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chairmenmeow47
02-09-2007, 01:57 PM
Ha ha ha ha ha.....any of you who read Ain't It Cool News regularly may be familiar with Neill Cumpston, who writes some of the funniest reviews of action movies and comedies that are humanly possible.

His take on "300". (http://www.aintitcool.com/node/31520)

that was fucking hilarious!!!

lindseyb
02-09-2007, 02:08 PM
In slightly-less-fucked-up movie news - I finally saw "Blue Velvet" for the first time last night. I thought it was awesome. It was slightly more conventional than the two Lynch films ("Mulholland" and "Inland") that I've seen before it, but I can see what was so audacious about it. It was a great example of how Lynch's masterful visual and audio techniques can work wonders on a relatively-normal plot about a young boy investigating potential foul play in his small town. The acting was terrific as well.

Hopefully I'll make it to "Wild at Heart" tonight. Then I've got a lot more Lynch ahead of me ("Lost Highways", "Elephant Man", "Eraserhead", etc.).

blue velvet is great, isn't it? apparently laura dern and kyle mclachlan dated briefly after they filmed that movie. i saw inland empire last night...it was amazing. i can't wait to buy the dvd and watch it over and over again. did you know twin peaks season 2 is out on dvd in april?

you haven't seen eraserhead, yet? man, you're in for it. i like this the least of his films. not because its any less creative or brilliant, but because the gross-factor made it so hard for me to watch. it literally made me sick to my stomach.

bmack86
02-09-2007, 02:11 PM
Eraserhead is an intense viewing experience. Get the Lynch-approved copy of the film if you can; the transfer is pristine and really captures the disgusting glory of the film. As with most of his, it's definitely not conventional. It's also more twisted. I really liked it.

Mr.Nipples
02-09-2007, 02:11 PM
yeah i read that review earlier today and it was great. he doesnt disappoint. i honestly dont know what that faces of death film is about, all i know is that it caused hotshit because theyre people actually dying in the film. blue velvet man...what a fucked up film...

jeff: Heineken???
Frank Booth: Heineken!???...FUCK THAT SHIT! PABST BLUE RIBBON!!!

bmack86
02-09-2007, 02:14 PM
and, that review of 300 is top notch

Mr.Nipples
02-09-2007, 02:14 PM
Eraserhead is an intense viewing experience. Get the Lynch-approved copy of the film if you can; the transfer is pristine and really captures the disgusting glory of the film. As with most of his, it's definitely not conventional. It's also more twisted. I really liked it.

yeah get the lynch signature version...the way it should be viewed. i heard elephant man was coming to criterion, maybe theyll do the same for eraserhead.

bmack86
02-09-2007, 02:15 PM
I don't think he'd do a criterion for it, since he's already released a similarily priced definitive edition. The packaging on it is awesome as well; well worth the 30 some odd bucks.
I will buy Elephant Man criterion. I love the Criterion collection; so many awesome movies.

Mr.Nipples
02-09-2007, 02:28 PM
i didnt know what the criterion collection was until somebody left Brazil at my house, ever since then you could say ive been addicted. yeah youre right, a release on criterion would be pointless, they really couldnt do any better than the one thats already out.

schoolofruckus
02-10-2007, 02:42 AM
So, against all odds, I not only made it to the midnight (well, technically 1 am) screening "Wild at Heart" tonight, but I made it through the whole thing without dozing off. I got a little sleepy towards the middle, but I fought it off with the help of some Red Bulls (and a cappuccino....and a pack of Nitro2Go energy pills) and saw it through to the end.

Holy shit, it was awesome. I had no idea what I was in for. An indescribable and surprisingly sweet cocktail of lovers on the run, Elvis, and "The Wizard of Oz", this film has a diabolically funny surprise at every turn. As a big fan of "Natural Born Killers", this obvious predecessor to that film was a blast.

mountmccabe
02-10-2007, 09:47 AM
As a big fan of "Natural Born Killers", this obvious predecessor to that film was a blast.
That was one big reason I figured you'd love this one but I didn't wanna screw up your expectations.

Domino was rented by other people last night and I watched it. It moved enough and had enough going on to be passable but there was nothing special there, nothing new. Better than I expected, I guess.

schoolofruckus
02-10-2007, 10:54 AM
I liked "Domino" a lot. I know it was a mess in many ways, but I thought there was some strong satire in there. I took it as a parody of biographical movies that are "based on a true story" as well as "reality" TV shows; that might be reaching somewhat, but I found enough justification that the theory holds. And I've yet to see a movie with Mickey Rourke that isn't at least somewhat fun to watch.

mountmccabe
02-10-2007, 08:29 PM
It was def entertaining. As a satire... maybe but it's hard for me to feel that from Tony Scott and, well, I don't know - subjects that are that ridiculous in themselves are difficult to satirize. Ian and BAG were nice touches, though.

In my on-going adventures with Oliver Stone I watched Platoon again. My dad bought it and I had been wanting to re-watch anyway. I liked it a lot more than before (I hated, hated hated it last time) but I still didn't really like it. I have much more respect for it as the things I don't like aren't important things to Stone; he's doing other things, he's not trying to make the kind of movie I want it to be.

(Possible) SPOILERS for PLATOON (1986) follow....




...SPOILERS...

I see Stone's movies as full of sloppy plotting, hamfisted acting and overimportant overemphasized moments that are supposed to be powerful but strike me as ludicrous. Like the slow motion pauses on Barnes and Elias culminating in extreme closeups of the eyes of Barnes and then Elias... I mean, fucking hell. It just boggles my mind why he would want to beat us over the head like that.

Stone to me always fees rushed. I mean, yes, I love the pacing of 2001 but I also love the pacing of Baz Luhrmann's films. Stone is actually after the same sort of expressionism, a mystical, mythical evocation... but Luhrmann's subject matter is lighter so overblown sillyness is a good thing.

There was much that I liked about Platoon. The movie as a whole could be seen as an expressionistic encapsulation of the US's time in Vietnam... maybe. The fresh faces right off the plane walking right into dead bodies being loaded onto another aircraft. The initial feeling of not knowing what the hell was going on was appropriate. You never quite understand why they go one place or another... which is appropriate, I figure. But then again for me I tend to prefer contrast in such situations. There was some real tension in the early battle scenes - where the purpose was accurately expressing the battles compared to later on when the purpose shifted to the Barnes/Elias duality and such which disrupted the pacing thus killing the tension.

The story was stupid and simplistic and, as stated previously way overblown. The acting was uneven. There were so many characters and so little time to do anything with them but they were given moments when they were treated as the most important characters in the movie. Also Corey Glover from Living Colour was in the movie. Matt Dillon's brother was in it and he distracted me by looking familiar without actually being familiar. The voiceover pretty much sucked.

The Barber was good though it was used over and over and over.


OK, I'm not sure I got much across there. I feel as if I understand Stone better and respect him more but I still don't like him. So now it's not that I hate this movie it's just that I wish it was a lot different.

DeltaSigChi4
02-10-2007, 11:12 PM
I'm watching Taxi Driver right now.

E

SojuGorae
02-10-2007, 11:21 PM
I'm watching Taxi Driver right now.

E

Great fucking movie.

Harvey Keitel just destroys as a pimp.

DeltaSigChi4
02-10-2007, 11:31 PM
Word. I think Martin Scorsese tries too hard as the seriously deranged husband taxi passenger.

But it's still one of my personal favourites in the film.

E

schoolofruckus
02-11-2007, 12:01 AM
I'm halfway (i.e., still capable of driving, probably not capable of coherent conversation) drunk right now, so please forgive the following review.

Earlier this evening, I watched "Factory Girl", a portrait of one-time Warhol "It Girl" Edie Sedgwick. I thought it was a fantastic movie that slightly suffered from a lackluster ending.

Basically, Edie Sedgwick was a girl from a very rich, prominent American family who, in lieu of capitalizing on her own artistic talents, became the face of Andy Warhol's self-created empire of lost souls. And let me tell you, Sienna Miller - formerly best known as Jude Law's cheated-on ex-girlfriend - plays her swinging for the fences. She gets inside Edie and turns her sadness and emptiness into a Brando-(not to be confused with Brandon :)-esque performance. I'm not going to be able to do this justice right now, but she is flat-out fucking brilliant, taking Edie from her damaged, trust-fund beginnings at the Cambridge School of the Arts to her career pinnacle as the face of "The Factory" - a loft in which Warhol makes ordinary confused people into individual art projects - to a tragic end at the age of 28. Director George Hickenlooper - who made the fantastic Rodney Bingenheimer documentary "The Mayor of the Sunset Strip" - captures the hedonism and emptiness of Warhol World with poignancy and authenticity, and he's aided by a cadre of recognizable, skilled actors playing historical characters of various significance. After Sienna, the film belongs to Guy Pearce (whose Warhol is a model of self-deprecation-gone-wrong) and Hayden Christensen (who does the finest work of his career as a Bob Dylan stand-in who romances Edie until the point he realizes she will never break free of Warhol's grasp). The centerpiece of "Factory Girl" is a Pantheon-level scene in which Dylan is invited to The Factory to stand as the subject of a new Warhol film, and ends up exposing Warhol (to the audience, if nothing else) for the overrated parasite that he is. I'm a fan of Andy Warhol's work, to be sure, but I found this vampire portrayal of him to somehow make complete and perfect sense.

"Factory Girl" is eventually undone by a lazy ending that breaks some of my most hallowed rules for film denouement - namely, don't tell me the ending of a story via subtitles, and don't have interviews about your film's subject as the closing credits roll - but it's not offensive enough to spoil the film's significant accomplishments. It's still one of the best films of (technically) 2006, and one that anyone with a desire to feel the cruelty of fleeting fame should seek out immediately.

jackstraw94086
02-11-2007, 12:22 AM
so, jack's post (http://www.coachella.com/forum/showpost.php?p=41964&postcount=77) in the TV thread reminded me...

how come on the 300 trailer the guy says "tonight, we dine in hell!!!" shouldn't it be hades?!?! i see that trailer almost everytime i go to the movies and it makes me wonder.

Remember that old analogy section of the SAT's?

Hell is to English as:
A) Blue is to color.
B) Gluttony is to sin.
C) Hades is to Greek.
D) Bakersfield is to California.
E) Elmo is to Sesame Street

They're not speaking ancient Greek in "300". I know Hades and Hell aren't 100% equivalent concepts, but we all get the idea. Action movies are generally meant to appeal to the lowest common denominator. There are likely far bigger historical innacuracies in that movie than "hell".

EDIT: just saw John's post. What he said.

smokealotapotamus
02-11-2007, 12:23 AM
Children of Men was the best movie I'd seen in years. Cant wait for 300 on Imax

jackstraw94086
02-11-2007, 09:13 PM
I'm watching Idiocracy tonight. I don't have high hopes but who knows.

This movie was overall horrible, but I did manage a mild chuckle when President Dwayne Elizando Mountain Dew Herbert Camacho addressed the U.S House of Representin' after a WWE-style entrance, then led the parade down Pennsylvania Ave on his massive trike.

I can't believe real money was laid out to produce that movie.

Tylerdurden31
02-11-2007, 09:14 PM
Children of Men...good, though I feel like there could've been a little more to it.

jerpar24
02-11-2007, 10:56 PM
Anyone Seen Hannabal Rising yet I watched it tonight. I would say its the 2nd best of all the Hannabal movies.

schoolofruckus
02-12-2007, 08:41 AM
Yeah, I hated "Idiocracy". It looked more than a little suffocated - as if the studio had pretty much not shown it any support beyond the initial green light - but even what was there was just an awful execution of an idea that could have been great.

Last night, I watched "The Death of Mr. Lazarescu", one of the film elite's favorite films from last year. It's a black comedy (one that makes "Very Bad Things" look like "Dumb & Dumber") from Romania about an alcoholic, retired engineer named Lazarescu, who after a day of vomiting blood and feeling nauseous, finally calls an ambulance. The perimedic can immediately see that there are a list of things wrong with him, and takes him to one hospital after another as each successive doctor chastises him for drinking too much and sends him away.

This film is a stark, almost Dogme-level trip through the cynical side of the Romanian health care system, and it raises a number of pointed questions. Namely - does a man who willfully sabotages himself (as the ulcer-having Lazarescu does in drinking to excess) deserve a doctor's full attention and care? It's a question that hit me pretty hard, as someone with seasonal respiratory problems who was until recently a smoker. I know I've gone to the doctor's office before when I needed an inhaler refill, and once I was hospitalized when I started having a full blown asthma attack; each and every time I had to answer "yes, I'm a smoker" to incredulous nurses and doctors. Having gotten a case of bronchitis every winter since I was 7, I rationalized the smoking as being a contributor to the problem, but not the cause of it, and thus, wasn't something I needed to jetison immediately.

Of course it was stupid, and thank Christ the doctors I dealt with were much more humane than the ones in this movie, because it did a BRILLIANT job of showing the cynicism and the workmanlike detachment of people in the medical profession. I don't know if it's just that way in Romania (the only Romanian person I've known was a former roommate, and she was definitely a fucking bitch and a half), but this film's portrayal of the morale in hospitals is beyond bleak. The specialists in this movie are tired, frustrated, and jaded beyond belief, and they have no time for anything but chastisement for this man who has the nerve to drink himself to death and expect their help - in the wake of a major traffic accident, no less. The nurse feels genuine empathy for him, and tries to reason with the doctors, but she succeeds only in making them feel undermined and insulted.

This film is maybe a little longer than it should have been (I don't think it needed a "Boogie Nights" running time), and it's certainly not any fun whatsoever to watch. But it's an excellent, challenging low-budget piece that any adventurous cineaste who's in the mood for something unique and biting would do well to seek out. Although that may be difficult, as it's not at Blockbuster or even some independent video stores around LA. I pretty much had to buy it before I saw it.

TomAz
02-12-2007, 08:51 AM
the only Romanian person I've known was a former roommate, and she was definitely a fucking bitch and a half

My college roommate and one of my best friends did his doctorate on Romanian history. He spent a couple years over there and met a Romanian girl and they got married. Then they moved back to the states. Then she divorced him.

bmack86
02-12-2007, 09:00 AM
gabe doesn't care about romanian people

I heard that was a really good movie. I'll have to check it out.

schoolofruckus
02-12-2007, 09:26 AM
I think you would really like it, Bryan. I'm sure that a place like Vidiots has it. Maybe Netflix....I cancelled my subscription, so I don't know.

chairmenmeow47
02-12-2007, 10:44 AM
one of my co-worker's is romanian. he and his friends got into an altercation with gypsies back in romania, lol. i love when he tells that story!! i got to hear him talk romanian for the first time today too.

and i liked platoon, yeah, it's cheesy, but i tried to keep in mind it was cheesy for the time.

i watched taxi driver for the first time in YEARS yesterday. it's been on my dvr for awhile now. i forgot how good deniro was in that movie, i miss that deniro, what happened to him?!

also watched "a bill of divorcement". it was hepburn's first movie. she was good, but man, she just annoys me for some reason. i liked the movie though, i'd probably see the play if i ever got the chance.

good german tomorrow, WOO-HOO!

TomAz
02-12-2007, 11:11 AM
GRAMMAR POLICE GRAMMAR POLICE

PUT YOUR HANDS ABOVE YOUR HEAD AND STEP AWAY FROM THE KEYBOARD

mob roulette
02-13-2007, 02:11 PM
"the fabulous baker boys" is on cable right now. i am happy.

chairmenmeow47
02-13-2007, 02:15 PM
the good german, tonight!!! finally :)

downingthief
02-13-2007, 02:20 PM
"the fabulous baker boys" is on cable right now. i am happy.

I fell in love with Michelle Phieffer in that movie. Simply amazing...

thinnerair
02-13-2007, 02:28 PM
Anyone Seen Hannabal Rising yet I watched it tonight. I would say its the 2nd best of all the Hannabal movies.

I caught it this weekend.
It was an interesting flick and I think if it hadn't been a "hannibal" movie, it could have been a really good World War II flick.
It really dragged a bit and tended to get a bit boring after about the halfway point. The cinematography was excellent and the score was great. Gaspard Ulliel as a young Hannibal worked quite well as he did show some of the charm of the older Hannibal Lecther.

Overall, it was a decent movie, and while it was WAY better than Red Dragon, it wasn't as good as Hannibal.

CiderMouseRules
02-13-2007, 02:29 PM
Idiocracy was choice. Ya'lls is cray-zee.

mob roulette
02-13-2007, 02:34 PM
I fell in love with Michelle Phieffer in that movie. Simply amazing...

agreed. super hot here. also jeff bridges remains criminally underrated in my book as an actor. i mean people show him love and all, but i can't think of too many BAD jeff bridges movies. "starman" i guess would be one.

i'm probably going to get flamed now. imdb start your engines.

jackstraw94086
02-13-2007, 02:40 PM
Gabe,
I saw science of sleep last night and I have to say I'm starting to seriously question your tastes. I'm fairly certain at this point that you are a machine. The film was acted well, especially by Bernal. It told a very coherent and compelling story amidst the crazy dream imagery.

