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codytwo
02-01-2007, 03:17 PM
I just watched this movie for the first time last night, and it was great. Now I'm looking forward to catching Happy Mondays, although I'm sure Shaun Ryder is just another fat, old former(?) heroin addict by now. The era covered by the movie is the one part of recent musical history that I know almost nothing about. I had always read about Joy Division and New Order on this board and elsewhere, but never took the time to get into the music. Its cool, discovering bands that were around more than 20 years ago that still don't sound like too much other music. Also, its really interesting to see how the rave scene was basically birthed form the corpse of punk.

tessalasset
02-01-2007, 04:12 PM
yeah i enjoyed that movie way more than i thought i would.

chunk
02-01-2007, 04:14 PM
why isnt this in schoolios section?

amyzzz
02-01-2007, 04:16 PM
It's a music-related movie, thereby coachella related, whereas schoolio's thread is not really coachella related.

pewter14
02-01-2007, 04:29 PM
this movie was great ... kind of a cliff's notes to the 80s in Manchester.

schoolofruckus
02-01-2007, 04:34 PM
This is one of my favorite movies ever.

codytwo
02-01-2007, 04:47 PM
I find it very interesting that two genres which today most people see as almost polar opposites ("dance" and "punk") were once so intertwined as to be almsot indistinguishable.

pewter14
02-01-2007, 05:13 PM
I find it very interesting that two genres which today most people see as almost polar opposites ("dance" and "punk") were once so intertwined as to be almsot indistinguishable.

um, huh? this may take some 'splainin ...

Labels in general suck as it's open to so much interpretation, but today people see them as "polar opposites"?

I think you can find some acts out there today that some folks would specifically label as "dance punk", some within the lineup (take The Rapture for example, possibly !!! .. or past acts like The Faint or Radio 4)

again, open to interpretation

codytwo
02-01-2007, 05:51 PM
I was referring to the rave culture, the birth of which is depicted in this movie, vs the punk culture from which it emerged.

MsTekno
02-01-2007, 10:21 PM
This is one of my favorite movies ever.

I agree! I stumbled across it on TV one night and thought "why haven't I seen this before?!?" So many legendary bands, plus the birth of the rave scene and the legendary Hacienda. Not to mention the witty humor. A must see for any Manchester music fan or raver. (or movie fan for that matter)

bug on your lip
02-02-2007, 07:20 AM
its
MADCHESTER foos

bartelby
02-02-2007, 07:34 AM
hmmmm...me thinks I'll be out at the video store later today....

randy ricochet
02-02-2007, 09:30 AM
I was referring to the rave culture, the birth of which is depicted in this movie, vs the punk culture from which it emerged.

Rave culture didn't emerge from punk culture. The Hacienda club in the film (where I used to go when younger) was one of the original rave clubs in northern england which housed early Detroit house dj's, Italiano piano house and european techno to create the rave scene....So there!!!!!!
The sex pistols performed at the Hacienda which made them famous as did Madonna who was nothing in England before that performance. The Hacienda was part of the original warehouse scene of rave/drugs and Paaaaaaaaaaaaaartteeeeeeee people! So it was down to the venue not Punk.

smilingdownward
02-02-2007, 10:08 AM
speaking of 24 party ppl,
did anyone else see tony wilson when he introduced gang of four back in 05?
i didnt even know that was him till the week after. i guess thats another tie in for coachella and the movie.

codytwo
02-02-2007, 05:46 PM
Rave culture didn't emerge from punk culture. The Hacienda club in the film (where I used to go when younger) was one of the original rave clubs in northern england which housed early Detroit house dj's, Italiano piano house and european techno to create the rave scene....So there!!!!!!
The sex pistols performed at the Hacienda which made them famous as did Madonna who was nothing in England before that performance. The Hacienda was part of the original warehouse scene of rave/drugs and Paaaaaaaaaaaaaartteeeeeeee people! So it was down to the venue not Punk.

