fail to make me laugh. I'm pretty sure that the laws of political correctness are allowing them to be attacked right now. Something to do with outsourcing.

[bakersfield]

^Good story, but I wish the Indians would of signed those Indians.

[bakersfield]

From what I read & hear, it sounds like the Dbacks are really going to start playing "Moneyball".

[Mr. Dylanja]

Meaning???

[bakersfield]

Meaning???

rely heavily on the scouting dept to find the "cheap gems", but cut costs every chance they get....perfect example will be who replaces O-dog at 2nd Base.
And it will be interesting to see if Webb is re-signed.

These tough economic times will have an interesting impact on sports.

If you get a chance D, read "Moneyball". Great book chronicaling the genius of Billy Bean in small market Oakland.

[boarderwoozel3]

Lincecum for NL CY Young....is Cliff Lee gonna get the AL???
Called it. Haters.

Giants have backed off of Furcal. They signed Edgar Renteria for 2 years / $18M.
THANK GOD we didn't sign Furcal. Renteria isn't amazing but he's endlessly better than "I'm going to bat .150" Omar Visquel...

If the Giants sign Sabathia, he'll lose all of his magic and get yanked all-season long after a couple innings.

Not amused. But I honestly can't condone giving Sabathia big money with the state of our offense unless we're going to turn around and trade Cain and/or Sanchez for a power outfielder or corner infielder.

[dorkfish]

I'd prefer to trade Sanchez, because the prospect of having this rotation seem promising:

Lincecum
Sabathia
Cain
Lowry
Whomever

[boarderwoozel3]

Umm, you're forgetting Zito.

But yeah, that is a well balanced, quality starting rotation. Too bad they would need to go 7 innings and let in no more than 2 runs every night :rolleyes

[dorkfish]

I didn't forget Zito. He fits in as Whomever because you never know who will be pitching in the 2nd inning when Zito starts. Twice this past season, I showed up in the 2nd or 3rd inning at the ball park to find that Zito had already been pulled. RIDICULOUS.

[boarderwoozel3]

I'm done defending him. Fucking bum.

[dorkfish]

Too bad Shawn Estes isn't worth anything any more. There was always the off chance that he'd throw a shut out and hit 2 for 3 any night.

[boarderwoozel3]

And get yanked in the fourth in his next start. None the less, he had a good run with the Giants. I still have love for Estes.

[humanoid]

Called it. Haters.

THANK GOD we didn't sign Furcal. Renteria isn't amazing but he's endlessly better than "I'm going to bat .150" Omar Visquel...

Not amused. But I honestly can't condone giving Sabathia big money with the state of our offense unless we're going to turn around and trade Cain and/or Sanchez for a power outfielder or corner infielder.

I was on your side months ago regarding Lincecum

[boarderwoozel3]

No worries, the "Haters" was directed at a number of Brandon Webb supporters who's bias blinded them from the inevitable truth.

[humanoid]

cool, just wanted to be clear...I remember the haters

[boarderwoozel3]

Giants have backed off of Furcal. They signed Edgar Renteria for 2 years / $18M.



THANK GOD we didn't sign Furcal. Renteria isn't amazing but he's endlessly better than "I'm going to bat .150" Omar Visquel...


Well, I got duped by bad information on that one. I really don't like signing ex Dodgers, especially when it's directly from said scurrilous organization. If it had to go down like that I'd prefer at least one stop prior to joining the Giants to buffer out the stink.

Oh well, after 'ole Shmidtty took the Dodgers for all that money, I'd imagine the feeling is mutual.

[thewindowliquor]

Just got my #99 jersey in the mail. I made myself wait until he resigned before I placed my order.

[bakersfield]

Yep...Moneyball here we come!


Payroll to dictate D-Backs' dealings
Nick Piecoro - Dec. 6, 2008 08:47 PM
The Arizona Republic
So far, the off-season has not been particularly kind to the Diamondbacks.

They slashed 31 jobs from their front office. They are expected to slash payroll. They haven't been able to bring back left-hander Randy Johnson, despite his willingness to cut his salary in half.

And last week they declined to offer slugger Adam Dunn arbitration. Fearful he might accept, thus throwing their payroll out of whack, they assured themselves no draft-pick compensation should he sign elsewhere.
Against that backdrop, the Diamondbacks head for the winter meetings this week in Las Vegas, and they still might be the favorites in the National League West in 2009.

At the Bellagio, they will continue to scour for bargains in free agency and talk trade.

They are looking for a second baseman, a left-handed reliever and pitching depth.

They could trade catcher Miguel Montero. First baseman Chad Tracy and outfielder Eric Byrnes could be bargaining chips, too, although their health, contracts and recent performance could be obstacles.

[paulb]

After meeting face-to-face with Yankees GM Brian Cashman for the third consecutive day, lefty CC Sabathia will accept New York's seven-year offer.


SUCK IT, FUCKERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Hopeless Semantic]

SUCK IT, FUCKERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

As if he'll be the savior for the Yankees...

[humanoid]

As if he'll be the savior for the Yankees...

no, definitely not the savior but I like the pickup...not sure about outbidding ourselves in the process, some questionable logic in that, but they needed someone to lead the rotation and they found the guy

now they just need to teach him a little about conditioning

I'm not a fan of ridiculous gloating, it just makes you look foolish when things don't work out exactly like you're hoping

[bakersfield]

Sounds like they are going to sign AJ Burnett too.

[paulb]

well....if they can have as their starting rotation in 09, Sabathia, Wang, AJ Burnett, Pettite, Joba Chamberlain....we should be set.....hopefully no injuries, and CC performs like when he was a Brewer.

[Hopeless Semantic]

no, definitely not the savior but I like the pickup...not sure about outbidding ourselves in the process, some questionable logic in that, but they needed someone to lead the rotation and they found the guy

now they just need to teach him a little about conditioning

I'm not a fan of ridiculous gloating, it just makes you look foolish when things don't work out exactly like you're hoping

Indeed. There is a 3 year window in which the Yanks have to win or, as I'm probably certain, C.C. will more than likely bolt for the Bay Area. Also, if he stays, eventually he'll have to deal with his weight or he could be akin to another former Indian who didn't, Bartolo Colon.