Do you simply not like gondry flicks?

full on idle
02-13-2007, 02:42 PM
Dave Chappelle>going to the movies.

Yablonowitz
02-13-2007, 02:45 PM
What makes you think Jacktimstraw "went" to the movies instead of have the movies come to him?

thinnerair
02-13-2007, 02:50 PM
are you saying that its better to be Dave Chappelle than go to the movies?
Or that Dave Chappelle HIMSELF is better than the act of going to the movies?

full on idle
02-13-2007, 02:54 PM
I'm saying that going to see Dave Chappelle live at the Punchline is greater than watching a movie.

jackstraw94086
02-13-2007, 02:57 PM
I was originally planning to work on music and got engrossed in the movie while cooking and eating dinner...... at the theater.

thinnerair
02-13-2007, 02:58 PM
I'm saying that going to see Dave Chappelle live at the Punchline is greater than watching a movie.

thats true. he is one entertaining negro. thats for damn sure.

KungFuJoe
02-13-2007, 06:56 PM
Gabe,
I saw science of sleep last night and I have to say I'm starting to seriously question your tastes. I'm fairly certain at this point that you are a machine. The film was acted well, especially by Bernal. It told a very coherent and compelling story amidst the crazy dream imagery.

Do you simply not like gondry flicks?

Wait ... Gabe, you didn't like "The Science of Sleep"?? I must've missed this review. I thought this a wonderfull and very touching film, although it kind of annoyed me at the end.

Bernal was fantastic though. Very funny, imo, and extremely creative. Overall, I prefer "Eternal Sunshine", but this was a sweet film. Perfect for those Valentine's Day suckers out there.

I really love the way Gondry uses his camera. He is easily one of my favorite film makers. This makes me question what your thoughts are on films by Guy Madden and Olivier Assayas? Two of my other favorite film makers working today.

I haven't watched to much recently, but finely got around to peeping "Grizzly Man" last night. I'm glad I waited because I lost any expectations I might've had for the film and was pleasently suprised. I really felt for the man and thought he captured some brilliant footage. Werner Herzog pieced it together beautifully too. I loved it.

Glad to hear you enjoyed "Wild at Heart". I wouldn't have expected anything less.

For those of you in the Valentine's day spirit looking to rent some good films with love stories, I suggest Jean Renoir's classic "Rules of the Game" and Luc Besson's "The Big Blue".

schoolofruckus
02-13-2007, 08:09 PM
Jack,

On the contrary, I love Michel Gondry movies. Not just "Eternal Sunshine", but also "Human Nature" (a severely underrated movie). The problem I had with "The Science of Sleep" was that I didn't buy any of the relationships in the movie, especially the love story. I felt like there was absolutely no reason why Charlotte Gainsbourg would have thought Bernal's character was anything but a kroq ken type. I admit that the film gave a good insight into the potential, hidden good nature that can come with an awkward guy who comes off as a deranged stalker; I just didn't see how she would have thought of him otherwise. I also felt like his co-workers were portrayed too over-the-top when they should have been more grounded in reality.

I felt like it was both too similar to Gondry's earlier shit (in the fact that it was about the inner workings of the human brain and the effect on romantic pursuits) and not similar enough (the character work being severely undercooked). I loved the look of the film (a lower-budget, but more inventive dreamscape than Gondry's other films have attempted), and I liked Charlotte's performance individually; but overall, the film's failure (in my mind) to present a strong contrast to his dreamy escapades left me feeling like it was a missed opportunity.

Joe, I've never seen any of Maddin's or Assayas's stuff. Suggestions on where to start?

I was going to watch Cassavetes' first film "Shadows" last night, but I've been so engrossed in "Rebels on the Backlot" that I felt like just reading about movies instead of watching them. I'm going to have a whole lot to write about this book when I finish with it.

jackstraw94086
02-13-2007, 09:48 PM
I have some exact opposite opinions on this movie and I think they are based on a very different interpretation of it.

Jack,

On the contrary, I love Michel Gondry movies. Not just "Eternal Sunshine", but also "Human Nature" (a severely underrated movie). The problem I had with "The Science of Sleep" was that I didn't buy any of the relationships in the movie, especially the love story. I felt like there was absolutely no reason why Charlotte Gainsbourg would have thought Bernal's character was anything but a kroq ken type. I admit that the film gave a good insight into the potential, hidden good nature that can come with an awkward guy who comes off as a deranged stalker; I just didn't see how she would have thought of him otherwise. I also felt like his co-workers were portrayed too over-the-top when they should have been more grounded in reality.

I felt like it was both too similar to Gondry's earlier shit (in the fact that it was about the inner workings of the human brain and the effect on romantic pursuits) and not similar enough (the character work being severely undercooked). I loved the look of the film (a lower-budget, but more inventive dreamscape than Gondry's other films have attempted), and I liked Charlotte's performance individually; but overall, the film's failure (in my mind) to present a strong contrast to his dreamy escapades left me feeling like it was a missed opportunity.

should have been more grounded in reality? My dear schoolio, they were intensely grounded in reality and the lack of contrast was intentional. I'll explain later. Gondry initially paints Stephane as his usual painfully shy protagonist, but there is something very different about him. The boy isn't just sensitive, as the movie progresses we come to learn he's truly not well in the head. This is what makes it a different Gondry film. The lack of contrast between dream and reality was the point. His latent schizophrenia becomes more expressed as he falls deeper into unrequited love. This is why the lines between crazy dream shit and reality become blurred as the film progresses. The "reality" scenes start getting stranger and stranger (i.e. him and his coworker tossing the TV into the river) until he can't tell the difference anymore. She suspects he's not quite right in the head and eventually knows it. This creates massive conflict for her. She loves, pities, and fears him (as in her feelings for him) all at once, and he misinterprets it until the end. The part I can't decide is whether he knows it himself in the end. I like that open-endedness aspect. Part of me also thinks that at least sub-consciously knew it from the beginning, which is why he was sabotaging the relationship before it could develop(the note, lying about where he lived, staying at the bar with the random skank while she left, etc.), but he loses control. Eventually he's stuck in a waking dream. His delusions chase him away from her as she waits in the coffee shop. It's just as tragic for her as it is for him.

Calling him crazy isn't a cop out, I don't believe he's completely dysfunctional, and I don't believe all the artistic imagery was all just delusional. The fact that he can't cope with reality is just part of the plot. Gondry's art remains for its own sake, poetry open for interpretation, not just dismissed as halucination. Most of it is separate from his excentricities and eventual craziness.

Eternal Sunshine was far more whimsical, less grounded in reality. The movies were opposite concepts. Carey was a sane character in an insane situation. He was was always completely sane and rational, just sad. He just accepted the craziness of the world around him, believing it to be out of his control. Bernal was the source of the madness and whimsy and projected it on the rest of the world.

bmack86
02-13-2007, 09:53 PM
Gabe, you really need to watch Shadows. It's great. Whether or not it's improvised (the essays on it lead me to believe it wasn't truly an act of improvisation) it has a really exploratory and loose feel to it. The acting isn't always superb, but the characters do always feel real and emotionally grounded.

KungFuJoe
02-14-2007, 03:25 AM
Joe, I've never seen any of Maddin's or Assayas's stuff. Suggestions on where to start?


I've only seen 3 of Olivier Assayas' films. I highly reccomend "Irma Vep" as this is one of my all time fav's. I really like his style. His films have a very natural / documentary feel. He also usually implents a great soundtrack.

"Clean" is also worth a watch. Though I didn't love it, it's still an interesting pic.

As for Guy Maddin. I still need to catch up on a lot of his work myself. I enoyed "The Saddest Music in the World" and think that'd be a great place to start. "Twighlight of the Ice Nymphs", "Archangel" and "The Heart of the World" are also worth a peep.

schoolofruckus
02-14-2007, 06:32 AM
I have some exact opposite opinions on this movie and I think they are based on a very different interpretation of it.


should have been more grounded in reality? My dear schoolio, they were intensely grounded in reality and the lack of contrast was intentional. I'll explain later. Gondry initially paints Stephane as his usual painfully shy protagonist, but there is something very different about him. The boy isn't just sensitive, as the movie progresses we come to learn he's truly not well in the head. This is what makes it a different Gondry film. The lack of contrast between dream and reality was the point. His latent schizophrenia becomes more expressed as he falls deeper into unrequited love. This is why the lines between crazy dream shit and reality become blurred as the film progresses. The "reality" scenes start getting stranger and stranger (i.e. him and his coworker tossing the TV into the river) until he can't tell the difference anymore. She suspects he's not quite right in the head and eventually knows it. This creates massive conflict for her. She loves, pities, and fears him (as in her feelings for him) all at once, and he misinterprets it until the end. The part I can't decide is whether he knows it himself in the end. I like that open-endedness aspect. Part of me also thinks that at least sub-consciously knew it from the beginning, which is why he was sabotaging the relationship before it could develop(the note, lying about where he lived, staying at the bar with the random skank while she left, etc.), but he loses control. Eventually he's stuck in a waking dream. His delusions chase him away from her as she waits in the coffee shop. It's just as tragic for her as it is for him.

Calling him crazy isn't a cop out, I don't believe he's completely dysfunctional, and I don't believe all the artistic imagery was all just delusional. The fact that he can't cope with reality is just part of the plot. Gondry's art remains for its own sake, poetry open for interpretation, not just dismissed as halucination. Most of it is separate from his excentricities and eventual craziness.

Eternal Sunshine was far more whimsical, less grounded in reality. The movies were opposite concepts. Carey was a sane character in an insane situation. He was was always completely sane and rational, just sad. He just accepted the craziness of the world around him, believing it to be out of his control. Bernal was the source of the madness and whimsy and projected it on the rest of the world.

Well, Jack, you clearly got way more out of it than I did. I only saw it a while ago, and I don't remember it as well, but I definitely had no comprehension of how she felt love for him. I thought he was far more deserved to be insulting potential conquests on "Blind Date" than to be receiving infinite chances to win over this girl's heart. You bring up an excellent point in the difference between "Eternal Sunshine" and "Science of Sleep", though.

But really, here were my biggest problems with "The Science of Sleep":

1. There were no White Stripes made out of legos.

2. "Eternal Sunshine" - Kirsten Dunst dancing around in her underwear; "Science of Sleep" - what's with everyone wearing sweaters?

3. A whole movie set in France without a single unprovoked armchair indictment of America is not a whole movie set in France, in my book.

4. Is it really too much to ask for Jim Carrey to talk out of his ass at least once?


Gabe, you really need to watch Shadows. It's great. Whether or not it's improvised (the essays on it lead me to believe it wasn't truly an act of improvisation) it has a really exploratory and loose feel to it. The acting isn't always superb, but the characters do always feel real and emotionally grounded.

Oh, I certainly will. I actually own it as part of that box set that I got for my birthday, so I can watch it whenever I feel like. I'm led to believe that John Cassavetes' films are always more scripted and orchestrated than they seem. "Shadows" apparently started off as an improvisational film, but when the end result didn't work, he went back and wrote it out (possibly with a hired gun screenwriter) and re-shot it. The original version of "Shadows" - which screened for some audience in 1957 - is the subject of a huge showdown between Gena Rowlands (his widow) and Ray Carney (the self-appointed expert on all things Cassavetes). I wish it were available for comparison.


I've only seen 3 of Olivier Assayas' films. I highly reccomend "Irma Vep" as this is one of my all time fav's. I really like his style. His films have a very natural / documentary feel. He also usually implents a great soundtrack.

"Clean" is also worth a watch. Though I didn't love it, it's still an interesting pic.

As for Guy Maddin. I still need to catch up on a lot of his work myself. I enoyed "The Saddest Music in the World" and think that'd be a great place to start. "Twighlight of the Ice Nymphs", "Archangel" and "The Heart of the World" are also worth a peep.

I have been told that "The Saddest Music in the World" is outstanding; I'll have to seek it out pretty soon. I thought "Clean" looked interesting, but I'm a little hesitant to jump into watching anything that has Nick Nolte in it because I can never understand what he's saying. I literally watched all of "Northfork" - which was a really good movie, by the way - with subtitles on because his speech is so garbled.

mountmccabe
02-14-2007, 07:49 AM
So Sean and Ivy and I saw The Good German last night. This is one of maybe 2 screens in AZ where it is showing and there wer maybe 12 people there.

I thought it was OK; it never really clicked with me, never got into much of a groove. Tobey MacGwire (sp) played so over the top (even taking into account the fact that he was playing in the movie) that I kinda hated him. Beau Bridges is a terrible actor. George Clooney did fine but he was never fully comfortable... which is odd for his characters. Cate Blanchett was OK, she had the most understated part, I think.

I was questioning the real footage of Germany circa August 1945 under the credits as I expected that that would just point out how fake/new everything else looked but then they ended up doing the whole film looking like that.

The story was very much an homage to Casablanca... at times I tried to figure out how much. I'm not sure but I don't think it goes as far as a full commentary or deconstruction. At times it was overblown and at times it stretched way too far in attempts to be deep and important... but neither of these are inconsistant with what Soderbergh was doing. I just didn't particularly like it.

Soderbergh is an odd one; I think he's really good at what he does. And he doesn't return to the same old tropes and archetypes and obsessions and styles. But I still haven't figured out why he chooses what he does and how i'm gonna react to his movies.

But yeah, it was good to meet Ivy and see Sean again. If shaking hands ina dark club counts as a previous time; after that I wouldn't even've been able to pick you out of a lineup. And, again, sorry I couldn't stick around. Next time, though.


EDIT: At some point I need to go back and see what if any previous comments on this movie there've been. And also learn grammar.

schoolofruckus
02-14-2007, 08:56 AM
One thing I really like about Soderbergh is that he tends to approach his career as if he's the most well-paid film school student in the world. He takes on films as projects, trying to take on a new idea with each successive film (well, except for Ocean's 12) so he can add new skills to his repertoire. It makes him wildly uneven, but I enjoy seeing what he does.

"Bubble", his ultra minimalist, low-budget entry from last January (the one that came out on DVD and in theaters on the same day), was terrific. You guys should check it out.

chairmenmeow47
02-14-2007, 08:59 AM
it was nice to meet you both! sorry i couldn't stick around either, hopefully my bathroom will be finished in a few days, woo-hoo!

the movie was "eh". i love cate blanchett, she was a great femme fatale. everyone else was "eh". i agree with john that clooney never seemed comfortable. he just doesn't have the bogart charm either. toby maguire was trying way too hard, i agree with that as well.

the casablanca comparisons were weird, but at least it was a little darker. i think this movie could have been much better if there had been stronger actors in the main roles.

very pretty though, i like the way it was filmed and the sets.

downingthief
02-14-2007, 09:17 AM
it was nice to meet you both! sorry i couldn't stick around either, hopefully my bathroom will be finished in a few days, woo-hoo!

the movie was "eh". i love cate blanchett, she was a great femme fatale. everyone else was "eh". i agree with john that clooney never seemed comfortable. he just doesn't have the bogart charm either. toby maguire was trying way too hard, i agree with that as well.

the casablanca comparisons were weird, but at least it was a little darker. i think this movie could have been much better if there had been stronger actors in the main roles.

very pretty though, i like the way it was filmed and the sets.


I'll have to echo similar sentiments, although of the three of us, I think I liked it the most. Being the huge Casablanca fan that I am, I didn't mind the similarities much.

Tobey was mis-cast, plain and simple. Not that he's a bad actor, just should not have been in this movie. Clooney's part I imagine was tough to play. A guy that wants to be there, but doesn't want to be there sort of thing. I think he was the right guy to play the part, but there could have been more depth to his character. Plus, I wasn't sold on the chemistry between he and Blanchett.

Blanchett I thought was amazing in it. Too bad the overall movie did not match her performance.

I think the main issue with the movie is that it was trying too hard to be "noir". That led it to have the feel of the old "B" movie noir films at times, the ones that were a bit over the top. What made Casablanca, and others, so good is that it didn't have to try and be anything. Just the way movies were back then.

So, it's worth checking out in the DVD sections, but I would recommend to hold off in the theaters.

PotVsKtl
02-14-2007, 09:53 AM
The Departed was really not very good. People calling it Scoresese's best film since Goodfellas are full of shit and should have their criticism license revoked, laminated, and set alight while resting on their supine faces. I just don't care about Matt Damon.

schoolofruckus
02-14-2007, 10:34 AM
Why didn't you like it, Pot?