You are an idiot. The Sex Pistols were famous long before the Hacienda Club existed. In fact, the Hacienda Club opened in 1982, and The Pistols broke up in 1978. Factory Records owned and operated the Hacienda, and they were the quintessential post-punk label. Joy Division and New Order were both on it. The same people were behind both scenes in a large part. And I hate you.

smilingdownward
02-02-2007, 10:48 PM
You are an idiot. The Sex Pistols were famous long before the Hacienda Club existed. In fact, the Hacienda Club opened in 1982, and The Pistols broke up in 1978. Factory Records owned and operated the Hacienda, and they were the quintessential post-punk label. Joy Division and New Order were both on it. The same people were behind both scenes in a large part. And I hate you.

cody, your my hero

randy ricochet
02-04-2007, 05:29 AM
You are an idiot. The Sex Pistols were famous long before the Hacienda Club existed. In fact, the Hacienda Club opened in 1982, and The Pistols broke up in 1978. Factory Records owned and operated the Hacienda, and they were the quintessential post-punk label. Joy Division and New Order were both on it. The same people were behind both scenes in a large part. And I hate you.

Alright I made a mistake, He saw the Sex Pistols in Manchester then set up Factory records and the Hacienda. New order who were punk as Joy Division became the first major Electronica band which broughtabout the dance culture to the hacienda. ie. 'Blue Monday' influenced by Euro house/techno which i mentioned.....and I was there in the 90's you fucking tosser.
The rave scene had been going for a couple of years in illegal warehouse parties before it went to the Hacienda, hence it was about the venue not Punk.
wanker!

codytwo
02-04-2007, 01:27 PM
No, you didn't make a mistake. You're just fucking wrong.

hitthenorth
02-04-2007, 02:17 PM
Calm down for fucks sake. The Hacienda is just a load of poncey apartments now anyway.

SWEETSHIVERBURN
02-04-2007, 03:54 PM
Alright I made a mistake, He saw the Sex Pistols in Manchester then set up Factory records and the Hacienda. New order who were punk as Joy Division became the first major Electronica band which broughtabout the dance culture to the hacienda. ie. 'Blue Monday' influenced by Euro house/techno which i mentioned.....and I was there in the 90's you fucking tosser.
The rave scene had been going for a couple of years in illegal warehouse parties before it went to the Hacienda, hence it was about the venue not Punk.
wanker!



cum again about Jd was punk??? really?? Could have fooled every little goth girl and boy i know. Punk they were not. new wave electronic.. you could say.

Lord go back and look at your cliff notes on this subject. First major Electronic band was Krafetwerk ..not New Order..a band that emerged from the wreckage of JD. Raves( while they did emerge as what we know them as in the mid 80's, the original raves were just simple dance parties having taking the word rave from the carriban word.) hadnt been going on for years before Hacienda. Hacienda wasnt a rave venu. God lord... your english and i know more about this shit.


Blue Monday..came out in 1983.... when i was a young teen. whats your point.




besides the point.. 24HR party people is a decent little film. Reasearch the ENTIRE manchester scene... a lot of amazing bands came and still come from that area.

randy ricochet
02-05-2007, 02:15 AM
I will say this for the third time, I used to go to the Hacienda so I know more than u fuckin yanks!
New Order where the first band in Britain who brought Electronica / rock / post punk music together. I know about Kraftwerk but if you want to be clever, the first band to revolutionise electronic Synths was a band called 'Chicory Tip'...Wanker!
Joy Division where a Punk band, however there mainstream music later on did wave towards goth.
And like I said originally, rave emerged from a fusion of Detroit house, Italian Piano house and euro techno.( Detroit taking its influences form tribal / carribean music)
Raves had been going before the hacienda...In Blackburn North England as well as a select few other plavces in Britain. Do check your fucking info..!
And I know Hacienda wasn't a rave venue, It started as a live music venue...(Why don't you kids read before mouthing off....ie Madonna played there. And it developed that rave nights where held there with Graham Park, who was the original Hacienda DJ....like most rock clubs in the UK, they started holding rave / house nights..usually on a friday.....once again, I know cause I was there.......and yes it is a great film but is not totally true, you Americans will believe everything you hear!!
Tony Wilson is a cock by the way!!
Badda fuckin bing!

vinylmartyr
02-05-2007, 02:18 AM
BOOM GOES THE DYAMITE

randy ricochet
02-05-2007, 02:20 AM
And Blue Monday was the record released by New Order which revolutionised music in the 80's in Britain by incorporatind electronic/ euro influenced music...once again, read before you mouth off!!

vinylmartyr
02-05-2007, 02:25 AM
http://img121.exs.cx/img121/5995/sotdnobm6gm.jpg

Some of these are limited...
Ah! What was that?



- Blue Monday.
- That was an original pressing.