[humanoid]

well....if they can have as their starting rotation in 09, Sabathia, Wang, AJ Burnett, Pettite, Joba Chamberlain....we should be set.....hopefully no injuries, and CC performs like when he was a Brewer.

well, almost every team has injuries to their rotation at some point...and you are absolutely guaranteed at least one injury with AJ Burnett in your rotation(except mysteriously in his contract years)

CC will be solid for them, but to expect him to perform like he did when he was a Brewer is a little too wishful thinking...he will be much more in line with his AL averages, the AL East is packed with offense

If him and Wang can pitch 200-220 innings each that would be great, because Joba is still on an innings limit, and is a little injury prone himself...Petitte isn't even on the team yet, so we can't count on him for anything...and Burnett is a tweaked elbow away from being a much, much more expensive Carl Pavano

Phil Hughes just pitched great in the Arizona Fall League, and he's only 22...I still think he is going to be very good soon

[paulb]

holy shit....how about Yankees getting Mark Texiera for 8yrs worth 180million, with a full no trade claus... insane!!!! I never saw that one coming...

What will Manny do now?

[C DUB YA]

As usual, The Yankees are killing baseball. But, it makes it even better when they fail.

Seriously, The Yankees have 4 out of the top 5 payroll players in the enitre league, and 6 out of the top ten.

[humanoid]

I understand why people are upset and can see the need for some sort of maximum AND minimum salaries, but I disagree that they're killing baseball. MLB has set overall attendance records a few consecutive years now, and in recent seasons, we have several different smaller to mid market teams enjoy success while the Yankees have "failed". People like to complain and say it's not fair, but then enjoy gloating when the Yankees don't win and say things like "money doesn't buy championships". Well, that's true, it doesn't, but you can't have it both ways. Either they're the big bully and it's really not fair, or they're fools who spend all their money trying to buy their way back into contention when it really doesn't work anyways.

[paulb]

Humanoid...how did u like Metallica?

[ThomThom]

Baseball needs a salary cap, this is just getting fucking ridiculous. The Yankees have guaranteed almost half a billion dollars this off season alone. That's a bit much don't you think?

In the words of T.O. "That's unfair man, that's really unfair."

[paulb]

If the Yankees lose again this year, will you still say there needs to be a salary cap? Seriously, with all these off season pickups....Yankees better win the world series...

[scoop49er]

i gotta get in on this thread since im a diehard giants fan and coach 11u travel ball and i fucking love baseball!!

my giants once again got no one major in the winter meetings. however our pitching staff is looking good.. i can live with linsecum-cain-zito as a 1-2-3 and hopefully the new kids, now that they have a year of experience can step up and we can have a good season.. we expected to lose 100, we went 72-90 and i had fun watching them play so hopefully we can get to .500 this year..

[BoardsofCoachella]

Randy Johnson signed with the Giants.

[Geno_g]

SF has the Big Unit, lets see some offense to back that D...

[boarderwoozel3]

Bleh.

[Geno_g]

Yeah it's a waste of 8 or was it 9 million we could have used for a couple people...

[boarderwoozel3]

The more I think about it the more I don't mind this move. It's a low risk (one year) and gives us the flexibility to trade Sanchez for a corner infielder. Maybe I'm just trying to be optimistic but we certainly could have done worse. With the pitching staff shaping up the way it is and given the weakness of the NL West, we're really only a power hitting corner infielder and a decent second basemen away from a being a fringe contender. I'm really looking forward and hoping to see Sandoval, Lewis and Velez continue to improve this season.

[bakersfield]

I think the Unit still feels he has plenty to prove.
As long as he stays healthy, he can win 14-17 games.

But he loses many close games, due to the great deal of pressure
that he puts on his teammates. He is so intense...or grouchy (depending on your perspective). As you saw with the Dbacks last year, the youngsters press & make mistakes, as they try to play on egg-shells.

[humanoid]

So I think the MLB Network is one of the greatest creations ever...anyone been watching it?

I love turning it on and not having to wait through some other shitty sport that I care nothing about so i can get to the baseball news...fantastic

[TommyboyUNM]

I think my Cleveland Indians are ready to contend again in the AL Central. I like the addition of Kerry Wood as the closer. Anybody but Joe Borowski and a bunch of patchwork pitchers. The signing of Mark DeRosa from the Cubs is also pretty underrated I think. He's a quality 2nd baseman. I'm not expecting Cliff Lee to have the kind of year he just had, but I'm expecting an all-star type of season. And Fausto Carmona will be closer to his 2007 form.

[C DUB YA]

I understand why people are upset and can see the need for some sort of maximum AND minimum salaries, but I disagree that they're killing baseball. MLB has set overall attendance records a few consecutive years now, and in recent seasons, we have several different smaller to mid market teams enjoy success while the Yankees have "failed". People like to complain and say it's not fair, but then enjoy gloating when the Yankees don't win and say things like "money doesn't buy championships". Well, that's true, it doesn't, but you can't have it both ways. Either they're the big bully and it's really not fair, or they're fools who spend all their money trying to buy their way back into contention when it really doesn't work anyways.

You can have it both ways if you happen to hate the Yankees. It's both unfair the amount of cash they throw around, and it is indeed a wonderful thing to see them fail after spending said cash.

I guess I meant killing smaller market baseball. Which in the long run will kill baseball.

[C DUB YA]

I think my Cleveland Indians are ready to contend again in the AL Central. I like the addition of Kerry Wood as the closer. Anybody but Joe Borowski and a bunch of patchwork pitchers. The signing of Mark DeRosa from the Cubs is also pretty underrated I think. He's a quality 2nd baseman. I'm not expecting Cliff Lee to have the kind of year he just had, but I'm expecting an all-star type of season. And Fausto Carmona will be closer to his 2007 form.

The tribe got a steal with Wood and Derosa. Derosa is way under-rated. They are kinda Cubs East in 09

[C DUB YA]

So I think the MLB Network is one of the greatest creations ever...anyone been watching it?

I love turning it on and not having to wait through some other shitty sport that I care nothing about so i can get to the baseball news...fantastic

I'm liking it right down to the network logo.

[humanoid]

You can have it both ways if you happen to hate the Yankees. It's both unfair the amount of cash they throw around, and it is indeed a wonderful thing to see them fail after spending said cash.

I guess I meant killing smaller market baseball. Which in the long run will kill baseball.

I absolutely know what you're saying, and if I hadn't been a lifelong Yankee fan, I would probably enjoy hating them just as much as many do

my problem with the killing baseball argument is that the situation really isn't any different than it's always been. People have been complaining for 60 years that many small market teams were just farm systems for the Yankees and that would eventually kill baseball..... The Yankees, in many seasons throughout history have often had the largest payroll, the biggest stars, but this scenario has yet to kill baseball, in fact before the current recession, they had continually set attendance records in a few consecutive seasons

In the last 30 years MLB has had 20 different World Series Champions, the NFL has had 14 different Super Bowl Champs, The NHL has has 13 different Stanley Cup Champs and the NBA has had only 9 different Champions!!...The NBA has had a salary cap since the 1984-85 season

so as much as people like to say that all these other sports have more parity than MLB, in fact the exact opposite is true and as far as Championships go, MLB has the most parity

[humanoid]

I think my Cleveland Indians are ready to contend again in the AL Central. I like the addition of Kerry Wood as the closer. Anybody but Joe Borowski and a bunch of patchwork pitchers. The signing of Mark DeRosa from the Cubs is also pretty underrated I think. He's a quality 2nd baseman. I'm not expecting Cliff Lee to have the kind of year he just had, but I'm expecting an all-star type of season. And Fausto Carmona will be closer to his 2007 form.