PotVsKtl
02-14-2007, 11:32 AM
I didn't dislike it, it was a fine film. A fine film that could have been directed by any number of reasonably talented directors. I'm first in line at the firebomb the Oscars for never recognizing Scorsese tent, but this film doesn't deserve it. Also I do not care about Matt Damon. Quit casting Matt Damon in anything that isn't The Talented Mr. Ripley.

chairmenmeow47
02-14-2007, 11:37 AM
I didn't dislike it, it was a fine film. A fine film that could have been directed by any number of reasonably talented directors. I'm first in line at the firebomb the Oscars for never recognizing Scorsese tent, but this film doesn't deserve it. Also I do not care about Matt Damon. Quit casting Matt Damon in anything that isn't The Talented Mr. Ripley.

i agree with this! i mean, it was good, but it was nowhere near the top of my scorcese list. it annoys me that directors like this get passed over for their better work. then comes a year where nothing else is really that much better and all of a sudden everyone thinks the movie is brilliant. i don't get it.

mob roulette
02-14-2007, 11:41 AM
I didn't dislike it, it was a fine film. A fine film that could have been directed by any number of reasonably talented directors. I'm first in line at the firebomb the Oscars for never recognizing Scorsese tent, but this film doesn't deserve it. Also I do not care about Matt Damon. Quit casting Matt Damon in anything that isn't The Talented Mr. Ripley.

agreed. eloquently stated.

Yablonowitz
02-14-2007, 11:46 AM
lso I do not care about Matt Damon. Quit casting Matt Damon in anything that isn't The Talented Mr. Ripley.

He's good in those Bourne movies.

downingthief
02-14-2007, 11:50 AM
He's good in those Bourne movies.

I thought he was good in Syriana, too.

thinnerair
02-14-2007, 11:52 AM
...and Oceans 11

schoolofruckus
02-14-2007, 12:27 PM
I didn't dislike it, it was a fine film. A fine film that could have been directed by any number of reasonably talented directors. I'm first in line at the firebomb the Oscars for never recognizing Scorsese tent, but this film doesn't deserve it. Also I do not care about Matt Damon. Quit casting Matt Damon in anything that isn't The Talented Mr. Ripley.

Did you like it better than "The Aviator"? I personally have liked most of what Scorsese has done - including "Gangs of New York" and "Bringing Out the Dead", but his Oscar chase reached its apex with "The Aviator", and that was the point where I had to say "ENOUGH!" I don't think "The Departed" is as good as "Taxi Driver" or "GoodFellas" or "Raging Bull" or "Mean Streets" or "Last Temptation of Christ", but I think it's a terrific thriller and it has enough of a character element to make it resonate.

I also think Matt Damon's one of the better A-list actors of that age group. Although I still maintain that a Harvard man shouldn't struggle to hit the toilet bowl.

PotVsKtl
02-14-2007, 12:33 PM
I think The Aviator is a fantastic film, one that did in fact deserve an Oscar. At least The Aviator and Gangs of New York had the mark of the director on them. The only time I felt Scorsese in The Departed was when Matt Damon was busting bottles on peoples' heads and adjusting their faces with coatracks, and that was to bemoan the fact that it was such a calculated move - everyone expects the unexpected graphic beatdown.

chairmenmeow47
02-14-2007, 12:36 PM
I think The Aviator is a fantastic film, one that did in fact deserve an Oscar. At least The Aviator and Gangs of New York had the mark of the director on them. The only time I felt Scorsese in The Departed was when Matt Damon was busting bottles on peoples' heads and adjusting their faces with coatracks, and that was to bemoan the fact that it was such a calculated move - everyone expects the unexpected graphic beatdown.

agreed! i loved the aviator. the "look" of the movie was MUCH better too. not just because of the style, but the camera work and cuts were better.

in the departed, there's that scene where leo walks into the convenience store and gets his ass beat by two guys. when he walks in, you can tell they try to do the goodfellas long camera shot of the guy at the counter, but it never really worked. there were a few shots like that.

also, can he use some new music?!?

J~$$$
02-14-2007, 12:36 PM
I think The Aviator is a fantastic film, one that did in fact deserve an Oscar. At least The Aviator and Gangs of New York had the mark of the director on them. The only time I felt Scorsese in The Departed was when Matt Damon was busting bottles on peoples' heads and adjusting their faces with coatracks, and that was to bemoan the fact that it was such a calculated move - everyone expects the unexpected graphic beatdown.



you may want to watch the movie again.

mob roulette
02-14-2007, 12:38 PM
agreed again. the departed is okay, just not a scorsese masterpiece. gangs of new york is a bit of a mess but still way better than the departed just because you can tell someone's actually behind the camera and not just phoning it in. that and daniel day-lewis OWNS.

Yablonowitz
02-14-2007, 12:43 PM
Did you like it better than "The Aviator"? I personally have liked most of what Scorsese has done - including "Gangs of New York" and "Bringing Out the Dead"

Bringing Out the Dead was horrible. Just horrible. IMHO.

PotVsKtl
02-14-2007, 12:47 PM
you may want to watch the movie again.

To what end?

schoolofruckus
02-14-2007, 01:17 PM
"Bringing Out the Dead" was brilliant. Just brilliant. Definitely the most Scorsese-esque Scorsese movie since GoodFellas, and that includes "Casino".

One thing about "The Departed" that I didn't like was the



*********INSIGNIFICANT SPOILER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!*********




rat at the end. I don't understand why that was funny or necessary.

CiderMouseRules
02-14-2007, 01:37 PM
1) The Science of Sleep was poorly acted. Being quirky enough to endear the admiration of hipsters is not the same as good acting. This is coming from a Gondry fan.

2) The Departed was expertly directed. I agree with the sentiment that it's Marty's best since Goodfellas.

schoolofruckus
02-14-2007, 01:46 PM
Intriguing. Lose the Peyton Manning avatar and we may be onto something.

mob roulette
02-14-2007, 02:55 PM
bump.

i could argue scorsese all day. schoolio, how would you rate them from best to worst? the BIG ones anyway. feel free to leave out new york, new york but please do include king of comedy. i want to compare lists. thanks.

jackstraw94086
02-14-2007, 03:03 PM
1) The Science of Sleep was poorly acted. Being quirky enough to endear the admiration of hipsters is not the same as good acting. This is coming from a Gondry fan.

2) The Departed was expertly directed. I agree with the sentiment that it's Marty's best since Goodfellas.


The worst hipsters are the ones oblivious to the fact that they are in fact hipsters. They are so deathly afraid of "not getting it" that their minds reject the possibility of alternative interpretations. The presumption that all art can be understood by you and that all else is not art is the truest mark of a hipster. If you're posting here then who's work minding the register at Urban Outfitters?

Anyway, how much taste can a person with a peyton manning avatar really have?

mob roulette
02-14-2007, 03:05 PM
somebody please post an oh snap graphic here. please.

mountmccabe
02-14-2007, 03:09 PM
One thing I really like about Soderbergh is that he tends to approach his career as if he's the most well-paid film school student in the world. He takes on films as projects, trying to take on a new idea with each successive film (well, except for Ocean's 12) so he can add new skills to his repertoire. It makes him wildly uneven, but I enjoy seeing what he does.

Agreed.



He's good in those Bourne movies.


Bringing Out the Dead was horrible. Just horrible. IMHO.

One for Two, Yabs.

schoolofruckus
02-14-2007, 03:10 PM
Here is my list of Scorsese movies - the ones I've seen - in approximate order of preference:

Taxi Driver
GoodFellas
Raging Bull
Mean Streets
The Departed (screw it, I think it actually is better than the ones below)
Bringing Out the Dead
The Last Temptation of Christ
Gangs of New York
Casino
Cape Fear
The Aviator

Obviously, there are a few others like "Alice Doesn't Live Here Anymore" and "Boxcar Bertha" and "After Hours" that I probably should get off my ass and see; forgive me if I don't consider "Kundun" or "The Age of Innocence" to be mandatory even though they are probably also quite good.

What's your list looking like, mob?

mountmccabe
02-14-2007, 03:14 PM
My Scorsese list

Raging Bull
Goodfellas
Bringing Out the Dead
Bad (Michael Jackson)
Taxi Driver
The Last Temptation of Christ
Casino
The Aviator
Gangs of New York


And yes, I realize I've got serious gaps. Some non-relative judgements: Raging Bull is stunning. Casino is good. Gangs of New York was awful.

I've seen The Last Waltz but I don't remember it well. Maybe I need to borrow it from my father. It's a good CD.

PotVsKtl
02-14-2007, 03:16 PM
Color of Money you motherfuckers. Where is it?

mob roulette
02-14-2007, 03:19 PM
Here is my list of Scorsese movies - the ones I've seen - in approximate order of preference:

Taxi Driver
GoodFellas
Raging Bull
Mean Streets
The Departed (screw it, I think it actually is better than the ones below)
Bringing Out the Dead
The Last Temptation of Christ
Gangs of New York
Casino
Cape Fear
The Aviator

Obviously, there are a few others like "Alice Doesn't Live Here Anymore" and "Boxcar Bertha" and "After Hours" that I probably should get off my ass and see; forgive me if I don't consider "Kundun" or "The Age of Innocence" to be mandatory even though they are probably also quite good.

What's your list looking like, mob?

agreed. don't count the lesser known films including innocence and kundun.

goodfellas
taxi driver
raging bull
gangs of new york
casino
mean streets
king of comedy
the departed
bringing out the dead
the last temptation of christ
the aviator
cape fear

we're pretty close at the top but i think goodfellas is his undisputed masterpiece. mean streets is overrated (though it's a lot of people's personal favorite from what i understand) and casino is UNDERrated. neither aviator nor cape fear is all that. my problem with the scorsese hype is that the award is a gimme. it's recognizing him for PAST work and everybody knows it.

also no king of comedy player? that was WAY ahead of its time.

mountmccabe
02-14-2007, 03:20 PM
Hey, I feel like doing a Soderbergh list too:


Schizopolis
Traffic
Out of Sight
Sex, Lies and Videotape
The Good German
Erin Brockovich
Ocean's 11
Kafka


The top 4 are all really, really good. Only the last one is bad... and it's one of the worst movies I've ever seen.

mob roulette
02-14-2007, 03:20 PM
Color of Money you motherfuckers. Where is it?

i know you're kidding pot. put that up against the hustler and tell me just how good of a sequel it is.

mob roulette
02-14-2007, 03:21 PM
Hey, I feel like doing a Soderbergh list too:


Schizopolis
Traffic
Out of Sight
Sex, Lies and Videotape
The Good German
Erin Brockovich
Ocean's 11
Kafka


The top 4 are all really, really good. Only the last one is bad... and it's one of the worst movies I've ever seen.

which one's the jennifer lopez one? that had some pretty good cinematography.

mountmccabe
02-14-2007, 03:23 PM
Color of Money you motherfuckers. Where is it?
Blockbuster, I presume. Are you recommending it as something worthwhile? It does have Tom Cruise in it, you know.

mountmccabe
02-14-2007, 03:24 PM
which one's the jennifer lopez one? that had some pretty good cinematography.

Out of Sight. It is a light movie but it is stylish and witty and shot well. I really enjoy it.

mob roulette
02-14-2007, 03:24 PM
Blockbuster, I presume. Are you recommending it as something worthwhile? It does have Tom Cruise in it, you know.

wow. i bit hard. pot i hate you.

KungFuJoe
02-14-2007, 03:26 PM
I never understood why people loved "Traffic" so much. Do I need to rewatch this film? I only saw it once in the theater and was not impressed at all.

schoolofruckus
02-14-2007, 03:37 PM
I like "Traffic" a lot, but it's not my favorite Soderbergh.

Out of Sight
The Limey
Traffic
Bubble
Solaris
Sex, Lies, and Videotape
Ocean's Eleven
Ocean's Twelve
The Good German

I enjoyed both "Ocean's" movies in different ways - 11 was a better movie, 12 was a little looser and more fun. The Julia Roberts joke at the end alone was enough to make me gloss over some of the movie's obvious holes.

I've been wanting to see "Schizopolis" for a while.

KungFuJoe
02-14-2007, 03:52 PM
I like "Traffic" a lot, but it's not my favorite Soderbergh.

Out of Sight
The Limey
Traffic
Bubble
Solaris
Sex, Lies, and Videotape
Ocean's Eleven
Ocean's Twelve
The Good German

I enjoyed both "Ocean's" movies in different ways - 11 was a better movie, 12 was a little looser and more fun. The Julia Roberts joke at the end alone was enough to make me gloss over some of the movie's obvious holes.

I've been wanting to see "Schizopolis" for a while.


Well, I agree with you on your top two. Out of Sight & The Limey are my favorite Soderbergh films. And I'm not scared to admit that Erin Brokovich is probably number three. I still haven't seen Schizopolis, the Ocean's movies, Bubble or Solaris (or the good german). A friend of mine use to swear by Solaris though.

schoolofruckus
02-14-2007, 03:56 PM
I remember liking "Solaris" a lot when I saw it in theaters (like 4 years ago) but I haven't seen it since and I don't remember it that well.

I should probably see "Erin Brockovich" one of these years.

mountmccabe
02-14-2007, 03:59 PM
A friend of mine use to swear by Solaris though.

By Soderbergh's Solaris? Really? I haven't seen it, mostly out of love for the Tarkovsky version.

Also, folks thinking about seeing Schizopolis: Do it. Maybe drink a little first. It's not much for a plot or whatnot but it's amazingly wonderful and pretty much responsible for 58% of my love for Soderbergh.

schoolofruckus
02-14-2007, 04:05 PM
I was reading about the making of it in "Rebels on the Backlot". Apparently it was made as an attempt to explore the end of his own marriage and to try to see if it could work out. His wife and his daughter in the film are played by his real-life ex-wife and daughter.

jackstraw94086
02-14-2007, 04:09 PM
"After Hours"

This may not be counted among his best, but it's a damn good movie for what it is. It reeks of Scorcese's love of NY. Much lighter than his usual stuff. Lot's of fun characters (including cameos by cheech & chong).

It inspired another film called Seach & Destroy, also starring Griffin Dunne (with a cameo by Scorsese), but it somehow wasn't quite as good despite the stellar cast.

Mr.Nipples
02-14-2007, 04:11 PM
Uwe boll...

schoolofruckus
02-14-2007, 04:13 PM
Yeah, I've always thought that of Scorsese's comic films, that's probably the one that would most likely be the best. I like Griffin Dunne as an actor.

jackstraw94086
02-14-2007, 04:19 PM
Yeah, I've always thought that of Scorsese's comic films, that's probably the one that would most likely be the best. I like Griffin Dunne as an actor.

Griffin is excellent in this one. He does befuddlement pretty well (not William H Macy level befuddlement, but up there).

After Hours definitely full of very odd scenarios and behavior.

amyzzz
02-14-2007, 04:23 PM
I remember liking "Solaris" a lot when I saw it in theaters (like 4 years ago) but I haven't seen it since and I don't remember it that well.

I should probably see "Erin Brockovich" one of these years.
I liked Solaris a lot in the theatre, and we rented it recently and enjoyed it then too. It has a nice sense of the eternal.

schoolofruckus
02-14-2007, 04:39 PM
I heard a lot of comparisons - favorable and not - of "The Fountain" to "Solaris" in the reviews this past fall. That made me want to watch it again as well.

amyzzz
02-14-2007, 05:00 PM
I heard a lot of comparisons - favorable and not - of "The Fountain" to "Solaris" in the reviews this past fall. That made me want to watch it again as well.
That's why I wanted to watch Solaris again too. I had a hankering for ANYTHING that felt like The Fountain. I tried watching 2001:A Space Odyssey with my husband, but we couldn't watch all of that. (I've seen it before; he hasn't).

mountmccabe
02-14-2007, 05:07 PM
If you didn't do well with 2001 then I guess it would be silly to recommend Solyaris. Oh man how I love those movies.

I've only seen Andrey Rublyov and Solyaris. Can anyone recommend/comment on other Tarkovsky?

atom heart
02-14-2007, 05:25 PM
Scorcese did Age of Innocence? I think that's the only movie of his that I've actually seen. I hated it because I hated the book and I have an antipathy towards Daniel Day-Lewis.

Yablonowitz
02-14-2007, 05:45 PM
"Bringing Out the Dead" was brilliant. Just brilliant.

I almost swore off Scorsese after watching that. I thought it bordered on exploiting urban cliches and seemed to offer no real flair. His tricks seemed forced like some of Spike Lee's worst excesses.

And while I loved The Departed, it's not even close to Goodfellas to me. But I'm not the best one to comment, I'm not into Scorsese all that much. He lacks subtlety. And his movies are often saturated in testosterone. I'm too much of a girly man to worship that kind of filmmaking. I put Scorsese, Oliver Stone (when he actually tried to do something with his movies), and Spike Lee all in the same general category of filmmakers I like but don't revere like many.