For fuck's sake.

randy ricochet
02-05-2007, 02:25 AM
besides the point.. 24HR party people is a decent little film. Reasearch the ENTIRE manchester scene... a lot of amazing bands came and still come from that area.[/QUOTE]

Really, I didn't realise that!!!!!..thanks for letting me know about my manor!

randy ricochet
02-05-2007, 02:27 AM
I have that 12"

vinylmartyr
02-05-2007, 02:27 AM
Don't we all.

randy ricochet
02-05-2007, 02:30 AM
smart arse!

vinylmartyr
02-05-2007, 02:33 AM
Sorry no smart arseness intended.

randy ricochet
02-05-2007, 02:34 AM
You a manc then?

vinylmartyr
02-05-2007, 02:41 AM
You a manc then?

I'm sorry I don't know what this means. If it means am I from Manchester no. I am American.

vinylmartyr
02-05-2007, 02:42 AM
That Blue Monday single was very popular in America also and can be found at many used record store as well as thrift stores. Also I sell records for a living.

randy ricochet
02-05-2007, 02:44 AM
Bloody hell, you're up late.....not got a job!!?
So have you actually read what i've been on about then....and apart from the Sex Pistols bit ( they actually played a t the Boardwalk which Tony Wilson actually owns) whats your view then....?

randy ricochet
02-05-2007, 02:45 AM
apologies, you your post hadn't come up then...yoe do work then!!!!

vinylmartyr
02-05-2007, 02:53 AM
I am completely uneducated about that scene. Whatever you say I will take as gospel. I seen the movie.

randy ricochet
02-05-2007, 03:00 AM
Ok so as an american...and a record seller, Are you gullible like a lot of Americans or do u watch the film and have your own opinions about it?....for example whenever us Brits watch an American action film, we know it is just another 'Lets make America look great and save the world ' type of film. It is the same with this. Tony Wilson wrote it as a biography but everyone actually hates him..including the Happy Mondays so it was very tongue in cheek...and not altogether true.
And you must know that Joy Division were Punk and developed to post punk. Their early tracks after they were called 'Warsaw' were proper punk songs.

vinylmartyr
02-05-2007, 03:06 AM
Not knowing the true story and not really researching about the scene (I assumed incorrectly) that it was close to the truth. I welcome the truth from someone who has lived it. Please educate me.

vinylmartyr
02-05-2007, 03:07 AM
P.S I was 6 in 1980.

randy ricochet
02-05-2007, 03:17 AM
ok!...sorry but I was just getting a little frustrated by all these young Americans who are very opinionated but don't actually read what has been said before replying.
If you actually watch the film...which u have, you will see the 'tongue in cheek' aspect with certain characters looking directly at the camera in a documentory type style and saying ' I don't remeber that happening'!
Most of the basic facts are represented, but the main point I was making is that The Hacienda was the mecca which brought music to the masses....it didn't actually start rave...the punk / rave argument is such that the venue and what happened there made people aware of new music and the party atmosphere was born in Manchester (largely helped by drugs....which is what eventually got the place shut down!)
I was actually there one night in 1990 when a rival gang of the doormen burst in and shut the place down!!

vinylmartyr
02-05-2007, 03:32 AM
Well Randy if your in the camp ground you can school all these poser know it alls about the Manchester scene. I would love to have a drink and hear some stories.

randy ricochet
02-05-2007, 03:41 AM
No worries. A couple of light beers it is!!!!!.....I have actually had a drink with Bez(from the Happy Mondays) as well and Mike Skinner from 'The Streets'..if you've heard of them?

mob roulette
02-05-2007, 07:57 AM
i thought it was quite sweet and respectful in its treatment of ian curtis actually.

C DUB YA
02-05-2007, 08:53 AM
I just watched this movie for the first time last night, and it was great. Now I'm looking forward to catching Happy Mondays, although I'm sure Shaun Ryder is just another fat, old former(?) heroin addict by now. The era covered by the movie is the one part of recent musical history that I know almost nothing about. I had always read about Joy Division and New Order on this board and elsewhere, but never took the time to get into the music. Its cool, discovering bands that were around more than 20 years ago that still don't sound like too much other music. Also, its really interesting to see how the rave scene was basically birthed form the corpse of punk.