I think the trade for DeRosa was huge for them and a disastrous decision for the Cubs...DeRosa is amazingly versatile and clutch and has always been appreciated by his teammates. I'm not sure exactly why the Cubs would move him in order to make room for Milton Bradley

Bradley is a very good player when he's not fighting fans, chasing down broadcasters during the game or injuring himself while arguing with umpires..

but ....8 trips to the disabled list since June of 2005 is a disaster waiting to happen at $10 mil a year....

[zenidogx]

27 people didn't vote for Rickey Henderson. wtf?

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/blog/big_league_stew/post/Old-man-admits-to-mistake-in-not-voting-for-fell?urn=mlb,133355

[humanoid]

27 people didn't vote for Rickey Henderson. wtf?

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/blog/big_league_stew/post/Old-man-admits-to-mistake-in-not-voting-for-fell?urn=mlb,133355

yeah it's weird, but personally I feel there is way too much bitching about Hall of Fame voting....listening to XM radio's baseball station, they cry about it so much, it makes me not want to listen


obviously Rickey is a Hall of Famer, but really what does it matter what percentage he was voted in by?

[fiyahhh!]

Has anyone seen the patch the Mets will be wearing this season? What a piece of shit.


http://mlb.imageg.net/graphics/product_images/pMLB2-5472404dt.jpg

At least the Yankees put some effort into theirs.

http://mlb.imageg.net/graphics/product_images/pMLB2-5472437dt.jpg

[paulb]

who doesnt love the Yankees..... why is it Mets inaugural season?

[fiyahhh!]

inaugural season at the new stadium.

[TommyboyUNM]

obviously Rickey is a Hall of Famer, but really what does it matter what percentage he was voted in by?


It's just interesting to know that there are writers who didn't vote Henderson into the hall. Makes me wonder what their reasons were. Anybody who ever saw Rickey play knows he's a Hall of Famer. Reminds me of when a Philadelphia writer by the name of Bill Conlin said he didn't vote Nolan Ryan into the Hall of Fame because if he had to have a pitcher start Game 7 of the World Series, Nolan Ryan wouldn't be his first choice. So by that logic, Conlin only believes that 9 players and 1 pitcher deserve to be in the Hall.

[fiyahhh!]

I'll never forget the time when Robin Ventura charged the mound and Nolan put him in a headlock and beat him like a little kid.

[paulb]

Mets are playing in a new stadium in 2009?

[fiyahhh!]

Ha ha -- Nolan just buttons his shirt afterwards like it was no big deal...

Ua0PfrWx0LI&feature=related

[fiyahhh!]

Mets are playing in a new stadium in 2009?

Yep, goodbye Shea, hello Citi Field. Shit, both NY teams will have new stadiums this year.

[zenidogx]

i understand not voting for Nolan Ryan. he was a 500ish pitcher. but Rickey was pretty much flawless.

[humanoid]

It's just interesting to know that there are writers who didn't vote Henderson into the hall. Makes me wonder what their reasons were. Anybody who ever saw Rickey play knows he's a Hall of Famer. Reminds me of when a Philadelphia writer by the name of Bill Conlin said he didn't vote Nolan Ryan into the Hall of Fame because if he had to have a pitcher start Game 7 of the World Series, Nolan Ryan wouldn't be his first choice. So by that logic, Conlin only believes that 9 players and 1 pitcher deserve to be in the Hall.

I agree that it's strange that someone could not see Rickey Henderson as an obvious Hall of Famer. I also think something needs to be altered in the way that they induct guys, some writers do use the privilege to push their own twisted agendas and also to get themselves a little publicity. I would just rather celebrate the guys going into the hall of fame, rather than quibble about what percentages of the votes guys got, because to me it detracts from the amazing occasion that it is.

I do know what you mean though

[humanoid]

Has anyone seen the patch the Mets will be wearing this season? What a piece of shit.


http://mlb.imageg.net/graphics/product_images/pMLB2-5472404dt.jpg

At least the Yankees put some effort into theirs.

http://mlb.imageg.net/graphics/product_images/pMLB2-5472437dt.jpg

they're seriously going to put that ugly thing on their jerseys? how unfortunate

[vinylmartyr]

Babe Ruth was not a unanimous selection to the baseball Hall of Fame.

[TommyboyUNM]

I agree that it's strange that someone could not see Rickey Henderson as an obvious Hall of Famer. I also think something needs to be altered in the way that they induct guys, some writers do use the privilege to push their own twisted agendas and also to get themselves a little publicity. I would just rather celebrate the guys going into the hall of fame, rather than quibble about what percentages of the votes guys got, because to me it detracts from the amazing occasion that it is.

I do know what you mean though


Yeah totally and I hate to take away from the great career Rickey Henderson had. I guess 95% of the vote basically says that he is an obvious Hall of Famer.

Sometimes I don't know the criteria in sports. It baffles me that neither Derrick Thomas nor Cris Carter was elected into the Pro Football Hall of Fame. Thomas was THE dominant pass-rushing linebacker for a decade and Cris Carter is 2nd to Jerry Rice in many recieving categories.

[TommyboyUNM]

Babe Ruth was not a unanimous selection to the baseball Hall of Fame.


This speaks volumes and shows that there have always been pompous, self-righteous baseball writers.

[humanoid]

This speaks volumes and shows that there have always been pompous, self-righteous baseball writers.

isn't it true that no one has ever been unanimous? That's pretty silly, if Babe Ruth, Ted Williams, Ty Cobb, Mickey Mantle, Joe DiMaggio, etc aren't unanimous, I'm not sure what exactly that says about the voting process

I think Tom Seaver holds the highest percentage with something like 98.8%

[TommyboyUNM]

isn't it true that no one has ever been unanimous? That's pretty silly, if Babe Ruth, Ted Williams, Ty Cobb, Mickey Mantle, Joe DiMaggio, etc aren't unanimous, I'm not sure what exactly that says about the voting process

I think Tom Seaver holds the highest percentage with something like 98.8%


Without knowing much about Tom Seaver off the field, I would guess that he was nice to the media and smiled during every interview.