Then again, I love Quentin Tarantino and he really should fit into that category too. I'm a walking contradiction.

Like bullets and love.

schoolofruckus
02-14-2007, 06:06 PM
I put Scorsese, Oliver Stone (when he actually tried to do something with his movies), and Spike Lee all in the same general category of filmmakers I like but don't revere like many.

I agree with you almost wholeheartedly, with one caveat - I love them all to death. They're all NYU alumni too, and I believe Scorsese lectured Stone and Lee in some of their classes, so there's definitely a reason for the similarities. Each definitely has his own style, but they're of a silmilar philosophy, I would say.

It's funny, Tarantino worships Scorsese, hates Stone, and is despised by Lee.


atom heart, why do you hate Daniel Day-Lewis, of all actors?

atom heart
02-14-2007, 06:14 PM
I think what killed Daniel Day-Lewis for me was the Crucible. That's another bit of literature severely dislike (especially since I've had to read it three times in the past few years), and the movie is possibly more annoying (I've seen the movie twice).

I suppose I don't like him because he's connected with movies I don't like. I've never seen him in any film that I enjoyed.

edit*
Actually, I have seen A Room with a View, but Cecil is an ass. So my entire experience with Day-Lewis has been negative.

KungFuJoe
02-14-2007, 07:00 PM
It's funny, Tarantino worships Scorsese,..

Does he really? has he said this?

mob roulette
02-15-2007, 01:51 PM
bump

hey ruckus. remember when the board had a best albums of all time survey and everyone voted? you should do that with movies. i'd totally vote. maybe make it only of the last twenty five years or so though. that way it's not too large to manage. whaddya think?

breakjaw
02-15-2007, 02:02 PM
bump
it's not too large to manage. whaddya think?
http://imageigloo.com/images/801product_detail_g_said.gif

amyzzz
02-15-2007, 02:02 PM
bump

hey ruckus. remember when the board had a best albums of all time survey and everyone voted? you should do that with movies. i'd totally vote. maybe make it only of the last twenty five years or so though. that way it's not too large to manage. whaddya think?

Either you're an alias, you've been lurking for quite a while....

schoolofruckus
02-15-2007, 02:19 PM
mob, I've honestly thought of doing this a few times, but just never got my shit together. But with this nudging, I think I just might!

breakjaw
02-15-2007, 02:25 PM
But with this nudging, I think I just might!http://imageigloo.com/images/801product_detail_g_said.gif

schoolofruckus
02-18-2007, 07:18 PM
I just finished reading "Rebels on the Backlot", and if you don't mind, I'm going to riff on it a little bit. Tessa, you can wait out in the car. I'll be out in a bit.

This book is absolutely a keeper - a compulsively readable look at the process that went into making some of the most important American movies of this generation. Though it does a fine job of evoking the mid-to-late-90's film scene overall, the book largely focuses on the "Class of '99", the directors who made some of the most important films of that year: Paul Thomas Anderson, whose prodigious talent reached new heights with his epic labor of love, "Magnolia". David O. Russell, who brought his dryly humanistic sense of humor to the war genre (and the studio system) to make "Three Kings". Spike Jonze, who found in "Being John Malkovich" the perfect screenplay with which to unharness his restless imagination on the unsuspecting public. David Fincher, an encyclopedia example of subversive cynicism, poured a lifetime of disdain for commercialism into the masterful "Fight Club". The bookends for this story are the birth of the 90's indie boom, with Steven Soderbergh's "sex, lies, and videotape" and Quentin Tarantino's "Pulp Fiction" leading the charge, and Soderbergh's personal career apex in 2000 with "Traffic".

This book is, clearly, right in my wheelhouse for a number of reasons. Namely - I remember what 1999 felt like as a filmgoer. I have studied this era and its films relentlessly, and I'd happily annoint myself an expert on the subject; it's basically like Erik's similar claims about Woodstock '99, only with actual spectator experience. I wasn't living in Los Angeles or working in the film business yet - I was, in fact, a sophomore in high school - but I very clearly remember the buffet of brilliance that was trotted out that year. It began in the spring, with "The Matrix" injecting a welcome dose of ideology and innovation into the action genre. Then it spread to the summer, with "The Blair Witch Project" becoming a one-of-a-kind sensation, outgrossing every handheld-shot independent film in history, while "The Sixth Sense" found a more classical way to reinvent the horror genre. There was also "Go" and "Run Lola Run", two breakneck thrillers that feasted at the table of chronological disarray that Tarantino's breakthrough films had set.

Then came the fall season. Like every other year, this one came packed to the gills with films that promised to redefine American life and sweep through Oscar season with a trail of blown-away audiences in its wake; unlike just about any other autumn in memory, this one delivered on its promise. I remember walking out of one film after another that year wondering what hit me: "American Beauty". "Three Kings". "Fight Club". "Being John Malkovich". "Boys Don't Cry". By the time it started raining frogs at the climax of "Magnolia" in January 2000, I realized that I had just gone through an unparalleled five month span of movies that may never be equaled; a time when the most talented young filmmakers thrived within (and despite) the studio systems and all seemed to hit their stride simultaneously. There was even a terrific article in Entertainment Weekly (I know, I know....shut up) as the renaissance was happening in 1999 about the culture that was being spawned. It hasn't exactly panned out that way; while some of the new breed have worked with prolificity and success (Wes Anderson has kept a pace of making an excellent film every 2-3 years; Steven Soderbergh makes a new movie every couple of weeks, and many of them have been good and/or profitable), there has also been a rash of stunning hiatuses in these great young filmmakers. Aronofsky, who broke out in 1998 - an underrated, outrageously good film year in itself - along with Wes Anderson, famously struggled to finish his latest masterpiece. Paul Thomas Anderson, Russell, Fincher, Tarantino, and Jonze have all also endured stretches of 5 years between their films, and the few films they've made since then have in some cases been met with disappointment from audiences (though I certainly don't share that sentiment for any of the aforementioned) and critics.

As is done often throughout "Rebels on the Backlot", I'm skipping ahead to the end result in the middle of the story. The point is, this book recreates the magic of that era with stunning efficiency, creating a suitably cinematic backdrop for all these young titans while also demystifying them. Each auteur is presented as a character straight off the screen: you have Quentin Tarantino, a stunning example of disorganization (be it in his writing process, his social life, the accounts of his background, or his hygiene) who sees his life in the serial terms of movies to the point that he drops friends as soon as he feels their story has ended. You have Spike Jonze, a mischievous wallflower who, not unlike QT, lets his own portrayal in the media spin wildly out of control; unlike Tarantino, however, he shies away from the limelight at all times. You have David O. Russell, a wildly moody intellectual with a nasty streak a mile wide, the one guy in the book who got bit by the filmmaking bug as a young adult (rather than as a child). You have Paul Thomas Anderson, the young kid lurking in the shadows of film festivals in the early 90's, just waiting to unleash his particular brand of bravado on the movie world. You have David Fincher, a terminally sarcastic man who seemingly derives all of his pleasure in tormenting the people who watch and finance his movies. By contrast, the self-destruction of Steven Soderbergh, a cerebral, emotionally distant, multi-talented artist, seems almost run-of-the-mill.

The portraits of these directors is flat-out fascinating, and author Sharon Waxman makes a terrific decision in examining the emotional and familial complexities of each man. She finds common themes of mommy troubles (Russell, Anderson, Tarantino, and Soderbergh are all severely at odds with their mothers), relentless perfectionism (not one of the bunch is willing to subvert so much as a splinter of his vision), and most of all - as the title states - intransigence. She details the origins of the films that each man made in his young prime; the meetings with studio executives and financers and producers, the kicking around town of all these soon-to-be-treasured scripts, the difficulties on set and in the media.

The most scandalous - and thereby the most intriguing - passage of the book details the making of "Three Kings", which I could, on a given day, claim as my favorite movie of all time (other entries in this book, such as "Boogie Nights" and "Pulp Fiction", have timeshares in that position as well). "Three Kings" was, by all accounts, one of the most hellacious shoots in the history of Hollywood, making the shoot of "Apocalypse Now" look almost like film school by contrast. David O. Russell, in trying to make a $60 million Warner Bros. war movie the same way that he'd made his low budget comedies "Spanking the Monkey" and "Flirting With Disaster", alienated nearly every single person involved with the film with his tireless demands, schedules, improvisations, and tantrums. I had heard in the past about him getting into a fistfight on the set with George Clooney - who Russell felt deep contempt for as an actor prior to filming - but I had no idea that it was this bad. Russell had everyone working 7 days a week, 18 hour days - granted, this is not uncommon for many independent films, but it's anathema for a union crew - in which nobody knew which shot or scene was up next, in the heat of Arizona, while he yelled his directions as if each was a drill seargent's order. Clooney, who was in the twilight of his "ER" career, was shooting three days in Los Angeles and four days in Arizona every week; Spike Jonze, who had a memorable key role as Pvt. Conrad Vig, was flying back and forth on the weekends to finish editing "Malkovich". The executives were harassing him on a daily basis over the budget, the controversy in the script, and his work methods; he responded by withdrawing emotionally, by berating the work of everyone on set, by making crew members cry, and most of all, by needling Clooney about what he deemed "TV actor habits". Things spun wildly, stunningly out of control; I'd love to talk more about it, but I can't do the book justice. This just has to be read.

There are some elements of sloppiness here - minor factual errors (such as claiming "Out of Sight" was released in 1997 when it was clearly '98) and the occasional bout of redundancy, although I think the latter served to make each chapter of the book a self-contained, easy-to-drop-in read in its own right. I can also think of some directors whose stories I think should be included (Wes Anderson and Darren Aronofsky, to name two). But no matter. This book is written in a friendly, breezy fashion that makes it impossible to close, and the level of access granted by all subjects is highly impressive. You could easily knock this out on a plane flight or during a day of jurdy duty. The only side effect is that you're going to be intoxicated on the lore of all these great recent movies, and you're going to want to indulge in them immediately - I've watched "Adaptation", "Three Kings", and "Erin Brockovich" this weekend alone.

I should mention that I really liked "Erin Brockovich" also. It's still utterly embarassing for the Oscars that Julia Roberts won her award for this while Ellen Burstyn's jaw-dropping work in "Requiem for a Dream" went home empty-handed. But throwing that out, it's a terrific Hollywood underdog story that is well-acted, extremely well-written, and wisely grounded in real world grit by the photography of Steven Soderbergh. Looking at my list of Soderbergh movies, I would probably place it just above "The Good German"; If this movie is only his 9th best, you know this dude's got game.

thinnerair
02-18-2007, 07:42 PM
i like spike lee.

jerpar24
02-18-2007, 07:48 PM
Here is my list of Scorsese movies - the ones I've seen - in approximate order of preference:

Taxi Driver
GoodFellas
Raging Bull
Mean Streets
The Departed (screw it, I think it actually is better than the ones below)
Bringing Out the Dead
The Last Temptation of Christ
Gangs of New York
Casino
Cape Fear
The Aviator





schoolofruckus I like the list but for me I would have The Departed above Mean Streets.

schoolofruckus
02-18-2007, 08:06 PM
I might as well. It's a toss-up. They're both awesome.

"A Clockwork Orange" might be my favorite movie ever.

smellysocks
02-18-2007, 08:38 PM
A Clockwork Orange is probably one of the best film adaptations from a book. Amazing book...amazing movie

mob roulette
02-19-2007, 11:06 AM
*SPOILERS*

hi gabe i'm james. so hey we rented a bunch of movies this weekend, mostly stuff that we had already seen, magnolia (i like yr comments up above), infernal affairs, mulholland drive, bound, etc. but then we rented this old clint eastwood for laughs called the gauntlet (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0076070/) and oh my god. you think you know crazy but you have no idea how crazy this movie is. ever seen it? it's not crazy cause of the story or anything but i have never seen a picture with so many ridiculous premises and lapses in continuity. it's like it was edited by penguins or something. plus the dialogue is horrible. and there all these cool shots of vegas and phoenix in the seventies, but they pretend the symphony hall in downtown phx is police headquarters. and THEN he keeps driving around the same block over and over again, but from diff angles so that if you didn't know the town, you would think he was actually going SOMEWHERE. but then as if to make up for all THAT, they have like these shootouts where they expend hundreds and hundreds of rounds of ammo for no apparent reason. it's AWESOME. they like destroy a HOUSE. and also chase scenes. and also masturbation jokes. and clint taking on a whole army of bikers with just his one gun. and a bus ride. and oh my god the ENDING. seriously i can't even describe it to you really, you just have to see it for yourself. you totally have to. it's a train wreck and it's AWESOME. seriously. seriously. watch it. do it. now.

ok later.

york707
02-19-2007, 11:20 AM
spader.

downingthief
02-19-2007, 11:32 AM
I just finished reading "Rebels on the Backlot", and if you don't mind, I'm going to riff on it a little bit. Tessa, you can wait out in the car. I'll be out in a bit.

This book is absolutely a keeper - a compulsively readable look at the process that went into making some of the most important American movies of this generation. Though it does a fine job of evoking the mid-to-late-90's film scene overall, the book largely focuses on the "Class of '99", the directors who made some of the most important films of that year: Paul Thomas Anderson, whose prodigious talent reached new heights with his epic labor of love, "Magnolia". David O. Russell, who brought his dryly humanistic sense of humor to the war genre (and the studio system) to make "Three Kings". Spike Jonze, who found in "Being John Malkovich" the perfect screenplay with which to unharness his restless imagination on the unsuspecting public. David Fincher, an encyclopedia example of subversive cynicism, poured a lifetime of disdain for commercialism into the masterful "Fight Club". The bookends for this story are the birth of the 90's indie boom, with Steven Soderbergh's "sex, lies, and videotape" and Quentin Tarantino's "Pulp Fiction" leading the charge, and Soderbergh's personal career apex in 2000 with "Traffic".

This book is, clearly, right in my wheelhouse for a number of reasons. Namely - I remember what 1999 felt like as a filmgoer. I have studied this era and its films relentlessly, and I'd happily annoint myself an expert on the subject; it's basically like Erik's similar claims about Woodstock '99, only with actual spectator experience. I wasn't living in Los Angeles or working in the film business yet - I was, in fact, a sophomore in high school - but I very clearly remember the buffet of brilliance that was trotted out that year. It began in the spring, with "The Matrix" injecting a welcome dose of ideology and innovation into the action genre. Then it spread to the summer, with "The Blair Witch Project" becoming a one-of-a-kind sensation, outgrossing every handheld-shot independent film in history, while "The Sixth Sense" found a more classical way to reinvent the horror genre. There was also "Go" and "Run Lola Run", two breakneck thrillers that feasted at the table of chronological disarray that Tarantino's breakthrough films had set.

Then came the fall season. Like every other year, this one came packed to the gills with films that promised to redefine American life and sweep through Oscar season with a trail of blown-away audiences in its wake; unlike just about any other autumn in memory, this one delivered on its promise. I remember walking out of one film after another that year wondering what hit me: "American Beauty". "Three Kings". "Fight Club". "Being John Malkovich". "Boys Don't Cry". By the time it started raining frogs at the climax of "Magnolia" in January 2000, I realized that I had just gone through an unparalleled five month span of movies that may never be equaled; a time when the most talented young filmmakers thrived within (and despite) the studio systems and all seemed to hit their stride simultaneously. There was even a terrific article in Entertainment Weekly (I know, I know....shut up) as the renaissance was happening in 1999 about the culture that was being spawned. It hasn't exactly panned out that way; while some of the new breed have worked with prolificity and success (Wes Anderson has kept a pace of making an excellent film every 2-3 years; Steven Soderbergh makes a new movie every couple of weeks, and many of them have been good and/or profitable), there has also been a rash of stunning hiatuses in these great young filmmakers. Aronofsky, who broke out in 1998 - an underrated, outrageously good film year in itself - along with Wes Anderson, famously struggled to finish his latest masterpiece. Paul Thomas Anderson, Russell, Fincher, Tarantino, and Jonze have all also endured stretches of 5 years between their films, and the few films they've made since then have in some cases been met with disappointment from audiences (though I certainly don't share that sentiment for any of the aforementioned) and critics.