He is kinda fat. He is very important to me and my musical tastes though

C DUB YA
02-05-2007, 08:55 AM
Ok so as an american...and a record seller, Are you gullible like a lot of Americans or do u watch the film and have your own opinions about it?....for example whenever us Brits watch an American action film, we know it is just another 'Lets make America look great and save the world ' type of film. It is the same with this. Tony Wilson wrote it as a biography but everyone actually hates him..including the Happy Mondays so it was very tongue in cheek...and not altogether true.
And you must know that Joy Division were Punk and developed to post punk. Their early tracks after they were called 'Warsaw' were proper punk songs.

One of their better tracks me thinks.

randy ricochet
02-05-2007, 09:39 AM
When called 'Warsaw' they released the Warsaw demos before renaming as Joy Division. These were very punk.

SWEETSHIVERBURN
02-05-2007, 02:59 PM
[QUOTE=randy ricochet;35538]When Warsaw...before that Stiff Kittens. That variation(S) was indeed punk. But you didnt say that..hence the confusion. My elder brother saw them as Warsaw at the Electric Circus with Buzzcocks...

And while chicory Tip has been around longer than Kraftwerk, .I wouldnt exactly call son of my father a great Synth hit. Kraftwerk were pioneers in electronic music.There is no denying that.


and love, i am english, i was also "there" in the scene and i am not some young american. But its still nice to get someones knickers in a twist:dumbo:winkiss
This is a healthy arguement...Shouldn't get all worked up about it. Meet me after the Mondays show and i'l buy you pint.:wink

and my remark about reading up on the history of Manchester music wasnt intended for just you.


on another note..since you are a manu person.. what do you think of the bio film that Anton Corbjin is filming based on Ian's Widows book?

C DUB YA
02-05-2007, 03:27 PM
I will say this for the third time, I used to go to the Hacienda so I know more than u fuckin yanks!
New Order where the first band in Britain who brought Electronica / rock / post punk music together. I know about Kraftwerk but if you want to be clever, the first band to revolutionise electronic Synths was a band called 'Chicory Tip'...Wanker!
Joy Division where a Punk band, however there mainstream music later on did wave towards goth.
And like I said originally, rave emerged from a fusion of Detroit house, Italian Piano house and euro techno.( Detroit taking its influences form tribal / carribean music)
Raves had been going before the hacienda...In Blackburn North England as well as a select few other plavces in Britain. Do check your fucking info..!
And I know Hacienda wasn't a rave venue, It started as a live music venue...(Why don't you kids read before mouthing off....ie Madonna played there. And it developed that rave nights where held there with Graham Park, who was the original Hacienda DJ....like most rock clubs in the UK, they started holding rave / house nights..usually on a friday.....once again, I know cause I was there.......and yes it is a great film but is not totally true, you Americans will believe everything you hear!!
Tony Wilson is a cock by the way!!
Badda fuckin bing!

I have been there as well, saw a nasty fight, members of New Fast Automatic Daffodils.

I'm also a yank.

randy ricochet
02-05-2007, 03:29 PM
My Apologies SWEETSHIVERBURN, I didn't actually look where you were from (ie not America) I was geting a bit defensive there...but I'm sure you appreciate that!!!...some of these American kids spend a lot of time reading and think they know it all.
I know Kraftwerk were the ultimate electro band, I was just trying to be smart....Its actually a good song (chicory)...aren't you clever knowing that one!!! (patronising as well as defensive!!!).....I'll get you a pint I reckon. Last time I saw mondays was at the Get Loaded in Clapham common...apart from Shaun being absolutely fucked they were great. was only 3 of original band and one of the other 2 was living with girl i was going out with.....and because of that i was in VIP tent with bez....who wasn't fucked out of his head at all!!!!!!
Oh and I'm actually from Preston.

Havn't read 'Touching From Distance' but I hear the film is supposed to be very good. When is it out?...can't be far off!!

randy ricochet
02-05-2007, 03:35 PM
I have been there as well, saw a nasty fight, members of New Fast Automatic Daffodils.

I'm also a yank.

Who were NewFads fighting with? Fights were usually pretty bad there cause of all the drug gangs from Moss Side. Some of the bouncers who worked with them let them into the club to sell, but they started taking the piss and letting guns/knives in and rival gangs used to come down and it got nasty!

TomAz
02-05-2007, 03:46 PM
oi. cor blimey i'm bleedin knackered.

randy ricochet
02-05-2007, 03:48 PM
Fur sure!