Babe Ruth was a drunk, same with Mickey Mantle. Ty Cobb was a racist. So what? This isn't the Good People Hall of Fame. Just like I think O.J. Simpson has every right to have his name in the Bills Ring of Honor.

I was watching ESPN this morning and one of the Stewart brothers from 1st and 10 said he was told by a voter that the person didn't vote for Rickey Henderson because he saw Rickey dog it on ocassion. Wow, the stats sure say he dogged it.

If you polled 100 men and asked them who they'd rather fuck, Rosie O'Donnell or Angelina Jolie, that vote wouldn't be unanimous either. There are always morons who want to be different when faced with the obvious choice.

[humanoid]

yeah, personality and off field antics shouldn't play a part in hall of fame voting, but unfortunately since you have humans voting (no matter who they are) those factors will always play a part


PS....on a totally different note, the MLB Network is possibly the greatest thing ever created...if I lost every other channel in existence, and could only keep that one, I wouldn't be terribly upset

[humanoid]

also, I think it's strange when people hold it against Ty Cobb that he may have been a racist! He did live in a time when we had segregation in every aspect of life and blacks weren't allowed in MLB until 1947...

not excusing it, but I doubt he was unique in his views for that era

[TommyboyUNM]

also, I think it's strange when people hold it against Ty Cobb that he may have been a racist! He did live in a time when we had segregation in every aspect of life and blacks weren't allowed in MLB until 1947...

not excusing it, but I doubt he was unique in his views for that era


I agree with you. He wasn't unique in his views. He was just the best racist player in baseball, so he's the poster boy. Just like Barry Bonds is the poster boy for steroids. Sure, a lot of other players used. But Barry Bonds was better than everyone so he became the face of the scandal.

[DRcube]

Jeff kent Retires!!!!
http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20090121&content_id=3760328&vkey=hotstove2008&fext=.jsp

[humanoid]

I wonder if a bunch of these veteran players without jobs are going to retire or keep holding out for the same money they were making on their last contracts...

there are still a bunch of very good to useful veteran players who can't admit they're not worth as much $$ as they once were and so no one wants to sign them at inflated prices..

Giambi was smart, he took the offer he had and went back to Oakland...he now has a job and knows where he'll be come spring training time, and he's still making several million dollars

Vartitek may have screwed himself badly by not accepting arbitration from Boston, now he's gonna make several million less than he would have...guys like Abreu(who is highly underrated in my opinion) but worth nowhere near the $16 mil or so he made last year should be signed somewhere, but he's still holding out to be paid like he was in his prime, same with Garrett Anderson, Nomar is another one

[humanoid]

There have to be some fellow baseball fans out there who would like to talk about something other than crying like a spoiled baby over the lineup....right????


What's anyone think of Joe Torre's book? I wonder what the point really is other than making some $$....The guy has plenty of money though, so it seems ill advised to burn all his bridges and tarnish his reputation by selling a tell all, talking trash....it doesn't seem like Joe Torre, I'd like to hear his comments on it......what he said about A-rod though is probably all true...I'm sure he's been called A-Fraud by plenty of teammates

Manny still unsigned? Are the Dodgers still after him? I thought they would be on him immediately after they were able to get free of Andruw Jones....the Dodgers starting rotation is still a little thin

Andy Pettitte resigning with the Yankees?

The World Baseball Classic? I love the idea of it, I just don't necessarily like it right before the season, I totally understand the reluctance of teams and players, considering the lack of recovery time in case of an injury. I went to the USA v Japan & USA v Mexico games last time in 2006 and they were a lot of fun

Anyone watch Jeff Kent's retirement press conference?
I became a Jeff Kent fan that day...he always seemed like an asshole, but after seeing him speak, I came away with the conclusion that he absolutely loves baseball and just expects a lot of himself and his teammates and sometimes expressed it poorly....but he hates Barry Bonds and fought him in the dugout!!! Hall of Fame for that alone!!

[sydaud]

Pitchers and catchers report in what, 3 weeks? For me, always the first sign of spring.

[humanoid]

Pitchers and catchers report in what, 3 weeks? For me, always the first sign of spring.

It's just under 16 days now, they have a countdown on MLB.com!

It's one of my favorite days of the year, I can't wait...

[stuporfly]

I haven't read Torre's book, so I'm basing my opinion on hearsay and excerpts. And for all I know, the only scandalous bits that have leaked have been blown out of proportion by the media, and the book as a whole is less about being a whiny little bitch than it seems.

It's also important to note that I've been a fan of the Yankees since I was a little kid.

Torre's always had a reputation as this stoic old-school baseball guy. Dishing dirt to sell a book doesn't seem to fit that perception. That said, I've read and loved Jim Bouton's Ball Four, the standard bearer for books about what goes on inside the locker room. That book was marked by the author's sense of humor, a trait I don't believe I've ever seen in Torre.

Whether what Torre said about A-Rod and anything else is true is immaterial. I think the book - or the perception of the book - will damage the manager's reputation, both historically and in his current clubhouse. His players and coaches in Los Angeles might suddenly feel as though they've got to watch themselves around him for fear he might open up this way in the future.

More Yankee news? Sure!

I like re-signing Pettitte. He broke down through the stretch run, but it's not all his fault. He took on far greater responsibility with the injuries that plagued a far weaker rotation than the one they're going with this year. He's likely the 4th pitcher in the rotation behind Sabathia, Burnett and Wang, with Chamberlain best suited in the number 5 slot because he's still working his stamina up to the task of being a full time starter.

I agree with you on Kent. He's always struck me as being a narrow-minded hothead. But in reality, he was probably a guy whose drive and determination allowed him to play above his natural ability for a pretty solid career. I've no doubt he's run across pampered malingerers in the clubhouse in the past, which is probably where he ran into trouble.

Manny is an unbelievable talent, but he's such a legitimate asshole pampered malingerer that I'm happy to see he's being undervalued. He'll probably stick with the Dodgers, and Torre will write a book talking about what a douche he is in a few years.

[sydaud]

It's just under 16 days now, they have a countdown on MLB.com!

It's one of my favorite days of the year, I can't wait...

Absolutely. Hope springs eternal...

[humanoid]

/\ I've been a Yankee fan since I was 5, good to find another one around here...

I'm also reserving my opinion regarding Torre's book , because like you said, it is true, so far the only real exposure has been through the NY Post (i think???) . Paying attention the NY media like I do, it is very easy to assume that many of the issues raised may have been blown completely out of proportion.

Joe Torre didn't even really write the book, it was told anecdotally to Tom Verducci and written by him, so there is the chance of misinterpretation or misrepresentation...so I would like to hear Torre's thoughts on that. Also, as a lifelong Yankees fan, I will be reading it myself, i can't possibly resist.