As is done often throughout "Rebels on the Backlot", I'm skipping ahead to the end result in the middle of the story. The point is, this book recreates the magic of that era with stunning efficiency, creating a suitably cinematic backdrop for all these young titans while also demystifying them. Each auteur is presented as a character straight off the screen: you have Quentin Tarantino, a stunning example of disorganization (be it in his writing process, his social life, the accounts of his background, or his hygiene) who sees his life in the serial terms of movies to the point that he drops friends as soon as he feels their story has ended. You have Spike Jonze, a mischievous wallflower who, not unlike QT, lets his own portrayal in the media spin wildly out of control; unlike Tarantino, however, he shies away from the limelight at all times. You have David O. Russell, a wildly moody intellectual with a nasty streak a mile wide, the one guy in the book who got bit by the filmmaking bug as a young adult (rather than as a child). You have Paul Thomas Anderson, the young kid lurking in the shadows of film festivals in the early 90's, just waiting to unleash his particular brand of bravado on the movie world. You have David Fincher, a terminally sarcastic man who seemingly derives all of his pleasure in tormenting the people who watch and finance his movies. By contrast, the self-destruction of Steven Soderbergh, a cerebral, emotionally distant, multi-talented artist, seems almost run-of-the-mill.

The portraits of these directors is flat-out fascinating, and author Sharon Waxman makes a terrific decision in examining the emotional and familial complexities of each man. She finds common themes of mommy troubles (Russell, Anderson, Tarantino, and Soderbergh are all severely at odds with their mothers), relentless perfectionism (not one of the bunch is willing to subvert so much as a splinter of his vision), and most of all - as the title states - intransigence. She details the origins of the films that each man made in his young prime; the meetings with studio executives and financers and producers, the kicking around town of all these soon-to-be-treasured scripts, the difficulties on set and in the media.

The most scandalous - and thereby the most intriguing - passage of the book details the making of "Three Kings", which I could, on a given day, claim as my favorite movie of all time (other entries in this book, such as "Boogie Nights" and "Pulp Fiction", have timeshares in that position as well). "Three Kings" was, by all accounts, one of the most hellacious shoots in the history of Hollywood, making the shoot of "Apocalypse Now" look almost like film school by contrast. David O. Russell, in trying to make a $60 million Warner Bros. war movie the same way that he'd made his low budget comedies "Spanking the Monkey" and "Flirting With Disaster", alienated nearly every single person involved with the film with his tireless demands, schedules, improvisations, and tantrums. I had heard in the past about him getting into a fistfight on the set with George Clooney - who Russell felt deep contempt for as an actor prior to filming - but I had no idea that it was this bad. Russell had everyone working 7 days a week, 18 hour days - granted, this is not uncommon for many independent films, but it's anathema for a union crew - in which nobody knew which shot or scene was up next, in the heat of Arizona, while he yelled his directions as if each was a drill seargent's order. Clooney, who was in the twilight of his "ER" career, was shooting three days in Los Angeles and four days in Arizona every week; Spike Jonze, who had a memorable key role as Pvt. Conrad Vig, was flying back and forth on the weekends to finish editing "Malkovich". The executives were harassing him on a daily basis over the budget, the controversy in the script, and his work methods; he responded by withdrawing emotionally, by berating the work of everyone on set, by making crew members cry, and most of all, by needling Clooney about what he deemed "TV actor habits". Things spun wildly, stunningly out of control; I'd love to talk more about it, but I can't do the book justice. This just has to be read.

There are some elements of sloppiness here - minor factual errors (such as claiming "Out of Sight" was released in 1997 when it was clearly '98) and the occasional bout of redundancy, although I think the latter served to make each chapter of the book a self-contained, easy-to-drop-in read in its own right. I can also think of some directors whose stories I think should be included (Wes Anderson and Darren Aronofsky, to name two). But no matter. This book is written in a friendly, breezy fashion that makes it impossible to close, and the level of access granted by all subjects is highly impressive. You could easily knock this out on a plane flight or during a day of jurdy duty. The only side effect is that you're going to be intoxicated on the lore of all these great recent movies, and you're going to want to indulge in them immediately - I've watched "Adaptation", "Three Kings", and "Erin Brockovich" this weekend alone.

I should mention that I really liked "Erin Brockovich" also. It's still utterly embarassing for the Oscars that Julia Roberts won her award for this while Ellen Burstyn's jaw-dropping work in "Requiem for a Dream" went home empty-handed. But throwing that out, it's a terrific Hollywood underdog story that is well-acted, extremely well-written, and wisely grounded in real world grit by the photography of Steven Soderbergh. Looking at my list of Soderbergh movies, I would probably place it just above "The Good German"; If this movie is only his 9th best, you know this dude's got game.

Ok, I have to get this book, NOW.
Excellent work, Schoolio!

That time frame was a wonderful time in movie making. The big studios had to really recognize the talent out there, and that the movie going audience actally wanted to see these types of "Indie" movies.

"Three Kings" didn't get enough praise, in my opinion. Excellent movie.

schoolofruckus
02-19-2007, 12:01 PM
Ok, I have to get this book, NOW.
Excellent work, Schoolio!

That time frame was a wonderful time in movie making. The big studios had to really recognize the talent out there, and that the movie going audience actally wanted to see these types of "Indie" movies.

"Three Kings" didn't get enough praise, in my opinion. Excellent movie.

You're exactly right, Sean. It's sad in retrospect that, after that huge explosion of talent, a lot of those guys have had difficulty following it up. I'm not sure if they all just went apeshit in 1999 because they knew the millenium was coming and they wanted to get out everything they'd ever wanted to say in one movie, or what the deal was. But hopefully they all can kind of regain footing - after all, we got "The Fountain" last year, and this year we get "Zodiac", "There Will Be Blood", "The Darjeeling Limited", etc.

downingthief
02-19-2007, 12:59 PM
You're exactly right, Sean. It's sad in retrospect that, after that huge explosion of talent, a lot of those guys have had difficulty following it up. I'm not sure if they all just went apeshit in 1999 because they knew the millenium was coming and they wanted to get out everything they'd ever wanted to say in one movie, or what the deal was. But hopefully they all can kind of regain footing - after all, we got "The Fountain" last year, and this year we get "Zodiac", "There Will Be Blood", "The Darjeeling Limited", etc.

What did you think of Mendes' follow ups..."Road To Perdition" and "Jarhead"? I only saw "Road", and I did enjoy it, but it seemed disjointed at times.

schoolofruckus
02-19-2007, 02:19 PM
"Road to Perdition" is good, but there's not a whole lot to it. It's nowhere near as complex and wonderful as "American Beauty". "Jarhead" is an absolute piece of dogshit. I've said it before, I'll say it a million times - it takes two hours to accomplish what "Three Kings" accomplished in the first three minutes. I keep hearing this theory that it's some kind of misunderstood work of genius, and that's bullshit. It's a well-intentioned movie that fell flat on its face.

wmgaretjax
02-19-2007, 02:21 PM
"Road to Perdition" is good, but there's not a whole lot to it. It's nowhere near as complex and wonderful as "American Beauty". "Jarhead" is an absolute piece of dogshit. I've said it before, I'll say it a million times - it takes two hours to accomplish what "Three Kings" accomplished in the first three minutes. I keep hearing this theory that it's some kind of misunderstood work of genius, and that's bullshit. It's a well-intentioned movie that fell flat on its face.

i agree. completely.

mountmccabe
02-19-2007, 06:08 PM
A Clockwork Orange is probably one of the best film adaptations from a book. Amazing book...amazing movie
The movie and the book are different stories, though. Kubrick didn't take Burgess' ending so you get a very different take on things.

I agree that both the book and the film are wonderful but they're too at odds for me even consider it for "best film adaptations from a book."



What did you think of Mendes' follow ups..."Road To Perdition" and "Jarhead"? I only saw "Road", and I did enjoy it, but it seemed disjointed at times.

Road to Perdition might be my favorite movie starring Tom Hanks. He doesn't talk for, what, half the movie? I really liked it... I would like to see it again but I'm thinking it'll do better on repeat viewings than American Beauty has.


And, wow, Gabe, that book sounds awesome. And yeah, that was a fantastic year for films.

wmgaretjax
02-19-2007, 06:23 PM
I agree about "Clockwork Orange" as an adaptation. I think many of Kubrick's adaptations function in the same way (Strangelove, Shining etc.).

downingthief
02-19-2007, 07:20 PM
I agree about "Clockwork Orange" as an adaptation. I think many of Kubrick's adaptations function in the same way (Strangelove, Shining etc.).

Kubrick is my favorite Director overall, followed by Altman (as you all can tell from my Avatar). "Clockwork" was brilliant, but have to side with John with this on the best adaptation idea. Personally, I think "The Shining" was among the worst adaptations. In my opinion, it also was one of Kubrick's weakest films (yes, I know a lot of people disagree with that). For me,
"Strangelove" was his best overall work.

SojuGorae
02-19-2007, 07:46 PM
Kubrick is my favorite Director overall, followed by Altman (as you all can tell from my Avatar). "Clockwork" was brilliant, but have to side with John with this on the best adaptation idea. Personally, I think "The Shining" was among the worst adaptations. In my opinion, it also was one of Kubrick's weakest films (yes, I know a lot of people disagree with that). For me,
"Strangelove" was his best overall work.

Have you seen Spartacus and Killer's Kiss? My picks as two of his weakest. At least The Shining was entertaining.

wmgaretjax
02-19-2007, 08:13 PM
what the hell, I'll do a "loose" Kubrick ranking:

2001
Strangelove
Eyes Wide Shut
Clockwork Orange
Paths of Glory
Lolita
Full Metal Jacket
Shining
The Killing
Barry Lyndon
Fear and Desire
Killer's Kiss
Spartacus

downingthief
02-20-2007, 06:59 AM
Have you seen Spartacus and Killer's Kiss? My picks as two of his weakest. At least The Shining was entertaining.

I don't consider Spartacus weak for a couple of reasons. First, he didn't have the pull that he did in later years with the studios; can't fault him for that. And, Spartacus was the first modern movie "Epic". Every Epic since has measured itself to that film.
Was it perfect? No, and let's face it...Kirk Douglas was the Prince of Over-Actors (Heston is the King, in my opinion).

I do agree on Killer's Kiss...one of the weaker ones.

downingthief
02-20-2007, 07:01 AM
what the hell, I'll do a "loose" Kubrick ranking:

2001
Strangelove
Eyes Wide Shut
Clockwork Orange
Paths of Glory
Lolita
Full Metal Jacket
Shining
The Killing
Barry Lyndon
Fear and Desire
Killer's Kiss
Spartacus


Well done. As I said, I would put Shining lower, and raise Spartacus. Glad to see you have Eyes Wide Shut up near the top; very under-rated and misunderstood film!

TomAz
02-20-2007, 07:02 AM
Dr Strangelove is in my top 5 list of favorite movies ever by anyone. that movie is about as close to perfect as it gets.

downingthief
02-20-2007, 07:08 AM
Dr Strangelove is in my top 5 list of favorite movies ever by anyone. that movie is about as close to perfect as it gets.

So True...never get tired of seeing it.

mountmccabe
02-20-2007, 07:38 AM
2001
Paths of Glory
Dr Strangelove
Eyes Wide Shut
Barry Lyndon
A Clockwork Orange
Full Metal Jacket
Spartacus
The Killing
The Shining
Lolita


I really liked Lyndon mainly for the duel. I should probably see Lolita again but I liked the book so much I was kinda letdown by the movie. But none of those are bad. I certainly loves me some Kubrick.

Not seen:

Fear and Desire
Killer's Kiss (or did I? I need to look up what that one was again.)

schoolofruckus
02-20-2007, 10:03 AM
Killer's Kiss isn't very good. It's the only Kubrick I can say that about.

My list:

A Clockwork Orange
2001
Dr. Strangelove
Full Metal Jacket
Paths of Glory
The Shining
Eyes Wide Shut
Barry Lyndon
Killer's Kiss

I need to see Lolita, Spartacus, and The Killing, obviously. And Fear and Desire, if I can find it.

TomAz
02-20-2007, 10:15 AM
1. Dr Strangelove
2. Full Metal Jacket
3. 2001
4. Barry Lyndon
5. The Shining
6. A Clockwork Orange

I've seen Lolita but I barely remember it. The others I've not seen.

downingthief
02-20-2007, 10:46 AM
Ok, safe to say we all enjoy Kubrick's work.

Anyone else enjoy Altman as much as I do?

TomAz
02-20-2007, 10:50 AM
Robin Williams as Popeye. blech.

thinnerair
02-20-2007, 10:56 AM
more important than your top 5 favorite movies....



THIS IS GONNA BE EPIC!!!

In 1989, Milli Vanilli had it all: A multi-platinum album, legions of seven-year-old fans, rippling pectorals and hair no amount of Soul-Glo could tame. But by 1990, the duo — who brought the world gems like “Girl You Know It’s True” and “Blame It On the Rain” — was outed as frauds when their record skipped during a live MTV performance.
After being dropped from their label, stripped of their Best New Artist Grammy and sued for fraud, Milli Vanilli slipped into obscurity, the stuff of music lore.
But Milli Vanilli’s sordid tale is not forgotten for good: Universal Pictures acquired the rights to a Milli Vanilli biopic and will be bringing it to the big screen as early as next year.
“It’s going to be epic,” says executive producer Kim Marlowe, who cooked up the idea for the as-yet-untitled flick more than a decade ago but never felt comfortable enough to sign off the rights until teaming up with director and writer Jeff Nathanson (Rush Hour 2, Catch Me If You Can). “There’s only room for one major comeback in life and you just can’t leave that to chance.”
Milli Vanilli’s Fabrice Morvan consulted with Nathanson on the film, which is also authorized by the estate of Rob Pilatus (the other half of MV, who died of a drug overdose in 1998). “I’ve always resisted going back to the past because it was painful,” says Morvan. “But it was a healing process for me to relive those moments.”
There’s no word on who’s set to star, but Marlowe knows what she wants: “We need guys that are crazy gorgeous with bodies to die for; one has to have a French accent, the other has to have a German accent.”
The movie — which will trace the warts-and-all moments of Milli Vanilli’s career — has a goal larger than pure entertainment: To break down people’s misconceptions of the group. (What, they didn’t lip sync?) “We’re gonna have you walk in my shoes,” says Morvan. “A lot of people pointed fingers at us but they can’t until they know every aspect of the story.”
So, which hunky dudes would you cast?

downingthief
02-20-2007, 10:58 AM
Robin Williams as Popeye. blech.

I try and block that one from my memory. :p

Every Director has a stinker out there.

schoolofruckus
02-20-2007, 01:15 PM
I've famously struggled to get into Altman's stuff. I did think "A Prairie Home Companion" was great; I was way underwhelmed by "Short Cuts" and "The Player". I have yet to give "Nashville" or "MASH" or "McCabe & Mrs. Miller" or any of his other stuff a fair shake.

I'm going to be upgrading in the TV department real soon; I'm hoping that a new system will help me at least be able to comprehend the overlapping dialogue, which has just frustrated me on my current little shitty TV.

PotVsKtl
02-20-2007, 01:17 PM
Yeah Popeye was atrocious. I just watched The Long Goodbye, Altman's take on a Philip Marlowe gumshoe flick (adapted by Chandler.) Sterling Hayden is a fucking lunatic in his role. I maintain that 1971 - 76 were Altman's best years. Fuck a bunch of Short Cuts. In fact, all work in the '70s is superior to all other work.

SojuGorae
02-20-2007, 01:19 PM
Ok, safe to say we all enjoy Kubrick's work.

Anyone else enjoy Altman as much as I do?

Could never get into his movies. I'd always get bored and stop mid-way. The Player was great, though. McCabe & Mrs. Miller was like watching paint dry.

downingthief
02-20-2007, 01:23 PM
I've famously struggled to get into Altman's stuff. I did think "A Prairie Home Companion" was great; I was way underwhelmed by "Short Cuts" and "The Player". I have yet to give "Nashville" or "MASH" or "McCabe & Mrs. Miller" or any of his other stuff a fair shake.

I'm going to be upgrading in the TV department real soon; I'm hoping that a new system will help me at least be able to comprehend the overlapping dialogue, which has just frustrated me on my current little shitty TV.

"MASH" is a great film. Worth checking out again.
I personally loved "The Player". That opening shot is just brilliant.

Altman is not for everyone, that is for sure. I refer to him as the "Hemingway" of movie makers; you either love him, or hate him.

schoolofruckus
02-20-2007, 01:57 PM
Like I've said before - I feel like if I love Paul Thomas Anderson's shit so religiously (and I do), I should at least be able to get into Altman's stuff somewhat.

TomAz
02-20-2007, 01:58 PM
In fact, all work in the '70s is superior to all other work.

http://www.nostalgia.com/large/28899.JPG

mob roulette
02-20-2007, 02:18 PM
Like I've said before - I feel like if I love Paul Thomas Anderson's shit so religiously (and I do), I should at least be able to get into Altman's stuff somewhat.

punch drunk love is a fucking masterpiece. just saying.

KungFuJoe
02-20-2007, 03:02 PM
2001
Paths of Glory
Dr Strangelove
Eyes Wide Shut
Barry Lyndon
A Clockwork Orange
Full Metal Jacket
Spartacus
The Killing
The Shining
Lolita



Putting "Eyes Wide Shut" above A Clockwork Orange & The Shining is a very bold statement.

randy ricochet
02-20-2007, 03:28 PM
1. Flash Gordon
2. Karate Kid
3. BMX Bandits
4. Space Balls
5. Porky's
6. Barbarella
7. Convoy
8. Cannonball Run II
9. Hooper
10. Scarface

schoolofruckus
02-20-2007, 03:35 PM
Randy, is that your submission for 10 best movies ever?

randy ricochet
02-20-2007, 03:35 PM
Yep

schoolofruckus
02-20-2007, 03:37 PM
punch drunk love is a fucking masterpiece. just saying.

It is a fucking masterpiece. I'd say it's the third such film for Anderson, and that's even being strict because "Hard Eight" is fucking great too. The dude's got a golden touch thus far.

schoolofruckus
02-20-2007, 03:37 PM
Randy, you should expand your list to 25.

randy ricochet
02-20-2007, 03:43 PM
Fair enough......

11. Cannonball Run
12. Confessions of a Window Cleaner
13. Morons From Outer Space
14. Spies Like Us
15. The Firm
16. Digby the Biggest Dog in the World
17. Smokey and the Bandit
18. The Sting
19. Jason and the Argonaughts
20. Smokey and the Bandit II
21. Shaving Ryan's Privates
22. Class
23. Police Academy I
24. Police Academy II
25. Romper Stomper

mountmccabe
02-20-2007, 03:58 PM
Putting "Eyes Wide Shut" above A Clockwork Orange & The Shining is a very bold statement.

I am not really a horror fan. The Shining isn't a standard horror pic but it also does a lot of things that just don't work for me. Yeah, Jack is cool and there are amazing amazing things (the kid riding his bike thing around on the carpet to built tension = awesome) and all but creepy ghost kids and lots of blood isn't my thing. I still really like the movie but I don't love it.

A Clockwork Orange at times feels a little sloppy. Plus the story works better, I believe, as a book without seeing all the violence and whatnot. Plus most of what Burgess was doing with the language is missed when you hear it rather than read it. Also it's really old and you feel it. This is certainly a great movie and I wanna see it again soon but there are better.

Plus I just really, really like Eyes Wide Shut.

mountmccabe
02-20-2007, 04:05 PM
I rather like Altman but I've only seen a few. Gosford Park was beautiful, Kansas City was wonderful, Short Cuts was an amazing piece of work and, well, The Player was kinda OK. MASH was weird for me since I've been so annoyed by the TV show.

I don't know if I've seen all of Popeye and if I did I was very young.

I honestly don't even remember what the plot of Gosford Park was; I just remember the masses of people and the interactions and the wonderfulness.

Also I don't remember any Mrs. Miller.

KungFuJoe
02-20-2007, 04:08 PM
1. Flash Gordon
2. Karate Kid
3. BMX Bandits
4. Space Balls
5. Porky's
6. Barbarella
7. Convoy
8. Cannonball Run II
9. Hooper
10. Scarface

BMX BANDITS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! YES!

PotVsKtl
02-20-2007, 04:10 PM
But Romper Stomper is good.

KungFuJoe
02-20-2007, 04:12 PM
But Romper Stomper is good.


YES. Romper Stomper is a good one.

jackstraw94086
02-20-2007, 04:15 PM
MASH was weird for me since I've been so annoyed by the TV show.


Please don't mention the movie and the TV show in the same sentence. I get so annoyed when people disparage the movie with reference to the fucking horrid TV show. MASH almost had Catch-22 type humor. It's a black comedy. The idiots who made a sitcom out of it had no idea what it was about. The TV show was made for 70's prime time family television. The characters have completely different personalities, the subject matter is completely different. There's no fucking Alan Alda. There's no douchebag in a dress. the only thing they have in common is Cpl Radar.

amyzzz
02-20-2007, 04:45 PM
I am not really a horror fan. The Shining isn't a standard horror pic but it also does a lot of things that just don't work for me. Yeah, Jack is cool and there are amazing amazing things (the kid riding his bike thing around on the carpet to built tension = awesome) and all but creepy ghost kids and lots of blood isn't my thing. I still really like the movie but I don't love it.

A Clockwork Orange at times feels a little sloppy. Plus the story works better, I believe, as a book without seeing all the violence and whatnot. Plus most of what Burgess was doing with the language is missed when you hear it rather than read it. Also it's really old and you feel it. This is certainly a great movie and I wanna see it again soon but there are better.

Plus I just really, really like Eyes Wide Shut.
Eyes Wide Shut kinda turns me on. I should buy that damn movie. I've only watched about half your list of Kubrick movies, and I don't really "get" a couple of them yet (A Clockwork Orange, 2001), but I look forward to watching them again sometime. I love The Shining. I like horror movies as long as they're actually suspenseful and not just slasher movies.

mountmccabe
02-20-2007, 05:13 PM
That was my point, Jack. I only saw MASH once and I didn't care for it much partially because I was thinking of it in terms of the show. I'd see it again to reevaluate but I'm in no rush.

I didn't really like the Catch 22 movie either.

jackstraw94086
02-20-2007, 05:23 PM
That was my point, Jack. I only saw MASH once and I didn't care for it much partially because I was thinking of it in terms of the show. I'd see it again to reevaluate but I'm in no rush.

I didn't really like the Catch 22 movie either.

I said I hate it when "people" disparage the movie because of the TV sho, not I hate it when John disparages the movie because of the TV show. Mutually exclusive.

And btw I can't stand when people mention Catch-22 the book and Catch-22 the movie in the same sentence...........

randy ricochet
02-21-2007, 04:18 AM
YES. Romper Stomper is a good one.

They're all good!!!!

All That I Am
02-21-2007, 07:51 AM
I watched The Science Of Sleep last night and for some reason it just didn't work for me. I understand the story and liked the way they kept speaking different languages but it just didn't click.

downingthief
02-21-2007, 08:16 AM
I watched The Science Of Sleep last night and for some reason it just didn't work for me. I understand the story and liked the way they kept speaking different languages but it just didn't click.

Been meaning to pick that one up. Worth renting?

Watched a German movie called "Soap" last night. Some very, very dysfunctional characters, to say the least!

mountmccabe
02-21-2007, 08:46 AM
And btw I can't stand when people mention Catch-22 the book and Catch-22 the movie in the same sentence...........

Hahahhahahaa.

randy ricochet
02-21-2007, 09:29 AM
Oh, I forgot 'Top Secret'

schoolofruckus
02-21-2007, 09:47 AM
Randy, which one on your list does "Top Secret" replace? Also, which "Scarface" are you choosing?

I have decided to take James' urging and John's influence and assemble a survey for the Top 25 films of the Coachella message board. Please submit a ranked list of your top 25 films of all time in this thread; if you include a title that is a remake or has been remade (such as "Scarface"), please indicate which version you are nominating. I can figure out the rest (directors, decades, nations, what have you). No deadline as of yet, just submit them and when I have enough to make it worthwhile (if I get enough to make it worthwhile), then I'll establish a deadline so everyone else can get them in.

Thanks in advance for your continued descent into List-o-mania.

TomAz
02-21-2007, 09:58 AM
And btw I can't stand when people mention Catch-22 the book and Catch-22 the movie in the same sentence...........


yeah. Alan Arkin wasn't even in the book!

TomAz
02-21-2007, 10:20 AM
Randy, which one on your list does "Top Secret" replace? Also, which "Scarface" are you choosing?

I have decided to take James' urging and John's influence and assemble a survey for the Top 25 films of the Coachella message board. Please submit a ranked list of your top 25 films of all time in this thread; if you include a title that is a remake or has been remade (such as "Scarface"), please indicate which version you are nominating. I can figure out the rest (directors, decades, nations, what have you). No deadline as of yet, just submit them and when I have enough to make it worthwhile (if I get enough to make it worthwhile), then I'll establish a deadline so everyone else can get them in.

Thanks in advance for your continued descent into List-o-mania.

25 off the top of my head... this is hard and I know I must have left something out.

1. Apocalypse Now (original)
2. Dr Strangelove
3. Lawrence of Arabia
4. Monty Python and the Holy Grail
5. The Godfather
6. The Godfather Part II
7. Annie Hall
8. Animal House
9. Casablanca
10. This Is Spinal Tap
11. Ghandi
12. Amadeus
13. Saving Private Ryan
14. Fargo
15. Le Retour de Martin Guerre
16. Apollo 13
17. The Fugitive
18. The Gods Must Be Crazy
19. Giant
20. Citizen Kane
21. High Plains Drifter
22. The Wilby Conspiracy
23. O Brother Where Art Thou
24. Do the Right Thing
25. Best In Show

I deliberately left off the "Lonesome Dove" miniseries since it is not a film, per se, but if I had included it it would have come in around 10th or so.

*editing as stuff occurs to me. Like the Cohn brothers.

wmgaretjax
02-21-2007, 10:21 AM
anoyone gotten into Michael Haneke's films? I loved Cache, Time of the Wolf, 71 Fragments of a Chronology of Chance, Code Unkown and The Piano Player.

wmgaretjax
02-21-2007, 10:35 AM
Top 25... oh boy, that's tough. I'll give it a shot.

1. Decalogue
2. 2001
3. 8 1/2
4. The Conformist
5. Solaris -Tartovsky
6. Werkmeister Harmonies
7. Holy Mountain
8. The Third Man
9. On the Waterfront
10. Paris, Texas
11. Blue -Kieslowski
12. Irreversible
13. Apocalypse Now
14. Ran -Kurosawa
15. Last Tango in Paris
16. Citizen Kane
17. Ugetsu
18. Blue Velvet
19. Naked -Leigh
20. Cremator
21. Amelie
22. Satantango
23. Sunset Boulevard
24. Dr. Strangelove
25. Big Lebowski

amyzzz
02-21-2007, 10:40 AM
5. Solaris
the original?

wmgaretjax
02-21-2007, 10:45 AM
yes. of course.

although, I thought the remake was OK. Very different.

schoolofruckus
02-21-2007, 10:58 AM
For the record, here's my list:

A Clockwork Orange
Buffalo '66
Boogie Nights
Requiem for a Dream
Three Kings
JFK
The Killing of a Chinese Bookie
Sympathy for Mr. Vengeance
Rushmore
The Big Lebowski
Pulp Fiction
Taxi Driver
The Fountain
2001
City of God
Amores Perros
Breaking the Waves
Irreversible
The Godfather Part II
Citizen Kane
Magnolia
Heat
Edward Scissorhands
Network
Swingers


So far, the Coachella board consensus for best film of all time is.....Citizen Kane.

downingthief
02-21-2007, 10:59 AM
Randy, which one on your list does "Top Secret" replace? Also, which "Scarface" are you choosing?

I have decided to take James' urging and John's influence and assemble a survey for the Top 25 films of the Coachella message board. Please submit a ranked list of your top 25 films of all time in this thread; if you include a title that is a remake or has been remade (such as "Scarface"), please indicate which version you are nominating. I can figure out the rest (directors, decades, nations, what have you). No deadline as of yet, just submit them and when I have enough to make it worthwhile (if I get enough to make it worthwhile), then I'll establish a deadline so everyone else can get them in.

Thanks in advance for your continued descent into List-o-mania.

Great, thanks a lot Gabe. Now I am going to be stewing on this list for the rest of the day. So much for being productive!

mountmccabe
02-21-2007, 11:48 AM
Dude Gabe no semi colons. WTF.

schoolofruckus
02-21-2007, 12:22 PM
The semi-colon thing is to separate different fields, but I'm only asking for one field. I'll figure out directors and shit later.

schoolofruckus
02-21-2007, 12:29 PM
Also, I rented "McCabe & Mrs. Miller" and "Love Streams" from the Warner Home Video library today....I'm pretty excited about both.

Yablonowitz
02-21-2007, 12:30 PM
Anyone seen a little movie called "Vertigo"? That's uhh....just the best movie ever made in the world.

PotVsKtl
02-21-2007, 12:34 PM
1. Andrei Rublev
2. Aliens

That's all I can think of.

chairmenmeow47
02-21-2007, 12:41 PM
Anyone seen a little movie called "Vertigo"? That's uhh....just the best movie ever made in the world.

so amazing! not to mention jimmy stewart is just hilarious to listen to. i laugh everytime he falls off that stupid step ladder.

top 25 (in no particular order):

1. tombstone
2. terminator 2
3. goodfellas
4. dazed and confused
5. gone with the wind
6. empire strikes back
7. rushmore
8. vertigo
9. raising arizona
10. heat
11. natural born killers
12. clueless
13. braveheart
14. requium for a dream
15. full metal jacket
16. amelie
17. eternal sunshine of the spotless mind
18. fear and loathing in las vegas
19. se7en
20. shawshank redemption
21. fight club
22. trainspotting
23. leon the profesional
24. indian jones - raiders of the lost arc
25. nightmare before christmas

chairmenmeow47
02-21-2007, 12:41 PM
1. Andrei Rublev
2. Aliens

That's all I can think of.

i had to cut aliens, but it was close!

PotVsKtl
02-21-2007, 12:43 PM
Your list sucks mad dicks.

PotVsKtl
02-21-2007, 12:44 PM
Mine and garetjax's lists are the only lists that don't overindulge in the act of fellatio.

schoolofruckus
02-21-2007, 12:48 PM
Explain.

SojuGorae
02-21-2007, 12:50 PM
Top 25 (no order)

1. Jerry Maguire
2. Buffalo '66
3. Raging Bull
4. The Big Lebowski
5. Dazed and Confused
6. A Clockwork Orange
7. Heat
8. Oldboy
9. The 400 Blows
10. Bittersweet Life
11. Jules and Jim
12. L'Avventura
13. 8 1/2
14. Eyes Wide Shut
15. Silence of the Lambs
16. Sex and Lucia
17. Taxi Driver
18. The English Patient
19. 3-Iron
20. City of God
21. Amarcord
22. The Conformist
23. Goodfellas
24. Dances With Wolves
25. The Unforgiven

PotVsKtl
02-21-2007, 12:50 PM
Blowjobs.

chairmenmeow47
02-21-2007, 12:54 PM
Mine and garetjax's lists are the only lists that don't overindulge in the act of fellatio.

i don't even like porn :rotfl

schoolofruckus
02-21-2007, 01:16 PM
Yes, Pot, but what is the criteria for a list eating the dick?

amyzzz
02-21-2007, 01:18 PM
Anyone seen a little movie called "Vertigo"? That's uhh....just the best movie ever made in the world.
I love that movie. Jimmy Stewart is wearing A LOT of makeup in that movie.

downingthief
02-21-2007, 01:21 PM
Ok, Here goes nothing (some are in order, others not..you all can all figure out which is which ):

With Notes!


1. Casablanca- The "Perfect Movie" to me. Romance, Intrigue, Suspense...you name it, it had it. And, a very "un-Hollywood" like ending at the start of Hollywood's Golden Age. Bogey and Bergman were never better.
2. Dr. Strangelove - Came out when the movie industry, and the country, needed a good kick in the ass. Black comedy du jour. Peter Sellers is pure genius.
3. Citizen Kane - I find it amazing how every time I see this movie, how impressive, and "new" the camera work still is.
4. Taxi Driver - Deniro. In a mohawk. Brilliant.
5. American Beauty - The name says it all...this movie is simply beautiful. Acting, story, camera work...beautiful.
6. The Shawshank Redemption - Two fine actors at the top of their game. I still enjoy watching Andy get away with it.
7. Glory - I'm a Civil War nut, and this one does it perfectly. Denzel gives ther performance of his life.
8. Blade Runner (Director's Cut)- Exhistential SciFi. Can't beat that! Breathtaking in its darkness.
9. One Flew Over the CucKoo's Nest - Jack gets it perfect. Ensemble is equally perfect. Well done justice to the Kensey book (always helps when the author works on the script).
10. A ClockWork Orange - Alex is decadence personified. Debauchery never looked so good.
11. MASH - As noted, I'm a big Altman fan, and this was his best. Great black comedy set in Korea, pointing fingers at the current (at the time) Vietnam War. Recommend viewing this one again, with what is going on now in our times.
12. Raiders of the Lost Ark - Greatest Adventure movie of all time.
13. Heathers - Can you tell I like my black comedies? Heathers nailed it. Too bad Lehmann hasn't been able to match this one since.
14. 2001 - Kubrick could do more without dialogue than anyone. Gorgeous film.
15. Traffic - Soderbergh's finest, in my opinion. Oscar stayed away...Shame on you!
16. Magnolia - Lots complained about the length of it...I was mesmerized throughout. Tom Cruise can act! Who knew?
17. Apocolypse Now - Anything based on "Heart of Darkness" must be good. No disappointments here.
18. The Godfather - Most like II better. I prefer the original. Call me nostalgic.
19. The Player - Altman's second best, in my opinion. Watch it for that opening shot alone. Brilliant.
20. To Have, and Have Not - I literally fell in love with Lauren Bacall when I first saw this at 12 years old. I also learned to whistle.
21. Fight Club - One of those, " I can't believe what I just saw" movies. Visually unique, and Pitt and Norton were flawless.
22. Schindler's List - I get goose bumps just writing about it.
23. Midnight Cowboy - You can't get that song out of your head now, can you?
24. Pulp Fiction- Come on! It's fucking Pulp Fiction!
25. Guess Who's Coming to Dinner? - Potier is/ was always one of my favorites. Controversial film for a controversial time.

chairmenmeow47
02-21-2007, 01:23 PM
9. One Flew Over the CucKoo's Nest - Jack gets it perfect. Ensemble is equally perfect. Well done justice to the Kensey book (always helps when the author works on the script).

see, i enjoyed the book SOOOOOOOO much more than the movie. i just didn't think it was right as a movie, there's too much narration. when you read it, you really get a feel for the hallucinations and the madness. plus, you could really tell kesey was doing acid back then ;)

i <3 kesey. someone needs to do a movie of the acid test!!! i could be a merry prankster :) just so long as i'm not mountain girl, cause i wouldn't want to get gang-banged by the hells angels.

schoolofruckus
02-21-2007, 01:49 PM
Sean, this Altman tribute piece (http://www.thereeler.com/features/the_long_goodbye_altman.php) may be of interest to you.