It is true that this harms Torre's reputation with his current team. I can't see that his current squad would be comfortable knowing that their manager just released a tell all about the team that gave him his legendary status and hall of fame credentials. Baseball has always had the unwritten rule about keeping it in the clubhouse. I only played baseball through the junior college level, but it was still the same even there.

Ball Four is fantastic. My dad gave it to me when I was about 13, and I read it something like 3 times in a row at that time and have reread it a few times since. It is such a candid look at the world of baseball that we often don't get exposure to, especially now that players are so wary of the media.

The Pettitte signing is a good move, and the Yankees got to do it more on their terms for a much more reasonable amount. I love Andy, but we know at this point, he is not worth the $16 million he made last year. His fade down the stretch is of some concern, but I think some of it can be attributed to his lack of preparation early last season due to his legal issues and the Mitchell report drama. They needed someone solid to rely on for that 4 spot, someone they know can handle the NY pressure since they do have the 2 new additions that may need a slight adjustment period. Plus, Joba's not going to pitch more than 140-150 innings so he has to be in the #5 spot.

My main concern for the Yankees this is year is Jorge Posada's health. I know Jeter is the captain, but I've always viewed Jorge as the vocal leader of the team. Jeter leads by example, but I don't see him getting on someone if it needs to be done. Posada is much more of an aggressive personality and you need a little of that on a team. Missing him for a huge portion of last year was a serious loss for the Yankees and I think it showed in the way the season ended up. They just reported today that he should be ready by Opening Day

[stuporfly]

/\ I've been a Yankee fan since I was 5, good to find another one around here...

It's definitely good to find a fellow fan. We take (and have likely earned) a lot of abuse all over the place.


I'm also reserving my opinion regarding Torre's book , because like you said, it is true, so far the only real exposure has been through the NY Post (i think???) . Paying attention the NY media like I do, it is very easy to assume that many of the issues raised may have been blown completely out of proportion.

I think there's going to be a decent chunk of the book in Sports Illustrated this week or next.


Joe Torre didn't even really write the book, it was told anecdotally to Tom Verducci and written by him, so there is the chance of misinterpretation or misrepresentation...so I would like to hear Torre's thoughts on that. Also, as a lifelong Yankees fan, I will be reading it myself, i can't possibly resist.

Torre's got to stand by the book now. It's inconceivable that he wouldn't have a say over the final draft, even if much of it was crafted by Verducci. If he backpedals and blames it all on Verducci, he's a bigger phony than he claims A-Rod is.


It is true that this harms Torre's reputation with his current team. I can't see that his current squad would be comfortable knowing that their manager just released a tell all about the team that gave him his legendary status and hall of fame credentials. Baseball has always had the unwritten rule about keeping it in the clubhouse. I only played baseball through the junior college level, but it was still the same even there.

It's almost more damaging to have it come from a guy like him. Derek Jeter respected so much he called him Mr. Torre. When a player does it (whether they're Jim Bouton or Jose Canseco), they can be dismissed as just some jackass who didn't understand (or was too greedy to care) how the rules of secrecy applied. The manager is supposed to be above all that bullshit and bickering, unless they're a hothead like Ozzie Guillén. Guys are going to have a harder time trusting Torre as the 2009 season unfolds, even if all the scandal the book holds is what we've already heard.


Ball Four is fantastic. My dad gave it to me when I was about 13, and I read it something like 3 times in a row at that time and have reread it a few times since. It is such a candid look at the world of baseball that we often don't get exposure to, especially now that players are so wary of the media.

It really is a fantastic book. It must have hit like an atom bomb when it came out, for the reasons you indicated. I love that Bouton's since participated in old timer's celebrations with the Yankees. Apparently the years have softened some of the revelations in the book, most of which are pretty benign by today's standards.


The Pettitte signing is a good move, and the Yankees got to do it more on their terms for a much more reasonable amount. I love Andy, but we know at this point, he is not worth the $16 million he made last year. His fade down the stretch is of some concern, but I think some of it can be attributed to his lack of preparation early last season due to his legal issues and the Mitchell report drama. They needed someone solid to rely on for that 4 spot, someone they know can handle the NY pressure since they do have the 2 new additions that may need a slight adjustment period. Plus, Joba's not going to pitch more than 140-150 innings so he has to be in the #5 spot.

Every bit of this is true.


My main concern for the Yankees this is year is Jorge Posada's health. I know Jeter is the captain, but I've always viewed Jorge as the vocal leader of the team. Jeter leads by example, but I don't see him getting on someone if it needs to be done. Posada is much more of an aggressive personality and you need a little of that on a team. Missing him for a huge portion of last year was a serious loss for the Yankees and I think it showed in the way the season ended up. They just reported today that he should be ready by Opening Day

Yeah, Posada needs to come back strong. The good news is that the team has options now. Because they signed Pettitte, they can hang on to Nick Swisher and Xavier Nady (both of whom were rumored as trade bait), and can unload one of those guys for a solid catcher if need be.

[stuporfly]

New York Daily News (http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseball/2009/01/27/2009-01-27_the_best_of_the_rest_news_builds_our_fre.html)

http://assets.nydailynews.com/img/2009/01/28/alg_BestRest.jpg

The Best of the Rest: News builds our free agent All-Star team


With just 18 days left until pitchers and catchers report, a surprising number of players still don't know where they'll be going for spring training. It should be an interesting final few weeks of winter as teams try to address needs and find last-minute bargains.

In the meantime, who needs a team to sign with? Team Free Agent could field a pretty formidable 25-man roster. Maybe they could go up to Montreal and contend. That's more than can be said for the former Expos, as the Nationals - even in a winter with free agents starting to get antsy - have been completely unable to draw any talent to Washington.

Check out the roster for this new team - how do you think they'd fare?

Leading off is the second baseman, Orlando Hudson. The 31-year-old doesn't offer prototypical speed for the spot, but he has had on-base percentages the last three years of .354, .376 and .367. He's also a three-time Gold Glove winner and a great clubhouse presence. The Braves and Nationals have been mentioned as possibly having interest in Hudson, whose last two seasons in Arizona ended with hand injuries, but it doesn't seem like he's gotten any concrete offers from anyone. The Mets could certainly use him, but they'd have to unload Luis Castillo's contract, and good luck finding a taker.

Batting second is the shortstop, Orlando Cabrera. An overrated hitter but a slick fielder, the double-Orlando double-play combination would really help this team's pitchers with some solid up-the-middle defense. Cabrera hit .281 for the White Sox last year, with a .334 on-base percentage and eight homers - his fifth straight year in the 8-10 range. So you know what you're going to get. The A's are the most recent team to be reportedly interested in Cabrera, but he wouldn't make much sense for Oakland, which already has a comparable shortstop in Bobby Crosby. A return to Boston, where Cabrera was part of the 2004 championship team, would make sense, but doesn't appear anywhere near happening.