PotVsKtl
02-21-2007, 01:52 PM
Hey look, 25 American movies.

schoolofruckus
02-21-2007, 01:55 PM
You only have one foreign film on your list, bub.

PotVsKtl
02-21-2007, 01:57 PM
http://www.squirrelmuffins.com/pics/colorful-frown-(color).gif

amyzzz
02-21-2007, 01:59 PM
I can't pull 25 movies out of my ass. I'll wait until I get home and check my DVD collection.

downingthief
02-21-2007, 02:02 PM
Sean, this Altman tribute piece (http://www.thereeler.com/features/the_long_goodbye_altman.php) may be of interest to you.

Sweet. Thanks, Gabe.

mountmccabe
02-21-2007, 02:52 PM
Apocalypse Now
Blade Runner
2001: A Space Odyssey
Brazil
Das Boot
The Godfather
Casablanca
Pulp Fiction
Ran (Kurosawa)
Lawrence of Arabia
Monty Python and the Holy Grail
Days of Heaven
Andrei Rublev
This Is Spinal Tap
Punch Drunk Love
Nikita
The Big Lebowski
Wild Strawberries
Glengary Glen Ross
Citizen Kane
Trainspotting
Three Colors: Red
Raging Bull
The Fountain
The Cook, the Thief, His Wife and Her Lover


Is my second attempt at such a list. But I'm pretty sure I'm missing some stuff that should be on the list.

wmgaretjax
02-21-2007, 02:59 PM
Oh. I forgot about The Theif The cook The Wife and her Lover.... i might have to make some ammendments to my list later. good call. kudos on Andrei Rublev too.

mountmccabe
02-21-2007, 03:20 PM
Such a beautiful film. I was gonna clarify that I mean the former but it works for both.

And damn how I love Dekalog. I chickened out and disqualified it from this list, though.

randy ricochet
02-21-2007, 03:28 PM
Ok Mr Ruckus,

I am gonna test your film knowledge now...
I saw a film which was nominated for Cannes film award in 2002. It is french and focuses on a lad who has a rottweiller and uses it for illegal dog fights. There is also a supermodel that is involve in a car crash and loses her looks. Can you help?

schoolofruckus
02-21-2007, 03:47 PM
It's either "Amores Perros", which is a Mexican film and one of my all-time favorites, or a French rip off of "Amores Perros".

randy ricochet
02-21-2007, 03:55 PM
that's the fella, well done!
Its a great film and the bloke with the dog looks like me I was told!
Anyway if its one of your favourites, why is it not in your list?....does it beat Smokey and the bandit!!!?

schoolofruckus
02-21-2007, 03:57 PM
Read my list again. It's on there between City of God and Breaking the Waves.

wmgaretjax
02-21-2007, 03:59 PM
Such a beautiful film. I was gonna clarify that I mean the former but it works for both.

And damn how I love Dekalog. I chickened out and disqualified it from this list, though.

dekalog is kind of cheating... I mean, it really is 10 shorts... but I figured it would fly.

randy ricochet
02-21-2007, 04:03 PM
Read my list again. It's on there between City of God and Breaking the Waves.

Eh your not wrong kid!..we have something in common!!!!. Film taste ain't too bad I have to say however Edward Scissorhands!?..I'm thinking gaylord!!!!
Defo Godfather II though without a doubt

atom heart
02-21-2007, 04:04 PM
I can't even think of 25 movies I like, let alone love or respect enough to be honored with a list.

wmgaretjax
02-21-2007, 04:09 PM
that's because you've been watching too many american films.

schoolofruckus
02-21-2007, 04:10 PM
You should watch more movies.

Randy, I love "Edward Scissorhands". I only saw it 3 years ago, too, so I can't even pretend like it's some childhood favorite I won't let go of. I think it's one of the best - if not the single best - loner/outsider movies ever.

randy ricochet
02-21-2007, 04:10 PM
hey Schoolio. I have another film enquiry...
Ricky Schroeder who was John Voights son in the Champ was in a film about dares and killing etc which goes wrong. Do u know what that is?

randy ricochet
02-21-2007, 04:11 PM
Also 'fallen' is a very good film

schoolofruckus
02-21-2007, 04:17 PM
Randy, I don't know that one. I was looking up the titles of his movies on imdb and I couldn't finger one of them as being the movie you're talking about. Do you have any more specifics?

amyzzz
02-21-2007, 04:19 PM
I was searching on the nets for top lists of films to watch to help me remember my favorite movies (25 is a lot of movies!) when I came across a top 50 horror movie list with A LOT of movies I've never seen before on it. Now I wanna go out and rent me some horror flicks.

I'm trying to remember old movies I like because my list is rather top-heavy on the modern films. All my old movies are musicals.

randy ricochet
02-21-2007, 04:19 PM
I'll find it , hold on. You'll have to excuse me as i bit pissed after watching Liverpool (my team) beat Barcelona

chrislasf
02-21-2007, 04:21 PM
Some of these are on "prestigous" lists, some arent. These arent the most influential or iconic. Theyre just my favorites. And I cant bring myself to lop off Snatch so you get 26. Gabe, you can lop it off for your purposes if you need to.

1. City of God
2. All About My Mother
3. Requiem For A Dream
4. American Beauty
5. Amelie
6. The Usual Suspects
7. Reservoir Dogs
8. Bonnie & Clyde
9. Goodfellas
10.Kanal
11.American History X
12.Ferris Bueller’s Day Off
13.Stand By Me
14.The Goonies
15.Three Kings
16.Neverending Story
17.Se7en
18.The Princess Bride
19.The Station Agent
20.On The Waterfront
21.The Constant Gardener
22.Children Of Men
23.Swingers
24.Super Troopers
25.The Incredibles
26.Snatch

randy ricochet
02-21-2007, 04:23 PM
'What we did that night' Aka 'Murder at Devil's Glen'
It was on one night when i got inafter pub and it has an amzing ending. Those kind of unexpected endings are the best.....'The Sting' being one of the very first of that genre and still one of the best. What you reckon?

amyzzz
02-21-2007, 04:25 PM
Holy crap, Chris. I need to add a few of those to mine. Good calls on Neverending Story, Princess Bride, and Ferris Bueller's Day Off. Argh. Right now, my list is too heavy on epics a la star wars/braveheart/lord of the rings.
Oh shit! Stand By Me! Good one.

mountmccabe
02-21-2007, 04:25 PM
That's a strong list, whoever you are.

chrislasf
02-21-2007, 04:48 PM
That's a strong list, whoever you are.

Dont you worry Johnny Boy, I'm coming back. I am letting the tards tire themselves out first.

amyzzz
02-21-2007, 04:49 PM
Dont you worry Johnny Boy, I'm coming back. I am letting the tards tire themselves out first.
I thought maybe you were working hard.

schoolofruckus
02-21-2007, 05:30 PM
I don't understand why it's necessary to berate modern American films in order to celebrate films in general. There are lots of great foreign films; there are lots of great older films. There are also a significant amount of outstanding movies that were produced in America over the last 40 years, many of which are even connected to Hollywood.

That said, I'm recently starting to expand my explorations to a lot of the older foreign films. Problem is, I tend to not trust the recommendations of journalists/critics/scholars because I find myself disliking the films they cream over more often than not. So just like every other life problem, I turn to the board. Hook me up with some recommendations.

I've seen a couple Bergman films ("The Seventh Seal" and "The Virgin Spring") and I thought they were both unsubtle, dull, and too quaint with the heavy-handed Christianity; "Virgin Spring" was not quite as much of any of these thigns, and could have avoided my dislike if not for the father's curious decision to dedicate a church to the Lord in the final scene.

I've seen one Godard ("Breathless"), and I was mezzo-mezzo on it; not blown away, but I enjoyed it.

I've seen two Kurosawas - "Ran" was a very narrow exclusion from my top 25 (largely because I have yet to rewatch it), but "Rashomon" was submarined by Toshiro Mifune's performance, in my mind. I know I need to get "Seven Samurai" and the like.

I watched part one of "The Human Condition". I loved it, and I'd like to watch the other two, but it's hard to find 10 hours straight to devote to Japanese movies with poor audio and video transfers - call me unsophisticated if you like, but I have to get myself in a certain mental state to devour movies like this. Similarly, I watched "Kanal" during Chris's and my movie geek day (the sequel is in development), and that was terrific; we still have two more films in that trilogy to hit up.

And even though they're not old, I aspire to see more movies from the Dardenne Brothers. I saw "L' Enfant" about a month ago and I thought it was fucking excellent. I want to see "The Son" and "Rosetta" and "The Promise" and whatever else I can find by them, but their stuff is curiously hard to find in my neighborhood. Same goes for Michelangelo Antonioni, whose "Blow-Up" was incredible; my 20/20 Video place, which has a pretty good selection, dosen't seem to have L'Avventura or L'Eclisse or much of his other stuff. One of these days I'll head down to Rocket Video and subscribe, but I don't like the idea of having to drive 30 minutes just to rent a movie.

I've always wanted to see "Shoot the Piano Player". And based on John and garetjx and Pot singing the praises of "Andrei Rublev", I'll have to throw that one on there as well.

So what else do you recommend?

bmack86
02-21-2007, 05:41 PM
Gabe, I really liked Yojimbo by Kurosawa. It's a helluva film. Also, Masculin/Feminin by Godard was pretty good. I've seen that and Bande A Part, and both were entertaining, but didn't blow me away. I love Bergman films tho. The Seventh Seal was really entertaining for me, and Winter Light is amazing; one of the starkest movies i've ever watched. I've yet to check out the Fellini's that I got for my birthday and Christmas, but they seem like some more enjoyable movies.

atom heart
02-21-2007, 06:00 PM
Believe me, I'm working on it. My friend works for a Landmark theatre so I can get in for free as long as I give him a heads up. I've seen Lady Vengeance, Tideland, both of which were really disturbing, Children of Men, which is the best movie I've seen IMO, and I skipped Pan's Labyrinth because it was Sunday morning and it didn't seem like the right time to see that movie.

Mmmm... then there was Running with Scissors, which was basically a hipster fest and nothing else, and Little Miss Sunshine which I really liked. Those are all the movies I can think of off the top of my head that I've seen in the past year or so.

bmack86
02-21-2007, 06:01 PM
Lady Vengeance was really good, but my least favorite of that "trilogy" of sorts

atom heart
02-21-2007, 06:07 PM
It was good, but I can't say I liked it.

After it was over I practically staggered out of the theatre and I felt like I needed a huge slab of pearly white redemptive tofu and a long swim in the ocean to get the sick feeling out of me. It's not a pretty picture, but I suppose it did what it set out to do.

bmack86
02-21-2007, 06:12 PM
I felt like the other ones were more intense, except for the ending. I really liked Sympathy for Mr. Vengeance

PotVsKtl
02-21-2007, 06:19 PM
Andrei Rublev
M
Seven Samurai
Aguirre: The Wrath of God
Night of the Living Dead
Bringing Up Baby
Leon
Blue Velvet
Nausicaa of the Valley of the Wind
All About Lily Chou-Chou
Kids
City of Lost Children
McCabe & Mrs Miller
Pandora's Box
Drowning By Numbers
Hedwig & the Angry Inch
A Fistful of Dollars
Blue
Naked
Secretary
Taxi Driver
Eight Diagram Pole Fighter
In the Mood for Love
Aliens
Lilya 4-Ever

wmgaretjax
02-21-2007, 06:20 PM
modern american film CAN be good, but anyone who has more than 50% of their favorite films as American needs to expand their horizons. That said, I have some suggests. You'll like some, not others, if you see something you like, check out a lot of their films:

Dardenne brothers - The Son

Tarkovsky - Solaris, Andrei Rublev, Stalker

Kieslowski - Decalogue, Three Colors Trilogy, Double Life of Veronique

Bela Tarr - Werckmeister Harmonies, Damnation, Satantango (if you can get a hold of it, no region 1 printing, but it's making the rounds at art theaters)

Robert Bresson - Pickpocket, Diary of a Country Priest

Godard - Weekend, Masculin Feminin, Vivre Sa Vie, Alphaville

Bergman - Cries and Whispers

Truffaut - 400 Blows, Stolen Kisses

Fellini - 8 1/2, Juliet of the Spirits, La Strada

Ozu - Tokyo Story, Story of the floating weeds, Late Autumn

Mizoguchi - Ugetsu

Malle - Au Revoir les Enfants, Lacombe Lucien

Pasolini - Salo, Decameron

Renoir - Rules of the Game, Grand Illusion, The River

Eric Rohmer - Boyfriends and Girlfriends, Claire's Knee

Bertolucci - The Conformist, Last Tango in Paris

Tim Roth - The War Zone

Sokurov - Mother and Son, Russian Arc

Polanski - Knife in the Water

Claude Berri - Manon des Sources, Jean de Florette

Rene Clement - Purple Noon

Clouzot - Wages of Fear, Diabolique

Peter Greenway - The Cook, The Thief, His Wife, and Her Lover, The Falls

That's what I have off the top of my head. I can add more later once I'm home with my DVDs/lists.

atom heart
02-21-2007, 06:31 PM
City of Lost Children. Now that is a trippy movie. It also has the weirdest cause-effect chain of all time.

schoolofruckus
02-21-2007, 06:43 PM
Thank you, garetjax. That's perfect.

The only one of those I've seen is "Last Tango in Paris". I love the film - Brando's performance is possibly the best I've ever seen - but I don't care for the girl or her segments in the film. The only other Bertolucci I've seen is "The Dreamers", and I loved that one as well.

chrislasf
02-21-2007, 06:58 PM
modern american film CAN be good, but anyone who has more than 50% of their favorite films as American needs to expand their horizons

I think anyone who hasnt seen some foreign films..... needs to see some foreign films. That being said, I have seen a hell of a lot of foreign and over my half my list remains American. My top two happen to be foreign but the fact that a majority of my list is American does not suggest my horizons are not expanded.

schoolofruckus
02-21-2007, 06:59 PM
There are also a lot of good recent foreign films that I didn't include on my list. "The Princess + the Warrior". "Amelie" & "City of Lost Children". All the Park Chan-wook films (although I was heavily disappointed by "Lady Vengeance", it's still very good; "OldBoy" and "JSA" are Hall of Fame). "The Death of Mr. Lazarescu" was terrific. All the Wong Kar-Wai stuff that I've seen is wonderful - "Fallen Angels" is my favorite, followed by "2046" and "In the Mood For Love" and "Chungking Express". "The Lives of Others" was great. "All About My Mother". "Audition". "Tsotsi". "The Element of Crime". "Hana-bi" ("Fireworks"). "Life is Beautiful" - fuck the acceptance speech. The movie was great.

schoolofruckus
02-21-2007, 07:01 PM
I think anyone who hasnt seen some foreign films..... needs to see some foreign films. That being said, I have seen a hell of a lot of foreign and over my half my list remains American. My top two happen to be foreign but the fact that a majority of my list is American does not suggest my horizons are not expanded.