Up next is the right fielder, Bobby Abreu, whose big-money market really dried up when the Cubs signed Milton Bradley. Abreu has had six straight 100-RBI seasons, but can't find a team coming off a .296-20-100 line with the Yankees last year that included his usual high on-base percentage of .371. He'll be 35 in March, and may become a big bargain by the time his birthday rolls around. The Reds and Dodgers have been rumored to have at least mild interest in Abreu, while a jump across town to the Mets - pushing Ryan Church to left field - might make the most sense. But the Mets remain focused on the slow pitching market rather than the slow position-player market, so who knows?

The cleanup hitter is the best of the bunch, Manny Ramirez. You don't need the numbers at this point - all you need to know is that one of the three best hitters on the planet is still looking for work at the end of January. Staying with the Dodgers seems like it might be Ramirez's only option, with the Giants lurking. Even more so than Abreu, he's the kind of big bat the Mets need, but as the Daily News was all over last week, don't hold your breath on a homecoming. Same goes for the Yankees, though Scott Boras should try to get the Bombers involved before all is said and done.

Another left fielder would follow Ramirez, possibly making this an American League team with a DH, though you could also put Adam Dunn at first base. All Dunn has done is hit exactly 40 homers each of the last four seasons, and 46 the year before that. Yes, he strikes out a lot and is an adventure in the outfield to say the least, but he also walks a ton. And did you see the part about the 40 homers a year? The Nationals might be the most serious team in pursuit of the slugger.

The No. 6 hitter in this lineup is third baseman Joe Crede, who hasn't been able to stay healthy, battling back problems the last two years. Crede still managed to make the American League All-Star team last season, and finished with a .248 average, 17 homers and 55 RBI. How the back affects his swing is a concern, and Crede is the last true third baseman available on the market this winter. The Twins have been talked about a lot as a potential landing spot for Crede, but the artificial turf in Minnesota might make him a bad fit. The most sensible spot for him might be San Francisco, where the Giants have been said to have interest.

So far, we've gone switch-hitter, righty, lefty, righty, lefty, righty. Let's keep the progression going with another lefty, center fielder Ken Griffey Jr. The future Hall of Famer hit .249 with 18 homers for the Reds and White Sox last year, and at 39 is just about out of gas. But nobody would complain about having him as their team's fourth-best hitting outfielder behind Ramirez, Abreu and Dunn. Griffey did sign a three-year contract on Monday - to endorse a "frozen snack for healthy kids" called "Power Ice." His baseball market, however, appears frozen.

Batting eighth is another future Hall of Famer, Ivan Rodriguez. Hardly anyone seems interested in Pudge's services, which shouldn't come as a surprise after watching him play to a standstill with Jose Molina in the Bronx last summer. A return to the Marlins might be his best hope for substantial playing time, but it would seem that Rodriguez's days as an everyday catcher are over.

Rounding out the linuep if this is an American League team, or on the bench if it's an NL squad, is first baseman Kevin Millar. Mr. Cowboy Up hit 20 homers for the Orioles last year, but had an average of just .234. Still, he continued to be a disciplined hitter with a .323 on-base percentage and had his fifth straight season with fewer than 100 strikeouts. At 37, Millar is defnitely on the decline, but he'll definitely fit as a platoon guy somewhere.

For this team's reserves, the recognizable names just keep on coming - Andruw Jones as a defensive replacement who can spell Griffey against lefthanded pitching, Juan Uribe on the infield, Doug Mientkiewicz at first base and Paul Lo Duca as Rodriguez's backup. If you don't like Mientkiewicz on the contention that you've already got two first basemen in Dunn and Millar, then take Mark Grudzielanek for more middle infield depth or Jim Edmonds for the outfield. Sal Fasano also might be better able to handle backup duties than Lo Duca.

The ace of the pitching staff for Team Free Agent is Ben Sheets, who had his first 30-start season since 2004, going 13-9 with a 3.09 ERA for the Brewers, but still couldn't stay healthy at the end of the season. The good news is, Sheets doesn't have a lot of innings built up on his arm. The bad news is, that's because he's always on the disabled list. Very much worth the gamble though, and Sheets appears to have a good match with the Rangers - he's been linked to Texas for weeks - with the Mets and a return to the Brewers as other possibilities.

The No. 2 starter on this staff is Jon Garland, who counters Sheets by being as reliable for 32-plus starts a year as anyone in the majors - the 29-year-old righthander has made at least that many in each of the last seven seasons. Garland's problems are that he gives up too many home runs and doesn't strike out enough hitters. He was 14-8 with a 4.90 ERA for the Angels last year. The Dodgers and Diamondbacks have been among Garland's top suitors, and a move to the National League probably would serve him well.

The rotation's lefthander would be Oliver Perez, perfect as a No. 3 because he blends the performances of an ace with those of a No. 5 starter, sometimes in the same game. The Mets haven't given up on keeping him, but don't want to pay too much - they've seen Perez's ups and downs firsthand. Perez, who was 10-7 with a 4.22 ERA last year, would benefit from working with an intense pitching coach, especially considering his success with Rick Peterson. Having Perez in the right mental state is a huge key to having him be a successful pitcher.

Perez might be an ex-Met soon, Braden Looper already is. Looper, almost completely ignored all winter, went 12-14 for the Cardinals last year, but had a 4.16 ERA that was lower than the league average and continues to get better as a starter after spending his entire career in the bullpen before the last two years. Fatigue may have been an issue for Looper last year - he went 0-4 with a 5.15 ERA over his last six starts after posting a 12-10, 3.94 line up to that point. That last month probably cost him some free agent bucks.

A future Hall of Famer takes the No. 5 spot in this rotation, as Pedro Martinez remains on the market. Martinez might be good for only 25 starts, but he can still be dominant - more with guile than with stuff at this point in his career. Staying in Flushing is still a possibility, but Martinez might be the Mets' last resort. He's a better option than Randy Wolf, though.

For the bullpen, Team Free Agent uses a closer-by-committee system of Chad Cordero, Eric Gagne and Eddie Guardado, with Luis Ayala and David Weathers setting up and Joe Beimel or Will Ohman serving as the lefty specialist. Shawn Chacon would be the long man, and occasional spot starter.