I agree entirely with this sentiment. If I wanted to appear more fashionable, I could have listed more foreign films, but I went with what means the most to me.

mountmccabe
02-21-2007, 07:10 PM
There are also a lot of good recent foreign films that I didn't include on my list. "The Princess + the Warrior". "Amelie" & "City of Lost Children". All the Park Chan-wook films (although I was heavily disappointed by "Lady Vengeance", it's still very good; "OldBoy" and "JSA" are Hall of Fame). "The Death of Mr. Lazarescu" was terrific. All the Wong Kar-Wai stuff that I've seen is wonderful - "Fallen Angels" is my favorite, followed by "2046" and "In the Mood For Love" and "Chungking Express". "The Lives of Others" was great. "All About My Mother". "Audition". "Tsotsi". "The Element of Crime". "Hana-bi" ("Fireworks"). "Life is Beautiful" - fuck the acceptance speech. The movie was great.

Dammit, I've only seen one of those. Oh, Life is Beautiful too. I actually kinda enjoyed Alien Resurrection because it was Jeunet.

Andrei Rublev is gorgeous and long and a little slow. Solyaris is very long and very slow. Both are stunning, though.

And also Fellini for the win.

wmgaretjax
02-21-2007, 07:10 PM
I agree about Brando's performance, his only better one is in "On the Waterfront."

"The Conformist" is one of the best films of all time. It's a tough one to get a hold on, but it was shamelessly held by Universal for years and just got a release in December. I highly recommend checking it out.

I can totally understand that American films resonate most with Americans (I am American, but I've spent most of my life overseas in asia), seems reasonable to me.

If you like Park's films, you should check out some of Miike's stuff (I love Audition), there is also a trio of shorts they did together called Three Extremes that's really good.

schoolofruckus
02-21-2007, 07:25 PM
Yeah, Jennie and I picked up "Three Extremes" at a cheap sale at Blockbuster one time. Just haven't gotten around to watching it.

As far as Miike goes, I've seen "Audition" and one other one that I can't remember the title of. I think I saw part of "Ichi the Killer" and it was fucking hysterical.

"Suicide Circle" was a Japansploitation film. It was shitty - excessive gore in the name of half-baked "social commentary". I did, however, love "Battle Royale". I thought it was a terrific indictment of academic/institutional competition.

downingthief
02-21-2007, 07:32 PM
Some of these are on "prestigous" lists, some arent. These arent the most influential or iconic. Theyre just my favorites. And I cant bring myself to lop off Snatch so you get 26. Gabe, you can lop it off for your purposes if you need to.

1. City of God
2. All About My Mother
3. Requiem For A Dream
4. American Beauty
5. Amelie
6. The Usual Suspects
7. Reservoir Dogs
8. Bonnie & Clyde
9. Goodfellas
10.Kanal
11.American History X
12.Ferris Bueller’s Day Off
13.Stand By Me
14.The Goonies
15.Three Kings
16.Neverending Story
17.Se7en
18.The Princess Bride
19.The Station Agent
20.On The Waterfront
21.The Constant Gardener
22.Children Of Men
23.Swingers
24.Super Troopers
25.The Incredibles
26.Snatch

Solid List. Many of these would easily be on my next 25.

jerpar24
02-21-2007, 09:23 PM
With all this talk about foreign movies I am surprised that The Bicycle Thief has not been mentioned. That is one of my Favorite classic/foreign films.

wmgaretjax
02-21-2007, 09:43 PM
"Bicycle Thieves" is an extraordinary film. It actually just received a brand new criterion work over. I just watched it last night, it's a fantastic print.

fatbastard
02-21-2007, 10:40 PM
modern american film CAN be good, but anyone who has more than 50% of their favorite films as American needs to expand their horizons. That said, I have some suggests. You'll like some, not others, if you see something you like, check out a lot of their films:

Dardenne brothers - The Son

Tarkovsky - Solaris, Andrei Rublev, Stalker

Kieslowski - Decalogue, Three Colors Trilogy, Double Life of Veronique

Bela Tarr - Werckmeister Harmonies, Damnation, Satantango (if you can get a hold of it, no region 1 printing, but it's making the rounds at art theaters)

Robert Bresson - Pickpocket, Diary of a Country Priest

Godard - Weekend, Masculin Feminin, Vivre Sa Vie, Alphaville

Bergman - Cries and Whispers

Truffaut - 400 Blows, Stolen Kisses

Fellini - 8 1/2, Juliet of the Spirits, La Strada

Ozu - Tokyo Story, Story of the floating weeds, Late Autumn

Mizoguchi - Ugetsu

Malle - Au Revoir les Enfants, Lacombe Lucien

Pasolini - Salo, Decameron

Renoir - Rules of the Game, Grand Illusion, The River

Eric Rohmer - Boyfriends and Girlfriends, Claire's Knee

Bertolucci - The Conformist, Last Tango in Paris

Tim Roth - The War Zone

Sokurov - Mother and Son, Russian Arc

Polanski - Knife in the Water

Claude Berri - Manon des Sources, Jean de Florette

Rene Clement - Purple Noon

Clouzot - Wages of Fear, Diabolique

Peter Greenway - The Cook, The Thief, His Wife, and Her Lover, The Falls

That's what I have off the top of my head. I can add more later once I'm home with my DVDs/lists.

Wow. Criterion Junkie. I have a cassette of an interview with Kieslowski on KCRW. He seemed like a nice little old man ( a twisted little old man).

fatbastard
02-21-2007, 10:42 PM
With all this talk about foreign movies I am surprised that The Bicycle Thief has not been mentioned. That is one of my Favorite classic/foreign films.

Did you like Cinema Paradiso? If so, long version or short version?

fatbastard
02-21-2007, 10:48 PM
I'm halfway (i.e., still capable of driving, probably not capable of coherent conversation) drunk right now, so please forgive the following review.

Earlier this evening, I watched "Factory Girl", a portrait of one-time Warhol "It Girl" Edie Sedgwick. I thought it was a fantastic movie that slightly suffered from a lackluster ending.

Basically, Edie Sedgwick was a girl from a very rich, prominent American family who, in lieu of capitalizing on her own artistic talents, became the face of Andy Warhol's self-created empire of lost souls. And let me tell you, Sienna Miller - formerly best known as Jude Law's cheated-on ex-girlfriend - plays her swinging for the fences. She gets inside Edie and turns her sadness and emptiness into a Brando-(not to be confused with Brandon :)-esque performance. I'm not going to be able to do this justice right now, but she is flat-out fucking brilliant, taking Edie from her damaged, trust-fund beginnings at the Cambridge School of the Arts to her career pinnacle as the face of "The Factory" - a loft in which Warhol makes ordinary confused people into individual art projects - to a tragic end at the age of 28. Director George Hickenlooper - who made the fantastic Rodney Bingenheimer documentary "The Mayor of the Sunset Strip" - captures the hedonism and emptiness of Warhol World with poignancy and authenticity, and he's aided by a cadre of recognizable, skilled actors playing historical characters of various significance. After Sienna, the film belongs to Guy Pearce (whose Warhol is a model of self-deprecation-gone-wrong) and Hayden Christensen (who does the finest work of his career as a Bob Dylan stand-in who romances Edie until the point he realizes she will never break free of Warhol's grasp). The centerpiece of "Factory Girl" is a Pantheon-level scene in which Dylan is invited to The Factory to stand as the subject of a new Warhol film, and ends up exposing Warhol (to the audience, if nothing else) for the overrated parasite that he is. I'm a fan of Andy Warhol's work, to be sure, but I found this vampire portrayal of him to somehow make complete and perfect sense.

"Factory Girl" is eventually undone by a lazy ending that breaks some of my most hallowed rules for film denouement - namely, don't tell me the ending of a story via subtitles, and don't have interviews about your film's subject as the closing credits roll - but it's not offensive enough to spoil the film's significant accomplishments. It's still one of the best films of (technically) 2006, and one that anyone with a desire to feel the cruelty of fleeting fame should seek out immediately.

Wow. I was going to pass on this one. The New York times had made a comment that Edie fans would not get anything new and newcomers would wonder what the big deal was about her. I'm still scared that the movie will not do the book justice. This commentary is making think twice.

KungFuJoe
02-21-2007, 11:55 PM
I felt like the other ones were more intense, except for the ending. I really liked Sympathy for Mr. Vengeance

My favorite by Park. I effing love this film. yeah, Oldboy was great. JSA was great. But Sympathy for Mr. Vengeance? WOW! I was blown away the first time I saw this (it was my first Chan Wook Park experience. Midnight show) Granted, it's not for everyone. It's a grinder. Possibly the best Tragedy film I've ever seen. It reaches Hitchcock proportions. Awesome!



As for old foreign films, Gabe. I highly reccomend Jean Renoir's "Rules of the Game". This is one of my all time favorites. It's on my top 5.

L'Atalante by Jean Vigo is worth checking out too.

randy ricochet
02-22-2007, 04:39 AM
In no particular order -

1. Godfather II
2. Goodfellas
3. 12 Days Later
4. Amorres Perros
5. Lock Stock & 2 Smoking Barrels
6. The Sting
7. Enter the Dragon
8. Wicker Man
9. Taxi II
10. Convoy
11. Apocolypse Now
12. Porkys
13. Leon
14. Usual Suspects
15. Football Factory
16. The Firm
17. Twelve Monkeys
18. Butch Cassidy & The Sundance Kid
19. Unforgiven
20. Taxi Driver
21. Chopper
22. Romper Stomper
23. Carry On At Your Convenience
24. Hard Days Night
25. Sexy Beast

randy ricochet
02-22-2007, 04:43 AM
Oh....and 'Scum'
.."Where's your fackin tool?.....what fackin tool?.....This fackin tool you cant!!!...the bollocks!

breakjaw
02-22-2007, 04:49 AM
A couple of recommendations:
From Kurosawa,one that's not often shown but is great:
High and Low
An unforgettable kidnap tale and one of Kurosawa's few movies set in the present-day.
And two comedies by the genius Jacques Tati:
Monsieur Hulot's Holiday and Playtime
Also has anyone mentioned King of Hearts on here?

downingthief
02-22-2007, 06:09 AM
I don't understand why it's necessary to berate modern American films in order to celebrate films in general. There are lots of great foreign films; there are lots of great older films. There are also a significant amount of outstanding movies that were produced in America over the last 40 years, many of which are even connected to Hollywood.

That said, I'm recently starting to expand my explorations to a lot of the older foreign films. Problem is, I tend to not trust the recommendations of journalists/critics/scholars because I find myself disliking the films they cream over more often than not. So just like every other life problem, I turn to the board. Hook me up with some recommendations.

I've seen a couple Bergman films ("The Seventh Seal" and "The Virgin Spring") and I thought they were both unsubtle, dull, and too quaint with the heavy-handed Christianity; "Virgin Spring" was not quite as much of any of these thigns, and could have avoided my dislike if not for the father's curious decision to dedicate a church to the Lord in the final scene.

I've seen one Godard ("Breathless"), and I was mezzo-mezzo on it; not blown away, but I enjoyed it.

I've seen two Kurosawas - "Ran" was a very narrow exclusion from my top 25 (largely because I have yet to rewatch it), but "Rashomon" was submarined by Toshiro Mifune's performance, in my mind. I know I need to get "Seven Samurai" and the like.

I watched part one of "The Human Condition". I loved it, and I'd like to watch the other two, but it's hard to find 10 hours straight to devote to Japanese movies with poor audio and video transfers - call me unsophisticated if you like, but I have to get myself in a certain mental state to devour movies like this. Similarly, I watched "Kanal" during Chris's and my movie geek day (the sequel is in development), and that was terrific; we still have two more films in that trilogy to hit up.

And even though they're not old, I aspire to see more movies from the Dardenne Brothers. I saw "L' Enfant" about a month ago and I thought it was fucking excellent. I want to see "The Son" and "Rosetta" and "The Promise" and whatever else I can find by them, but their stuff is curiously hard to find in my neighborhood. Same goes for Michelangelo Antonioni, whose "Blow-Up" was incredible; my 20/20 Video place, which has a pretty good selection, dosen't seem to have L'Avventura or L'Eclisse or much of his other stuff. One of these days I'll head down to Rocket Video and subscribe, but I don't like the idea of having to drive 30 minutes just to rent a movie.

I've always wanted to see "Shoot the Piano Player". And based on John and garetjx and Pot singing the praises of "Andrei Rublev", I'll have to throw that one on there as well.

So what else do you recommend?


Gabe, did you ever see "In the Realm of the Senses"? It is a Japanese film, made in the 70's. Quite possibly THE most erotic movie ever made.

Also...completely agree on "The Seventh Seal". I had a film teacher back in the day that loved this movie, and would reference it constantly. I could never understand why.

amyzzz
02-22-2007, 06:27 AM
I know I'm going to regret this immediately after I post it, but....

in no order:

1 The Wizard of Oz
2 Empire Strikes Back
3 Aliens
4 Heavenly Creatures
5 Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers
6 The Exorcist
7 My Fair Lady
8 West Side Story
9 Amelie
10 The Fountain
11 Stand By Me
12 Trainspotting
13 Almost Famous
14 Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind
15 Philadelphia
16 Lost Highway
17 Spirited Away
18 Signs
19 Velvet Goldmine
20 The Shawshank Redemption
21 City of God
22 A Scanner Darkly
23 The Princess Bride
24 Bringing Up Baby
25 Moulin Rouge - Baz Luhrmann <sp?>

breakjaw
02-22-2007, 07:05 AM
I know I'm going to regret this immediately after I post it, but....

in no order:


2 Empire Strikes Back
3 Aliens

5 Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers
<sp?>
I am wholeheartedly in agreement about these and I often think the 2nd in a trilogy is the best (Indiana Jones excepted,although now it's going to be a quadrilogy) including Back To The Future,(when Biff becomes the megalomaniacal mogul) and Evil Dead 2 (Evil Dead was too low budget and Army of Darkness too over the top).
And of course Godfather 2!

amyzzz
02-22-2007, 07:36 AM
I left the list I made last night at work, and I already regret leaving out Trainspotting, Monty Python & the Holy Grail, and Lost Highway. FUCK.

schoolofruckus
02-22-2007, 07:47 AM
I am wholeheartedly in agreement about these and I often think the 2nd in a trilogy is the best (Indiana Jones excepted,although now it's going to be a quadrilogy) including Back To The Future,(when Biff becomes the megalomaniacal mogul) and Evil Dead 2 (Evil Dead was too low budget and Army of Darkness too over the top).
And of course Godfather 2!

When movies become trilogies, the second film is often the best of the lot. I would add "Terminator 2" and "The Matrix Reloaded" to this as well. Though I actually think "The Two Towers" is by far the worst Lord of the Rings movie. I have never been a fan of Gollum in those movies, and this being his first significant presence really threw me the fuck off as I was watching. Treebeards almost redeemed it, but not quite.


My favorite by Park. I effing love this film. yeah, Oldboy was great. JSA was great. But Sympathy for Mr. Vengeance? WOW! I was blown away the first time I saw this (it was my first Chan Wook Park experience. Midnight show) Granted, it's not for everyone. It's a grinder. Possibly the best Tragedy film I've ever seen. It reaches Hitchcock proportions. Awesome!

I couldn't agree more. That movie took the wind out of me. I think it's the finest example of objective storytelling, and the most brutal depiction of humanity, I've ever witnessed.

I've never seen "Rules of the Game" or "Playtime" or "In the Realm of the Senses". They go on the list.

fatbastard, I knew little about Warhol (it's been years since I've done any research) and nothing about Edie before the movie. I think it's worth seeing for the acting alone.

Courtney
02-22-2007, 07:50 AM
Andrei Rublev
M
Seven Samurai
Aguirre: The Wrath of God
Night of the Living Dead
Bringing Up Baby
Leon
Blue Velvet
Nausicaa of the Valley of the Wind
All About Lily Chou-Chou
Kids
City of Lost Children
McCabe & Mrs Miller
Pandora's Box
Drowning By Numbers
Hedwig & the Angry Inch
A Fistful of Dollars
Blue
Naked
Secretary
Taxi Driver
Eight Diagram Pole Fighter
In the Mood for Love
Aliens
Lilya 4-Ever

This is a good list, but I'm a little worried about your mental health.

amyzzz
02-22-2007, 07:52 AM
When movies become trilogies, the second film is often the best of the lot. I would add "Terminator 2" and "The Matrix Reloaded" to this as well. Though I actually think "The Two Towers" is by far the worst Lord of the Rings movie. I have never been a fan of Gollum in those movies, and this being his first significant presence really threw me the fuck off as I was watching. Treebeards almost redeemed it, but not quite.

Gollum was one of the main reasons why I chose The Two Towers. I also dug the big-ass fight scene at Helm's Deep and the introduction of the Ents.

I respectfully disagree about the Matrix Reloaded. I like the Matrix AND ONLY the Matrix of that trilogy. But I'll give you Terminator 2. Excellent movie.