This team does have some problems, especially with injury concerns in the starting rotation. There's not a lot of speed, either, and while the on-base percentages are mostly high, the batting averages lag a bit. But the lineup would have a ton of power, the rotation has five guys capable of dominating for stretches and the bullpen is deep. Fans of more than a few teams would gladly trade rosters with Team Free Agent. And this would be a very entertaining clubhouse, with tremendously entertaining characters in Hudson, Lo Duca, Martinez, Millar and Ramirez.

They won't all be teammates, of course, and Team Free Agent is just a dream, but time is running out, and with a full team of unsigned players, plus plenty more still available, the hot stove might stay ablaze even after pitchers and catchers report.

[nahuatldream]

Isn't hilarious that hardly anyone is aware, or cares, that the Mets are also going into a new stadium this year? How much of a red-headed little step-brother are they, to the Yankees!? Oh, and that inaugural patch, for the Mets? It's modeled after the citigroup logo, or something. Awesome. I love Dodger Stadium. I hope it never changes it's name. Hey!! The Dodgers Triple-A team is coming back to Albuquerque! I'm excited, I just moved here in 2007, and I missed everything that is Dodgers.

[humanoid]

it is amazing the amount of quality free agents still available at this point. Highly unusual, but I understand many teams' reluctance to spend big in such uncertain economic times.

Many of these guys, I can see why teams might balk at signing them. Dunn hits tons of bombs, but has never been a great run producer, lacks a clear cut position and will strike out 200 times a year.

Manny's issues are obvious, but he can hit like very few ever have. I would be much more inclined to sign him as a DH, but a team like LA or SF could sign him for LF and significantly improve there chances within their division.

I think Griffey is mostly done, what a shame that injuries hit him so hard, he was a joy to watch in his early career.

Same goes for Pedro, if you could get him on an incentive laden deal, he could still be valuable, but his health is a major issue and he could be finished at any time. I would only sign him in the NL, he could get shelled in the AL.

Ben Sheets is a potential ace who has amazing stuff, but same goes for his health. Unfortunately for him, if not for his extremely late injury last year, he would've gotten an $80-100 million deal. If you could get him for a decent price, I think he is absolutely worth taking a chance on.

I'm a little biased in my opinion on Abreu, but he is consistently undervalued as a player...only him, Arod and Pujols have 6 straight 100 rbi seasons, he always plays, gets on base, can steal around 20 bases regularly and goes about his job in a professional manner. He has declined in the outfield, but not to the point that he will kill your team...The Angels do fine with Vlad Guerrero in RF, and he moves like he's crippled. I think some team will get him for a steal.

Guys like Gagne and Loduca haven't been good at all since they stopped using steroids. I wouldn't touch either of them.

Same goes for Pudge, great talent, but I'm afraid he was an obvious steroid case also. He seems done, he looked terrible for the Yanks last year, after looking weak with Detroit earlier. It was strange that he hit like 8 HR's in spring training, then 7 all season. He could still be decent in a platoon situation, but not playing everyday. he can still throw, but not as well as he once did, and his reputation for calling games has never been stellar.

Jon Garland is an innings eater who could be a solid back of the rotation guy in the AL but more suited for NL duty I think . He finds ways to win games, but his ERA has never been low enough to be a top of the rotation guy.

Oliver Perez is one of those guys that keeps looking like he's going to break through, but then reverts to his old ways and confuses the hell out of you. He pitches great against the Yanks though ,I hope he goes somewhere that they don't see him often!

This is much more fun than most of the crap on this board right now...

[humanoid]

Isn't hilarious that hardly anyone is aware, or cares, that the Mets are also going into a new stadium this year? How much of a red-headed little step-brother are they, to the Yankees!? Oh, and that inaugural patch, for the Mets? It's modeled after the citigroup logo, or something. Awesome. I love Dodger Stadium. I hope it never changes it's name. Hey!! The Dodgers Triple-A team is coming back to Albuquerque! I'm excited, I just moved here in 2007, and I missed everything that is Dodgers.

The Mets need to find a way to finish out a season one of these years. They have a quality team, yet keep finding ways to blow it at the end, there fanbase is getting restless. Maybe the new stadium will bring provide them a spark and reason to get excited.

[sydaud]

Staying healthy, as always, is the key for any team, but as long as they stay healthy, I can't see the Mets catching the Phillies. They've built a damn good team over there in Philadelphia.

[faxman75]

I'm ready for baseball. The White Sox have moved their spring training from Tucson to Glendale so my ride to the park just got drastically reduced! I put up my World Champion Chicago White Sox flag on the wall this weekend and purchased a Jermaine Dye action figure for my desk at work.

Since I don't have tv really, I'll probably purchase the MLB.tv package this year.

[sydaud]

I love Ozzie Guillen, I HATE the White Sox. We (the Tigers) couldn't beat them, it seems, if we had ten guys on the field.

[humanoid]

Staying healthy, as always, is the key for any team, but as long as they stay healthy, I can't see the Mets catching the Phillies. They've built a damn good team over there in Philadelphia.

it's been close the last few years though, so a little luck either way could sway it...I agree though, Phillies are pretty strong, if Utley is out for a while though, that could hurt them...depends on if Rollins bounces back too

I don't see Lidge being perfect again though, and they lost Romero who was big for their bullpen for 50 games....Moyer may have a tough time duplicating last year's success...Hamels is a stud though

Their middle of their lineup is pretty LH heavy too, Howard, Utley, Ibanez...they won't have Burrell to break it up anymore

[faxman75]

I love Ozzie Guillen, I HATE the White Sox. We (the Tigers) couldn't beat them, it seems, if we had ten guys on the field.

Yes, which is exactly how WE like it. However after that dog fight in the central last year we fell fast as we were expected to.

[humanoid]

Yes, which is exactly how WE like it. However after that dog fight in the central last year we fell fast as we were expected to.

I'd expect the Tigers to play a little closer to their potential this year. Last season was a bizarre season for them, its amazing that they finished below KC with that roster they had...they need a huge rebound from Verlander and health from Zumaya and Rodney

[faxman75]

They won't finish below KC again. I'm confident KC will return to the cellar.

[humanoid]

They won't finish below KC again. I'm confident KC will return to the cellar.

I doubt Detroit will finish in the cellar again, but KC has also made some moves to strengthen their squad this offseason, with the continued development of guys like Gordon, Mike Aviles, Billy Butler,Teahan, Soria, Greinke, Hochavar and few other younger guys, plus the addition of Coco Crisp and Mike Jacobs (who hit 32 bonbs last year), I think they have a much better squad than most people might realize...

I feel they could surprise many teams this season

With Greinke they have a pretty legit #1, Soria is a top closer with a bright future, Butler and Gordon are young studs on the rise, Crisp can chase down anything in CF, Dejesus is all around pretty solid, and Guillen is a great run producer when healthy and not freaking out....should be much more interesting this season

[faxman75]

Yep, could very easily be another dogfight down to the wire in the central. I'm hoping Colon has a solid year and i'm glad we locked up Jenks for another season before spring training started. Lets not forget about the Twinkies.

[boarderwoozel3]

They won't finish below KC again. I'm confident KC will return to the cellar.

Coco Crisp will lead them to the top! ;) lulz

[humanoid]

Yep, could very easily be another dogfight down to the wire in the central. I'm hoping Colon has a solid year and i'm glad we locked up Jenks for another season before spring training started. Lets not forget about the Twinkies.

I forgot you guys picked up Colon, hard to know what to expect from him, but he's pretty solid if healthy. Could contribute when most people probably aren't expecting much from him.

Would never forget the Twins. They are consistently strong, despite a low payroll, a very well run organization. I think Ron Gardenhire is a great manager. They have a very strong core of players that will almost guarantee to be right in the thick of things.

[sydaud]

I'd expect the Tigers to play a little closer to their potential this year. Last season was a bizarre season for them, its amazing that they finished below KC with that roster they had...they need a huge rebound from Verlander and health from Zumaya and Rodney

My god...I have never seen a pitcher look more freightened in my life than Fernando Rodney. 97 mph fastball and a change-up out of this world and he is mortally afraid to use either one of them. Zumaya needs to stop horsing around and playing Guitar Hero. He's got the arm, he just cannot stay healthy.
Verlander---his problem: He throws too many pitches. Too many games last year with 100 pitches by the 5th inning. I really think that the Tigers are going to need a huge rebound year from Jeremy Bonderman to make any sort of noise in the Central.

[sydaud]

Damn it feels good to talk baseball.

[humanoid]

Damn it feels good to talk baseball.

it really does, doesn't it?

I came home sick today and I've been lying around watching this amazing documentary on the MLB Network about Babe Ruth and baseball in the 1910's and 20's. Some amazing footage that I've never seen before.


Fernando Rodney could be devastating, he has such great stuff, but hasn't found a way to trust his stuff...you're right, he looks frightened out there. Zumaya, once he came back was pretty strong, but then got shut down again in late August...supposedly he's been throwing already and it's been going well, hopefully, you guys will need him. Tigers signed Brandon Lyon too, I'm not sure about him though, he's one of those guys with good control that is a little too hittable..

Verlander, I wouldn't be that worried about, I still think he's going to be a stud. He is still only 25, turning 26 next month, and has only experienced success until last season. A little bump in the road, but I'd expect him to rebound. His command was off, but he was the victim of the one bad inning syndrome very often last year. He'd pitch great for 5 or so, but then give up 5 runs in one inning.

Bonderman should be healthy again, he had what? Blood clots in his arm or something as far as I remember. He has such great stuff too, but hasn't quite figured in out yet, but he too is only 26, so has time to figure it out, which I think he will. He has dominated the Yanks a couple times that I've watched.

[paulb]

Im glad Yankees picked up Andy Petitte for 1 more year, so our rotation is looking like, Sabathia, Burnett,Wang, Petitte, Joba....what a sick lineup, lets hope they stay healthy.

any Manny rumors?

[humanoid]

Im glad Yankees picked up Andy Petitte for 1 more year, so our rotation is looking like, Sabathia, Burnett,Wang, Petitte, Joba....what a sick lineup, lets hope they stay healthy.

any Manny rumors?

someone will get hurt, most obviously Burnett, he's not in a free agent year, so he's not motivated to stay healthy for a contract....which has been his clear track record over his career.....I really badly want to be wrong about this

Looking forward to Wang getting a chance to flourish in the #3 spot in the rotation. He is highly underrated, as people don't see him as classic #1 due to his low strikeout totals, but what truly matters in baseball is getting outs, not strikeouts. every one would tell you Josh Beckett is a #1 because he strikes more guys out, but his career ERA is 3.78 and Chien Ming Wang's is 3.79 (and Wang's is all in the AL East) ....looks to me like he is every bit as effective as Beckett has been....Beckett does have the impressive postseason career that Wang is lacking so far though

Good thing is I am still very confident Hughes will be very good, too much pressure on last year, the kid is only 22, and was a little rushed through the minors....they'll probably leave him to mature in AAA, be replacement starter in case of injury and primed for a run at a full time spot in 2010

Guy in the bullpen that I think will be huge, but has been overlooked too often is Brian Bruney...he was well on his way to a dominant season in the bullpen last season before he got injured, and everyone is thrilled about Joba, but really, Bruney had better #'s as a reliever than Joba did..Joba just struck out more guys, but Bruney had a lower ERA and batting average against...watch for Bruney this year

[humanoid]

any Manny rumors?


Manny is likely going to return to the Dodgers. He experienced unprecedented success there and immense popularity, he seemed happy and comfortable. They like to act cheap though, although they play in a huge market, and are often second to only the Yankees in attendance.

The only teams that can afford him are larger market teams, and most of them don't have a need for him. The Yankees don't have room for him, although nothing they do would totally surprise me. I like their team as it is currently constructed though, and his baggage wouldn't mesh well with Joe Girardi's style.
The Red Sox are out obviously, the Angels said they are out...the Mets could make a splash going into their new stadium, and to take back the NL East from PHIL, but there hasn't been much talk about them. The Phillies outfield is pretty set and with Howard asking for $18 mil in arbitration, they won't spend that type of money.
The Cubs seem more likely to keep trying to get Peavy than get Manny, plus they have a bunch of outfielders already and Soriano plays LF and they probably don't want to move him again.

The Giants seem like another contender that with the addition of a bat like Manny, would catapult right to the top of the NL West. With their great young pitching talent, complemented by Randy Johnson and possibly a return to near form by Barry Zito (He pitched very well late last season) The Giants will surprise many in the NL this year, possibly even contending. They added Edgar Renteria (a proven winner in the NL) and with the addition of someone like Manny would be strong in that division. I've read a few times though that he doesn't like the colder weather in SF . If they made a big offer though, it might be tough to ignore/

I still think LA though

[boarderwoozel3]

So I go to the SF Giants' espn.com page to see what we're up to and the big stories are:
-Turncoat Jeff Kent is retiring
-We may send a few players to the WBC (not exactly an accomplishment)
-Barry Bonds is still won't go away (I always loved his talent but goddamn man!)
&
-Barry Zito and Brian Wilson are doing long toss drills across a canyon in so-cal to train this offseason, Barry Zito has a six-pack abs now and those two idiots managed to lose six balls in one of those canyon throwing sessions.

.....Things are looking up.....

[paulb]

I wonder if Bonds will end up in Toronto... what have they done this offseason?